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Time to scrap the SWFC Academy


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I kind of agree. 

 

Have the academy up to under 18s. After that young players need to be loaned out or with the first team.

 

We can then have a reserve team, or B team however you want to put it. We can then arrange games when we want. I know Huddersfield tend to arrange games with a lot of foreign teams too. This can include a few youngsters plus as many first team players as we want. 

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2 minutes ago, S72 Owl said:

I kind of agree. 

 

Have the academy up to under 18s. After that young players need to be loaned out or with the first team.

 

We can then have a reserve team, or B team however you want to put it. We can then arrange games when we want. I know Huddersfield tend to arrange games with a lot of foreign teams too. This can include a few youngsters plus as many first team players as we want. 

This model has worked really well for Huddersfield and their first team is full of youth products. Oh hang on. Our academy is beginning to produce it's now up to the youngsters to prove themselves good enough of first team football and the manager to allow them the route to first team football. The early indicators of both are very positive

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5 minutes ago, S72 Owl said:

After that young players need to be loaned out or with the first team.

 

That's where one of our problems is. We don't seem to get enough really competitive matches for the young lads. L1 or L2 would suit them much better development-wise than the U23 fixtures.

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39 minutes ago, PARKOWL said:

like I said rate them or not that isnt really the issue is it 

But obviously somebody did rate them for them to have played, also the majority would have got in our team over the last couple of years

It was tongue in cheek Parkie ...

Compared to any other big teams set up it's a fùcking shocking testimony in nearly 30 years of nurturing talent by the club ....

You reap what you sow .....

 

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1 hour ago, ny owl said:

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. Something has to change. 

 

Such as putting the academy products on the pitch instead of paying Almen Abdi millions to sit on the bench or in the treatment room. I'd say this season of all seasons is the one where we're looking like we've changed.

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2 hours ago, Owls Loyal said:

Ny Owl in another thread makes the salutory comment that the SWFC Academy has failed to produce a top tier player in 40 years. Stunning but true.

 

We had a good period under Big Jack and Sgt Wilko when three Premier League standard players came through:

Mel Sterland

Perter Shirtliffe

Mark Smith

 

At that time we also had some good support players who emerged and helped us to get to the top tier: Grant, Taylor, Pearson and Oliver.  But since then it has been an appalling drought.

 

Particularly with Covid 19 now is time imo to reward this failure by scrapping the Academy.

 

Four years ago Brentford scapped their Age 8 top Age 20 Academy and introduced an "Elite Development Squad" for players 20-23 in age.  They then scouted youngsters around Europe to fill the Elite Squad and contuinue to do so.

 

Time for SWFC to take this decisive action.

Like Huddersfied has?.

That countermands your Brentford argument.

The very reason why we have not produced any young players in the last 40 years is very simple:

The club did not invest in any form of youth development in that time, instead wasting money on over hyped and over paid players while we went from the, then, 1st division through the Prem league and into a championship & 1st division yoyo club.

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2 hours ago, Bulldog said:

That fascination with Brentford again. A team that's spent the last 12 years in the championship (after promotion from league one) yes, a fine example to follow.

But they have a very close connection to some Italian club or other.

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1 hour ago, TheEnchanter said:

 

Disagree hugely with this. They are traditionally a club that belongs 1-2 divisions below this league. They've levelled up their club on and pff the pitch dramatically aided by a remarkable transfer strategy. They've been able to cement themselves as a Premiership ready club with a new stadium to boot with an admirable self sufficiency from their recruitment model. 

 

If we scaled Sheffield Wednesday up to the same successes as Brentford then we'd be on par with a Wolves or Leicester. 

 

I'm not saying we should be them or that everything we are doing is wrong because we aren't doing what Brentford are but to dismiss the way they've levelled up as a club just because they haven't made the Prem yet would be pretty narrow minded. 

Aren't they co-owned by Udinese or summat?.

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We had many years, 20+ years  neglecting our academy prior to DC, It's a slow burn to turn that round, but think what we've done since DC's tenure has been positive.

 

We've had our u23's winning a trophy and several now in the first team squad. Whether they are all good enough is debatable, but starting to get game time. 

 

I think that pathway to the first team, will improve our academy, attractiveness to young players. I think we are right to scout local talent and released players from other academies, particularly PL academies. 

 

It's a case of needs must this year, but (and I think there is a plan and will to do so) we should get more players out on loan. It's much more beneficial for young players to play competitive football, than u23 football. Also, while margins lower, also brings in some income re wage contribution.

 

I dont think it's time to scrap the academy, in fact the opposite, we need to invest in youth. 

 

 

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I've always been in favour of scrapping the U23's and bringing back the reserve league so the young kids can play alongside and against season pros every week to toughen them up for the first team. They don't get the experience of playing against seasoned pros playing against kids their own age in the U23's. 

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One of the silliest and short sighted ideas aired on Owlstalk (and there’s been plenty).

 

If you’re not happy about the way something that’s fundamental to the future of the club works,then improve it.  

Yes it will cost time and money but far less than signing the likes of Abdi, Jones, Boyd, Matias, Melo, Sougou, Lachlan, McGugan, Urby, Bus etc. Money paying that set of deadbeats not to play could have given us a first class academy.

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A lot of lower league teams scrapped their academies around 5 years ago due to the rule change that was introduced

this basically allowed premier league teams to come in and sign their good youngsters for peanuts I believe the figure was something like 150k max for any academy players 
 

brentford made the decision at the time that it made financial sense to just sign players a little older and work from there which they’ve done very successfully many others have failed miserably.
 

theres currently around 35 academies operating  which means over half the teams in the football league are operating the “Brentford” model I can’t remember any other success stories in regards this approach 


we seem to have moved more to the bit of both worlds approach bringing in released players from premier league teams. which I feel is the right way to go however with youth players I think it’s 90% luck if any of them go onto make it. 
 

if you look back over the England u17 teams over the last 20 years 75% of them you’ve never even heard of but at that time where considered the most promising In the country there’s no surefire route to success with youth but we seem to be moving in the right direction 

 

 

 

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I appreciate that many have an emotional attachment to the Academy but Ny Owl's point still stands.

 

SWFC's Academy has not produced a top tier player in 40 years.

 

I shudder at the times I have heard the phrase "We have got some talented youngsters coming through".

 

Anyone here remember the name Simmons.  Well, he was billed as the next Jimmy Greaves and he ended up in Non League football!

 

We even heard it under Luhukay two years ago.

 

He launched the likes of Baker, Preston and Kirby and now not one of them is even playing at League One level.

 

Also please consider that DFB is a classic example of what I am proposing.  We should scout the fall out of young players with high potential around Europe at 18+ years and bring them to our Elite Developmenmt Squad.

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2 hours ago, Swiss Toni said:

The problem we have in our area are that both Sheffield United and Leeds United have academies that have a strong history of producing players who go on to bigger and better things.

 

Until we can match that (probably we never will) then our academy doesn’t serve us well in its current guise.

 

Not sure what the answer is though.

I would add Barnsley to that list as well.

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I think DC could do a lot worse than decide to take a longer term approach and invest in the Academy including facilities and infrastructure but at the end of the day it’s his money not mine.

 

I do wonder if allowing Monk what from the outside looking in seems to be a free reign then this will indeed become part of any future plans if the current youngsters make a name for themselves. As I said in an earlier post there appears to be a whiff of the Big Jack era all over again when some local lads including some Wednesday Fans made the breakthrough.

Edited by Jim
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