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Premier League 21/22


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17 hours ago, bigash_swfc said:

 

The best choice of what they've got what mate

Disagree. Best players, without a doubt, but not the best team. 

 

 

De Gea

 

AWB

Maguire

Varane/Lindelof

Shaw

 

Matic/Fred

McTominay

Fernandes

 

Sancho

Ronaldo

Rashford/Martial

 

4-3-3 in the main, maybe switching to a diamond with another CM

 

Fred

McTominay 

DVB

Fernandes 

 

I'd be looking to shift Pogba on ASAP 

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5 hours ago, fudge27 said:

Disagree. Best players, without a doubt, but not the best team. 

 

 

De Gea

 

AWB

Maguire

Varane/Lindelof

Shaw

 

Matic/Fred

McTominay

Fernandes

 

Sancho

Ronaldo

Rashford/Martial

 

4-3-3 in the main, maybe switching to a diamond with another CM

 

Fred

McTominay 

DVB

Fernandes 

 

I'd be looking to shift Pogba on ASAP 

 

Matic is the slowest midfielder in the league.

 

Whilst a brilliant player in his day, he's completely done.

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7 hours ago, bigash_swfc said:

 

Matic is the slowest midfielder in the league.

 

Whilst a brilliant player in his day, he's completely done.

I agree his best days are behind him, same as I don't rate Fred. But they need someone to hold. 

 

Lik I said I'd be shifting Pogba on, as well as Lingard and Martial or Rashford and bringing in a CDM

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15 hours ago, owlinexile said:

Ronaldo will play wherever Ronaldo feels like playing. 

 

Man Utd have looked much better without him this season.

Despite his greatness, he does present issues for whoever is in charge. 

 

Many top teams like to play with a high press and yet you can't do that with Ronnie in the side. 

 

With him being a guaranteed starter too, you are going to have drop one of the other attacking talents. On Sunday, it was Pogba who made way, but it could quite easily be Rashford, Greenwood. Heck, Sancho can't even get a start at present. 

 

Seems ridiculous to question whether a guy who will likely score between 20 and 30 goals this season actually makes a team better, but here we are. 

 

 

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, fudge27 said:

I agree his best days are behind him, same as I don't rate Fred. But they need someone to hold. 

 

Lik I said I'd be shifting Pogba on, as well as Lingard and Martial or Rashford and bringing in a CDM

 

Ole goes before Pogba, I believe. There's no doubting he's one of the most talented midfielders in the world, it's just getting it out of him. 

 

If Ole can't, maybe a Conte can. 

 

Ronaldo is the main problem, work rate and pressing is the number one requirement at a top 6 club, he's unable to do it.

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22 hours ago, bigash_swfc said:

 

Ole goes before Pogba, I believe. There's no doubting he's one of the most talented midfielders in the world, it's just getting it out of him. 

 

If Ole can't, maybe a Conte can. 

 

Ronaldo is the main problem, work rate and pressing is the number one requirement at a top 6 club, he's unable to do it.

 

Not sure that's entirely true. Messi and Ronaldo still enjoyed success in La Liga and the Champions league 2015-2018 when their work rate in terms of pressing had diminished.

It may be argued that the speed and intensity of the PL means a higher work-rate is needed but it is still possible to have a goal scorer who doesn't press if the overall shape or approach of the team is right.

 

The problem with Man Utd is they don't seem to have a proper tactical approach and just rely on their stars to do the business.

 

That can work in many games but when push comes to shove for the major honours they will fall short. Having 4 players who don't really press with regular intensity or work back effectively at home to the best attack in the division at the moment was footballing suicide. 

It's not just Ronaldo not pressing/working back. Greenwood, Rashford and Fernandes high up the pitch leaving the two defensive midfielders isolated, and they are not the best. It is no coincidence that they don't keep clean sheets and concede lots of chances with this approach, it's like basketball.  

 

Liverpool have a front 3 that work much harder but also have a midfield 3 that are solid but can also pass forward effectively. Henderson has been much maligned by some but is a far more effective player than Fred or McTominay. 

 

Chelsea have players that won't track back, press all day in attack, Lukaku can be a beast when the ball comes to him but won't press intensely all game. They don't have 4 players up top like that though and they do have some of the best holding midfielders in the world who can also play effectively with the ball in Kante and Jorginho.

 

Man City have a work ethic all over the pitch whoever they pick, they won't pick a side with 4 who don't track back or press in big games.   

 

 

 

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22 minutes ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

Not sure that's entirely true. Messi and Ronaldo still enjoyed success in La Liga and the Champions league 2015-2018 when their work rate in terms of pressing had diminished.

It may be argued that the speed and intensity of the PL means a higher work-rate is needed but it is still possible to have a goal scorer who doesn't press if the overall shape or approach of the team is right.

 

The problem with Man Utd is they don't seem to have a proper tactical approach and just rely on their stars to do the business.

 

That can work in many games but when push comes to shove for the major honours they will fall short. Having 4 players who don't really press with regular intensity or work back effectively at home to the best attack in the division at the moment was footballing suicide. 

It's not just Ronaldo not pressing/working back. Greenwood, Rashford and Fernandes high up the pitch leaving the two defensive midfielders isolated, and they are not the best. It is no coincidence that they don't keep clean sheets and concede lots of chances with this approach, it's like basketball.  

 

Liverpool have a front 3 that work much harder but also have a midfield 3 that are solid but can also pass forward effectively. Henderson has been much maligned by some but is a far more effective player than Fred or McTominay. 

 

Chelsea have players that won't track back, press all day in attack, Lukaku can be a beast when the ball comes to him but won't press intensely all game. They don't have 4 players up top like that though and they do have some of the best holding midfielders in the world who can also play effectively with the ball in Kante and Jorginho.

 

Man City have a work ethic all over the pitch whoever they pick, they won't pick a side with 4 who don't track back or press in big games.   

 

I agree it's not just Ronaldo, but he's the focal point of the team and will receive the most stick.

 

BBC have picked up on this, 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59055179

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1 minute ago, bigash_swfc said:

 

I agree it's not just Ronaldo, but he's the focal point of the team and will receive the most stick.

 

BBC have picked up on this, 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59055179

 

Said it earlier in the thread, he's purely a goal scorer now, the limited number of touches is not a surprise, he doesn't drop deep and get involved in the build up like Messi does. They should have known what they were getting, maybe they did but the shirt sales and attention that he brings to the club was enough to sign him.

 

He could still be very effective for them if used correctly but playing him in what is basically a front 4 with no press against the best teams will not work. 

They can play a basketball approach against the around half the division and in some Champions League group games as their front line will outscore the likes of Newcastle and a makeshift Atlanta side but they need a more tactically sound base against the better teams.   

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1 hour ago, Ellis Rimmer said:

If Messi is doing alright in France now would be a perfect chance to bump a debate thread about those two if you're invested in it

 

Depends what you mean by alright. Individually he has had a slow start in terms of goals, hampered by a couple of injuries. His team are doing fine with him in the side though, comfortably clear in a league they failed to win last season and making decent progress in their Champions League group. 

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1 minute ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

Depends what you mean by alright. Individually he has had a slow start in terms of goals, hampered by a couple of injuries. His team are doing fine with him in the side though, comfortably clear in a league they failed to win last season and making decent progress in their Champions League group. 

I'd be bumping that thread if I was a Messi fan boy

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43 minutes ago, Ellis Rimmer said:

I'd be bumping that thread if I was a Messi fan boy

Tbh, I'm starting to think comparing them now in terms of what they produce is a bit pointless.

 

They are still top players, but they arent what they once were, even though they can still and will produce magic.

 

One is playing in the French league for the Harlem Globetrotters and the other is playing for a pretty awful Man U team, who, at times, are a bit like the Harlem Globetrotters. Messi will win the French league but I think PSG are still short to win the Champs League. Ronaldo will do well to pick up a cup at Man U unless something drastically changes.

 

Time waits for no man, regardless of how great they are/were. 

 

I don't think either would be considered for the best player in the world right now, would they? 

 

Has been a long old time since anyone could say that.

 

 

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1 minute ago, SiJ said:

Tbh, I'm starting to think comparing them now in terms of what they produce is a bit pointless.

 

They are still top players, but they arent what they once were, even though they can still and will produce magic.

 

One is playing in the French league for the Harlem Globetrotters and the other is playing for a pretty awful Man U team, who, at times, are a bit like the Harlem Globetrotters. Messi will win the French league but I think PSG are still short to win the Champs League. Ronaldo will do well to pick up a cup at Man U unless something drastically changes.

 

Time waits for no man, regardless of how great they are/were. 

 

I don't think either would be considered for the best player in the world right now, would they? 

 

Has been a long old time since anyone could say that.

 

 

No, who is that now? Salah would take some beating I would imagine 

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1 minute ago, Ellis Rimmer said:

No, who is that now? Salah would take some beating I would imagine 

Would be Mo for me.

 

He's in unreal form atm. Think he's actually elevated his game to another level which is hard to imagine.

 

 

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2 hours ago, BIG D said:

Ronaldo is having a fairly ordinary time, and I speak as someone who has got him as capt in my Fantasy Football team every week. 

I daren’t change him. 

Then more fool you, when the best player in the world Is playing just up the road, and jn the form of his life 

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