Morepork Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, Shetland Owl said: Monk is to blame releasing Lee and Dave before we got replacements, both would have made a difference to our side It’s like we forgot. They needed releasing because they needed upgrading, we dealt with them like they were surplus to requirements. Both sorely missed and would have contributed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMOwl72 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 32 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said: It was an impossible task. Monk was trying to recruit with a 12 point deduction, with no money and we desperately needed to get bodies in to be able to at least name a subs bench. You don’t have to spend a fortune to get decent players or put a decent team together. Look at Barnsley. You just need to know why you are doing! We are very good at finding very average players and paying them a kings ransom! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kagoshimaowl Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 13 minutes ago, victorturner said: It was a mistake to keep Monk on last summer. It was also a mistake to fire him mid season unless we had a better replacement lined up. Pulis may be very professional but is very old fashioned and defensive and seemed to think he would be able to recruit new players in January..but he wasn't. But another key period is more recent when McCarthy, Pearson and Bowyer were appointed by others while w e went for a cheaper option with first of all Neil Thompson and now this nice guy but rookie from Doncaster. Agree with all of this too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyCinnamon Posted March 17, 2021 Author Share Posted March 17, 2021 Just now, GMOwl72 said: You don’t have to spend a fortune to get decent players or put a decent team together. Look at Barnsley. You just need to know why you are doing! We are very good at finding very average players and paying them a kings ransom! Yeah but Barnsley’s success is down to the fact the club has a plan and structure in place. Our recruitment strategy is absolutely horrendous and that’s not Monk’s fault. Would love to know how many of the players we signed he actually wanted. Considering we signed Green and Hutch in January without a manager speaks volumes in my opinion. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinky Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 41 minutes ago, vulva said: Appointing Monk cost us our Championship status. The squad he put together was ridiculously unbalanced. This. 1 million percent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMOwl72 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said: Yeah but Barnsley’s success is down to the fact the club has a plan and structure in place. Our recruitment strategy is absolutely horrendous and that’s not Monk’s fault. Would love to know how many of the players we signed he actually wanted. Considering we signed Green and Hutch in January without a manager speaks volumes in my opinion. As I say you just need to know what you are doing. This includes every part of the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionel Fessi Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 38 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said: There I said it. And I was Monk’s biggest critic. I’m not saying we would be comfortable but we wouldn’t be this cut adrift I’m sure of it. We backed him in the summer with a number of signings and we let him bring in his own backroom staff. Then as soon as a few bad results happened - we hit the panic button and sacked him. Reality is this squad is not very good. The chairman has put us in two situations during the past two transfer windows. An embargo which meant we were scrapping around for free transfers under Bruce. And a points deduction which means nobody of any quality wanted to join the inevitable slog for survival. The result? An absolute mess of a squad which is simply not up to it. Monk was probably our best chance of surviving it purely based on the fact we recruited for his formation and he had a whole pre season to work with the players. This season we needed stability. Instead we’ve had four different managers and the players look completely confused and bereft of any confidence at this stage. The chairman has absolutely destroyed us this season with the points deduction, chopping and changing managers and not paying the players on time. A perfect storm for an absolute shambles of a season. On reflection every manager after CC have all been doomed to fail... Every single one has had to deal with injuries to key players, transfer embargo and none/limited transfer budget whilst trying to implement their own style of play with their predecessors players. Even if Jos, Pulis and Monk all made slightly better footballing decisions I still feel that inevitably long term they would have all cocked it up. The short positive spell Bruce had falsely raised our expectations as fans and really did rinse the last bit of Championship worthy football from our fragile squad. We can’t keep blaming the players or the manager, it’s Chansiri who keeps making bad decision after bad decision. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pazowl55 Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Them three defeats cost Monk dear. But he was just coming to terms with how to cope with the lose of Luongo and had picked up 4 points in 2 games when he was sacked. He would have kept us up. And it's just been error after error from Chansiri ever since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyCinnamon Posted March 17, 2021 Author Share Posted March 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, Lionel Fessi said: On reflection every manager after CC have all been doomed to fail... Every single one has had to deal with injuries to key players, transfer embargo and none/limited transfer budget whilst trying to implement their own style of play with their predecessors players. Even if Jos, Pulis and Monk all made slightly better footballing decisions I still feel that inevitably long term they would have all cocked it up. The short positive spell Bruce had falsely raised our expectations as fans and really did rinse the last bit of Championship worthy football from our fragile squad. We can’t keep blaming the players or the manager, it’s Chansiri who keeps making bad decision after bad decision. I completely agree. But I’m talking about this season in isolation. We just needed to stay up. It would have been a slog regardless. I think Monk was probably our best chance at that. Since his sacking DC has sabotaged any slight hope we had of beating the drop and playing Championship football next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hirstys_achilles Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 33 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said: Wonder if there is more to our monumental collapse than Monk being a bad manager? Points are won or lost on the pitch. Bruce had stopped the rot quite quickly. Monk then ruined the squad. Froze out senior players. Refused to play youth or academy sourced players. He released players who commanded relatively small wages and attempted replaceming them with higher earners with less ability. Everyone knew that goal scoring was going to be our biggest problem. Yet monk did nothing to fix this. Letting atdhe go at this stage was criminal. Monk is an awful manager. He was given ample time and opportunity to at least have the team show some signs of a base or foundation to the squad. The longer he spent with us the more disjointed and unbalanced we became. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smhouston Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 What a load of nonsense from the OP Monk is one of the worst appointments ever and I called it before he even came! There was literally no signs of Monk turning it around. Despite how bad things are currently, it is still better football than what Monk was getting out of them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyCinnamon Posted March 17, 2021 Author Share Posted March 17, 2021 Just now, smhouston said: What a load of nonsense from the OP Monk is one of the worst appointments ever and I called it before he even came! There was literally no signs of Monk turning it around. Despite how bad things are currently, it is still better football than what Monk was getting out of them! It’s really not. The football has consistently been dire all season. Apart from a couple of decent games under Thompson. Monk was averaging a better points return than Pulis and Moore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westfield Owl Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Django said: Na I don’t buy it Monk was as stubborn as clueless as his chairman, should have been sacked after losing 0-5 at home to a mediocre Blackburn team Fixed. Edited March 17, 2021 by Westfield Owl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dot Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 I think that the vast majority of people would think (and its shown in this thread) keeping monk was a disaster and cost us dearly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyCinnamon Posted March 17, 2021 Author Share Posted March 17, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, hirstys_achilles said: Points are won or lost on the pitch. Bruce had stopped the rot quite quickly. Monk then ruined the squad. Froze out senior players. Refused to play youth or academy sourced players. He released players who commanded relatively small wages and attempted replaceming them with higher earners with less ability. Everyone knew that goal scoring was going to be our biggest problem. Yet monk did nothing to fix this. Letting atdhe go at this stage was criminal. Monk is an awful manager. He was given ample time and opportunity to at least have the team show some signs of a base or foundation to the squad. The longer he spent with us the more disjointed and unbalanced we became. Bruce stopped the rot with players like Forestieri, Joao, Hector, a bothered Adam Reach, Fletcher, Hooper and actual left back. Bruce’s brief renaissance was with a good Championship squad. Since then we let all our best players go and replaced them with crap ones. Some might blame Monk for that but very difficult to operate in a transfer window when you’ve got a -12 points, no money and a pish poor recruitment strategy. Edited March 17, 2021 by SallyCinnamon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogers Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 1 hour ago, SallyCinnamon said: There I said it. And I was Monk’s biggest critic. I’m not saying we would be comfortable but we wouldn’t be this cut adrift I’m sure of it. We backed him in the summer with a number of signings and we let him bring in his own backroom staff. Then as soon as a few bad results happened - we hit the panic button and sacked him. Reality is this squad is not very good. The chairman has put us in two situations during the past two transfer windows. An embargo which meant we were scrapping around for free transfers under Bruce. And a points deduction which means nobody of any quality wanted to join the inevitable slog for survival. The result? An absolute mess of a squad which is simply not up to it. Monk was probably our best chance of surviving it purely based on the fact we recruited for his formation and he had a whole pre season to work with the players. This season we needed stability. Instead we’ve had four different managers and the players look completely confused and bereft of any confidence at this stage. The chairman has absolutely destroyed us this season with the points deduction, chopping and changing managers and not paying the players on time. A perfect storm for an absolute shambles of a season. It started with hounding Carlos out, due to him being outspoken, injuring players, and losing against united that started all this. And other BS myths started by fans that want to justify their argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the mighty wednesday Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 1 hour ago, onlyonedavidhirst said: Pulis lost heart really early on I think. He gave in before some of the players if you ask me. After about 3 games he was exasperated and making excuses. The change in his demeanour and his language was noticeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hirstys_achilles Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 41 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said: Bruce stopped the rot with players like Forestieri, Joao, Hector, a bothered Adam Reach, Fletcher, Hooper and actual left back. Bruce’s brief renaissance was with a good Championship squad. Since then we let all our best players go and replaced them with crap ones. Some might blame Monk for that but very difficult to operate in a transfer window when you’ve got a -12 points, no money and a pish poor recruitment strategy. The embargo was actually in effect during Bruce's tenure as well. Yes monk had things a little more difficult with recruitment. Which is why keeping certain players was even more important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 17, 2021 Share Posted March 17, 2021 Monk shouldn't have been given a penny after his infamous 'I've been chasing Da cruz for a while' quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 18, 2021 Share Posted March 18, 2021 1 hour ago, SallyCinnamon said: I completely agree. But I’m talking about this season in isolation. We just needed to stay up. It would have been a slog regardless. I think Monk was probably our best chance at that. Since his sacking DC has sabotaged any slight hope we had of beating the drop and playing Championship football next season. Monk had got us 12 points from 11 games when he got sacked - having had a full pre-season with a squd of players many of whom he was familier working with and the back room staff he had chosen. Nothing in his record suggest he would have done significantly better than that given more time and that points ratio would take us to around 44 points at the end of the season, taking into account the deduction - probably still not enough to stay up. He showed no faith or interest in keeping Nuhiu who would have been an asset this season compared to our other options - it was fairly obvious we would struggle to attract anyone. I don't think he would have kept us up but I do agree about the timing of the decision to sack him being a bad one. He should have been sacked after the Brentford game last season. However, when we backed him at the expense of bringing in his coaching staff in the summer we should then have given him more time to work on it - if the club put their trust in him so much in the summer why only give him 11 league games after that. Pulis was the next mistake, I expected him to improve on results but it never happened and he clearly didn't see eye to eye with the owner - how can he get this so wrong that it is brought to an end after just 10 matches! The next mistake is to stumble along with an academy coach for 12 games. Thompson started well but some of the wins were a little lucky and to me it just liked a relief for the players not to have to put up with Pulis anymore. If the club thought he was the right man they should have publicly backed him to the end of the season. If they didn't they should have put someone in place in time to assess and improve in the transfer window. Regardless of the manager, we apparently have a recruitment team - surely it was obvious we needed to do something more significant in January to give us a chance. Now we have Moore, too little, too late, whether he is going to be any good long term remains to be seen but if he was who the club decided on after careful thought then surely he could have been prized away from Doncaster half a dozen games or so earlier? The managers we have appointed recently haven't been effective but ultimately the costliest decisions have been made above their heads and most managers worth their salt at this level would give us a wide berth. We are in a sorry state, to which managers have contributed but aren't the main reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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