The European Superleague Plan highlights a problem at Sheffield Wednesday

[Kopparberg]

The main thing I took from the Super League stuff was that owners don’t even consider the fans in any way - and will happily gamble the clubs future’s like they’re in a casino. 
 

These massive clubs can be run on debt - we and other football league clubs won’t be afforded that luxury, we’d get wrapped up. 

[Rogers]

2 minutes ago, Kopparberg said:

The main thing I took from the Super League stuff was that owners don’t even consider the fans in any way - and will happily gamble the clubs future’s like they’re in a casino. 
 

These massive clubs can be run on debt - we and other football league clubs won’t be afforded that luxury, we’d get wrapped up. 

When you can sell 2-3 players and potentially raise £200m - £300m in a week; the banks are more relaxed. 

[Owl-about-that-then]

12 hours ago, @owlstalk said:

 

I dont

 

And we see seeing the result of it and will see even more of an impact in coming years

 

From a marketing and advertising point of view I don’t think Sheffield Wednesday have done a single thing to try and engage people who aren’t die hard Wednesday fans 

 

 

 

 

I'm not sure how being involved in online streaming tournaments of Fifa and having discounted days, giant fun day events etc isn't an example of exactly this... Taking just owls in the park as an example, I know lots of people who went to that, with their children, every year, despite having no interest in football previously. The summer camps are also something where I know plenty of young people have gone to even if they haven't been Wednesday supporters - why? Because it is reasonably affordable daycare that suits children who like to play football.

I'm not saying there isn't room for improvement but if we are acknowledging where we can improve, we should also look at things which have been done well. 

[Guest The Claw]

 stick with the cabin and settle for the egg under your hat

[owlinexile]

2 hours ago, Rogers said:

When you can sell 2-3 players and potentially raise £200m - £300m in a week; the banks are more relaxed. 

 

Well that's the problem.

 

The wages are still astronomical but nobody is paying the transfer fees at the moment.  It's all swaps and free transfers.  None of these so-called 'super clubs' have any actual liquid cash.  Partially due to COVID, but also due to how massively over-extended they already are regarding wages.

 

Even Real Madrid's creditors will start to get a bit twitchy if that kind of situation goes on too long.  Hence this Super League move and the big cash bonuses from JP Morgan for joining it.

[owlinexile]

2 hours ago, Kopparberg said:

The main thing I took from the Super League stuff was that owners don’t even consider the fans in any way - and will happily gamble the clubs future’s like they’re in a casino. 
 

These massive clubs can be run on debt - we and other football league clubs won’t be afforded that luxury, we’d get wrapped up. 

 

The main takeaway is the utter disconnect between the fans and owners ideas of how to solve the problem of football's casino finances.

 

Owners want to take over the casino and rig the games so no one else can win.  

 

Fans want to keep the games fair, but lower the stakes so everyone is having fun again and no one goes bankrupt.

[Utah Owl]

8 hours ago, BIG D said:

We were half decent at the time though and I’m guessing Utd were League 1?

no idea who their player is. 

Students don't have much cash generally speaking so would automatically opt for the cheapest especially as they are likely going as a group of mates.

[eightbelow]

Great thread with some great comments, here are a couple of points that have been brought home to me over the last few years:

We aren't fans anymore, we are seen as customers. The problem for the fans is this, customers vote with their feet, as fans we cant break the habit, the owners know this so will always have the upper hand.

The bigger clubs now know that they can survive without fans in the ground, its not ideal but COVID has shown them that streaming platforms that they could own will being in more revenue than a ground full of fans and the big overheads are gone. Real Madrid have been playing their games at their training ground and could win La Liga and the UCL.

Finally, its been great to see fans unite over this but lets be real here, come August Sky will be wetting their pants about the greatest league on earth and Neville and his spitting scouse mate will be right there picking up their pay cheques telling us how lucky we are to get to watch this drivel every week.

The amount of hypocrisy coming out of the mouths of pundits and ex players is ridiculous at the moment, players saying football needs to change need to be asked if they would agree to salary caps etc. and I am sure that they would clam up double time if asked that question.

[Drewswfc]

18 hours ago, owlinexile said:

Football needs a complete reset; just in the exact opposite direction than these 'Super League' teams want.

 

At the moment, football is pure casino capitalism.  Buy a club on its uppers, run up a tonne of debt trying to get into the Premiership where you can actually make a profit, probably fail and waltz away from the smoking ruin you left behind.  

 

If you are a 'big' Premiership club, the exact same applies except instead of trying to get to the Premiership to survive you are trying to get in the Champions League.

 

The solution of these Americans is to seize ownership of the casino and make sure no one too 'lucky' is allowed in.  But all the excess and profiteering is to continue and actually be encouraged.

 

The ACTUAL solution is to remove the temptation.  It shouldn't be possible to make vast fortunes by owning a football club.  Football clubs should essentially be held in trust for the local community.  The owners are really 'trustees' and should be there to ensure the club is run sustainably within its operating budget and can continue to thrive into the future, not to enrich themselves.

 

Because that's the USP that's missing from actually going to a football match now - the community and sense of ownership.  It's not about the facilities, or what division you are in, or even particularly the football on offer.

 

I started going to football because my dad took me.  I have seen Wednesday in Europe, I have seen them have a decent crack at the First Division title.  I have seen us in League One twice now.  I have seen us at Wembley and Old Trafford and I have worried that the stand was going to fall down at Carlisle United.  I have watched us being represented by Chris Waddle and by Jay Bothroyd, Des Walker and Ashley Westwood.  Sublime passing skills and Megson hoof-ball.  The most enjoyable football experience I have ever had was probably a League One playoff final against Hartlepool United.

 

Because none of that stuff is actually what going to watch live football is about.  Football is about daft Saturday rituals and traditions with your dad or mates.  A shared sense of identity and pride in your community.  Proper hating those ******** from a couple of miles down the road who are exactly the same as you in every way and you will be best pals with again at school or work on Monday.  Immediately having shared experiences in common to talk about with complete strangers.  Feeling the bass vibrations of 20,000 people singing together coming up through your feet.

 

Football clubs, leagues and broadcasters have spent lots of money persuading people that football is not about that at all, and is actually about the BEST players in the BEST stadiums all competing against each other on Mount Olympus for the edification of us mere mortals.  Constantly telling everyone that football is better because the players are 'fitter' and have never been as technically proficient and how famous player 'x' would never make it in today's game.  Hordes of footballing 'intellectuals' who have never set foot in a football stadium arguing about pass completion rates and Expected Goals Against and how players passing it sideways in their own half for ages like that episode of the Simpsons is actually MORE entertaining somehow.

 

They chose to market football in that way because they realised that they could make far more money if millions of people watched it on TV rather than thousands in a stadium.  After decades of that message, they can hardly complain that young people would prefer to watch football on television rather than actually going to a match, and that they lack the same levels of 'brand loyalty' and enthusiasm that the so-called 'legacy fans' have.  That's what they wanted.  That's what they have got.

 

Chansiri could have a complete personality transplant and turn Hillsborough into a shining palace where it costs a tenner to get in, the toilets are spotless with built-in bidets and perfume dispensers, and you can even actually get a pie or a cup of tea at half time, and young people would still prefer to watch football on TV, because that's what football IS to them now.

 

 

 

 

Top post pal. Football now is just too sterile and too PC. 

I definatly think reintroducing standing at grounds would be a massive step forward to retaking our game back. Get some atmosphere back into the grounds. 

[Drewswfc]

8 hours ago, Sambo89 said:

I'm fighting like mad against it, but my young un is wavering more towards his granddad's team (L**ds) 

 

If it wasn't for them being L**ds I'd probably not be as bothered, but to be fair, apart from being universally known as scum, they play more attractive football in a higher league. 

 

Next door neighbour is a Wednesdayite with 3 lads who all used to go to Hillsborough. One of em now isn't bothered about anything if it isn't on his xbox, another has started going to Barnsley with his cousin, and another follows Man City, who by the way charge less for European games than Wednesday do for league games.

 

 

Sounds like he needs a thick ear and dragging down to hillsborough 

[peter f goulty]

On 21/04/2021 at 07:43, @owlstalk said:

 

The new proposed ESL Superleague thing shows a bigger problem that exists at Sheffield Wednesday FC too

 

Those responsible for this new idea have stipulated a couple of motivating factors

 

1) Their huge massive losses (some clubs are now a billion in debt)

2) The lack of young fans showing interest in going to games

 

So here's how I equate it to OUR club

 

The losses are something that we've seen at SWFC. Not to the degree of a billion pounds debt but significant issues with wages to income being just incredibly dangerous. Most other businesses would simply have gone bust if they'd been running at those kind of levels of wages to income

But here's the even bigger thing for me

The lack of young people showing any interest in going to games

This is purely and simply a total lack of action from clubs over the last ten years who have relied on the older fans, and made absolutely no real effort whatsoever to attract the younger fans

None

No effort at all (what sustained promotion have you ever seen from the club to attract them to support the club?)

But an even bigger point at Sheffield Wednesday is not just that we're seen as a struggling club, but that the perception of expense of going to games just isn't affordable at any level

For example to attract young fans to matches you have to start by getting their parents to take them to matches, but many just can't afford to. Therefore over time you will get less and less younger fans becoming attached to our club and wanting to come

This was raised and highlighted repeatedly over the last ten years that this site has been existed.

It's been a real problem that was absolutely bound to happen. It was obvious. And now it's happened/happening

 

The football clubs have made it unattractive to come to games.

It's not about console games or other things that younger fans have to do instead of going to the football, but the fact that football and SWFC in particular have not made going to games the most attractive idea to them.

Not only are we overpriced but younger fans absolutely demand and expect standards in things like seating, catering, technology in stadiums and ours is 1980's style stadium

So put it all together..

Struggling club

Prices extortionate (remember they're not just gonna get a season ticket as they're not diehard fans yet)
No promotion to make it look amazing on social media to come to games
No creation of 'heroes' off the pitch from a PR perspective to latch onto 

Archaic facilities

 

It's no surprise younger fans have turned their back on going to games.  Everything about it sucks ass to them.

And it's been coming for the last 10/15 years 

It was inevitable

Greed, riches & television have created this. Years ago a few managers in fact said, money will eventually  destroy the game ! Hence the future is here. In the fans interest would you boycott the above fireside support or go to live matches ?

[Inspector Lestrade]

13 minutes ago, peter f goulty said:

Greed, riches & television have created this. Years ago a few managers in fact said, money will eventually  destroy the game ! Hence the future is here. In the fans interest would you boycott the above fireside support or go to live matches ?

 

Can the future be here?   

[areNOTwhatTHEYseem]

1 minute ago, Inspector Lestrade said:

Can the future be here?   

 

Yesterday's future is.

[Inspector Lestrade]

Just now, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said:

 

Yesterday's future is.

 

Thats the past now isnt it?   Wibbly wobbly timey wimey

[areNOTwhatTHEYseem]

Just now, Inspector Lestrade said:

Thats the past now isnt it?   Wibbly wobbly timey wimey

 

It is now, yeah.

 

It wasn't when I wrote it, though. 

 

[Inspector Lestrade]

Just now, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said:

 

It is now, yeah.

 

It wasn't when I wrote it, though. 

 

 

Let's discuss this yesterday

[TINGLE75]

On 21/04/2021 at 08:23, vulva said:

Wage cap is the only thing that will save the game. Unless that gets dealt with, everything else is irrelevant. 

Agree totally but that won't happen as wages are astronomical. Wage cap at say £20,000 a week in top league, then less as you go lower diwn the pyramid. Also a limit on what each could can spend on transfers per season to make it a fair abd even contest. As I said wages won't happen as I am asking for 150% + reduction for some players.

[Inspector Lestrade]

On 22/04/2021 at 00:12, owlinexile said:

 

The main takeaway is the utter disconnect between the fans and owners ideas of how to solve the problem of football's casino finances.

 

Owners want to take over the casino and rig the games so no one else can win.  

 

Fans want to keep the games fair, but lower the stakes so everyone is having fun again and no one goes bankrupt.

 

Fans can justify their clubs spending but other clubs can't.

 

 

[Rogers]

On 21/04/2021 at 17:40, Plonk said:

Not just the kids mate. Football is just not the game it was anymore. The number of times I’ve read on forums ( and not just this one) that people just don’t love it like they used to. I think a year away could be disastrous for clubs like us because people are realising there are things to do. 

100% right, you’d think clubs would be doing all they can to keep us interested and connected. 

 

 

[Guest whowantstoberich]

On 21/04/2021 at 13:55, Sticky Micky said:

Football is easy assemble now 

Can watch it on your phone, tablet, pc, TV, streams, YouTube, ifollow 

 

Would a kid rather watch Messi, Ronaldo, mbappe for 30 quid a month or watch Barry Bannan, Sam Hutchinson, Tom Lees for 35 quid 

 

 

 

 

 

Both as one is the and one is live. 2 completely different experiences