Bolsterstone Owl Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 What do people think is a reasonable wage per week for a third division footballer. I say 2k a week. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalworthOwl Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 12 minutes ago, @owlstalk said: Imagine trying to defend the grotesque way football has gone though as some have tried to in this thread Imagine that I wouldn't say I've tried to defend the way football has gone. I've just pointed out, along with others, that football clubs are run in the same way as any other business. (Of course football clubs aren't like any other business, that's why this is an important discussion, but the law and the motivation of owners is similar for any business.) I certainly think the German model is interesting, and I'm sorry that fan-owned clubs haven't done better. OK maybe I did defend the way football has gone a bit; I pointed out that average attendances, in all English divisions, are now much bigger than they were before the Premier League. Anybody who wants a change like salary caps introduced has to explain why "the grotesque way football has gone" seems to have made it more popular. Average attendances of the top four divisions in England in 2019/20: 39,349 18,585 8,753 4,664 (average attendance not including covid-closed games) Average attendances of the top four divisions in England in 1991/92: 21,662 10,525 5,442 3,404 (Last year before PL) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 Just now, WalworthOwl said: I wouldn't say I've tried to defend the way football has gone. I wasn't referring to yourself mate Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willie Henderson Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 1 hour ago, WalworthOwl said: It is a bit rubbish, but it's the same for (almost) all clubs. And what's the alternative for Chansiri? Letting go the current players and signing a new team who accept less than half the wages would improve the accounts for a year, but I don't think it would be good for the league position... It's a fair point, once you're on the hamster wheel thinking you're on the way to the promised land of the Premier League I guess you can't get off. Until the EFL take it away from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 1 hour ago, @owlstalk said: I wasn't referring to yourself mate I’m more than happy to defend they way football has gone…..better players, better facilities, bigger crowds attending games, infinitely more media coverage and access to players and clubs, the best league in the world…..how can you think that is not defendable. and to be honest it’s no one’s business how much agents earn other than the players and clubs who pay them….it’s not like there’s a supporter levy on ticket prices to pay them directly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 7 minutes ago, Ian said: and to be honest it’s no one’s business how much agents earn other than the players and clubs who pay them….it’s not like there’s a supporter levy on ticket prices to pay them directly oh but there is Its called the ticket price Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevthelodgemoorowl Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 7 hours ago, Supersiggi2 said: It's all Johnny Hayne's fault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 24 minutes ago, @owlstalk said: oh but there is Its called the ticket price Suppose it depends on if you judge by price or value....appreciate we all judge differently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 Just now, Ian said: Suppose it depends on if you judge by price or value....appreciate we all judge differently WTF Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalworthOwl Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 44 minutes ago, Ian said: I’m more than happy to defend they way football has gone…..better players, better facilities, bigger crowds attending games, infinitely more media coverage and access to players and clubs, the best league in the world…..how can you think that is not defendable. Agree that all those things are big positives, but there are potential negatives too. The sense of community and history is a massive part of following football. I live in London and I've watched more Premiership games than Wednesday games so far this year, but going to Portsmouth was the best experience because of that great crowd and the attitude of the players. So far I think the huge money that's gone into football hasn't broken the link between clubs and places, but that possibility is worrying. As is the possibility of more bankrupt clubs, and also the finances of taking kids to games. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevthelodgemoorowl Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 What are the income streams ? Gate Money capital investment by Owners/Partners Sponsorship Media Advertising Corporate purchase Merchandise All this and more ultimately ends up in the players pockets in three ways. Player wages Agents fees reinvestments by the club How does Crouch propose to divert these income streams away from player wages at the top end towards a fairer system of sustainability ? Your guess is probably better than mine. Feel free to suggest proposals ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelerian Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 Please excuse the simple nature of this post. It may sound daft. But... What are the legalities of the EPL and EFL, etc introducing salary caps per player/team? Someone mentioned already, these are leagues that clubs choose to play in. No one is forcing the clubs to play in these leagues. And no one is forcing the players to play for these clubs. So if the league said that the rules of participation in these leagues are X salary cap, clubs can choose to take part or not. Just as I'm sure every league has rules at every level of the game. Is this different to restriction of trade laws, or whatever employment laws exist? Someone please explain that to me, because I've never understood it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inspector Lestrade Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 10 hours ago, jp1981 said: Aren't FIFA looking at changing the amount agent's can ask for and regulating them? Should shoot the buggers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WalworthOwl Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 41 minutes ago, steelerian said: Please excuse the simple nature of this post. It may sound daft. But... What are the legalities of the EPL and EFL, etc introducing salary caps per player/team? Simple question but really complicated answer. Lawyers would certainly try to overturn it. That is one reason why governing bodies only talk about caps per team, not a maximum wage. The governing bodies would argue that salary caps are a way to ensure sustainability and maintain good incomes for all the players, the players would argue that their wages were being unfairly held down and should be set by the market like everyone else's. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherlyegg Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 Well if lady foookin ga ga can get £2m per show...footballers are under paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minesapint Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 I think because we are football fans we look at this issue in isolation. If you look around at other sports players or perhaps musicians you will see that the faces if the product are the ones that earn the money and that is determined by how much money is generated. In footballing terms the Premier league in particular is a worldwide generator of money and therefore the players are paid accordingly. Im not saying they are not overpaid merely pointing out that is how this type of business works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minesapint Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 1 hour ago, steelerian said: Please excuse the simple nature of this post. It may sound daft. But... What are the legalities of the EPL and EFL, etc introducing salary caps per player/team? Someone mentioned already, these are leagues that clubs choose to play in. No one is forcing the clubs to play in these leagues. And no one is forcing the players to play for these clubs. So if the league said that the rules of participation in these leagues are X salary cap, clubs can choose to take part or not. Just as I'm sure every league has rules at every level of the game. Is this different to restriction of trade laws, or whatever employment laws exist? Someone please explain that to me, because I've never understood it? The issue with player caps is that unless it is applied universally it will penalise the football association that implements it. Can you imagine the successful clubs such as Liverpool Chelsea Man City being happy with being told what they can play there players while they are attempting to attract players who have other payment arrangements in Spain Germany etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lawrie’s Left Peg Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 11 hours ago, @owlstalk said: IF players were no longer paid millions and millions IF agents weren't given millions and millions or even better eradicated entirely IF the PFA Negotiated a deal for the players where they're paid a nice sum but not eyewatering figures IF advisors weren't given millions and millions to advise who to sign etc And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onlyonedavidhirst Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 11 hours ago, @owlstalk said: In for a fiver, and player wages down to reasonable levels and the product/game is exactly the same but without ordinary working men handing over their wages to millionaires and millionaire agents and advisors Can you imagine trying to get away tickets if it was in for a fiver. Everyone in the top tier would be purchasing every match regardless of their intention to go - oh wait, that's pretty much happening now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 5 hours ago, @owlstalk said: WTF You don’t understand…..explains a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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