Wakefield owl Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 The EFL actually were prepared to give us a way out and we were too incompetent to deal with it (ie the ground sale) properly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbob1867 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 9 minutes ago, Wakefield owl said: The EFL actually were prepared to give us a way out and we were too incompetent to deal with it (ie the ground sale) properly. The heads of terms just needed certainty as to price or how the price would be calculated. It didn’t achieve this. I don’t know who drafted the terms but it appears to have been someone at the club. It could probably have been rectified with the addition of one sentence which any half decent corporate/commercial lawyer could have achieved in very short order yet we didn’t consult one apparently. Draw your own conclusions about how much on a scale of yes to fizz yes that was a major blunder 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spondon Owl Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 10 hours ago, daleblue said: Wasn't it an independent panel that gave us the 12 point deduction, or have I got that wrong? Based on guidance issued after the fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbob1867 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Jimbob1867 said: The heads of terms just needed certainty as to price or how the price would be calculated. It didn’t achieve this. I don’t know who drafted the terms but it appears to have been someone at the club. It could probably have been rectified with the addition of one sentence which any half decent corporate/commercial lawyer could have achieved in very short order yet we didn’t consult one apparently. Draw your own conclusions about how much on a scale of yes to fizz yes that was a major blunder One final thought and I’ll shut up and not post for another 4 years. I fully expected to read the judgment today and either tear the panel/EFL a new one or at least find decent grounds for an appeal. Having digested the whole judgment - and I should note that the judgment is the opinion of the panel and we don’t get to see the extensive evidence filed by either side (although as mentioned before I do feel the panel has acted with intelligence and integrity) I was shocked - shocked I tell thee! at how badly we appear to have dealt with this, how clear it seems to be we were wrong and how removed the facts seem to be from the statements the club has made about their view of what actually occurred. That is all. UTO and - why not - FTB. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animis Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Jimbob1867 said: The heads of terms just needed certainty as to price or how the price would be calculated. It didn’t achieve this. I don’t know who drafted the terms but it appears to have been someone at the club. It could probably have been rectified with the addition of one sentence which any half decent corporate/commercial lawyer could have achieved in very short order yet we didn’t consult one apparently. Draw your own conclusions about how much on a scale of yes to fizz yes that was a major blunder The issue for me is that the club knew for a while in the early months of 2018 that without some serious player sales we would breach P&S. It beggars belief that the three Directors didn't get a plan together to ensure we managed this - either take it on the chin and accept a 12 point deduction when the accounts were posted in the Summer of 2018 or sort out the ground sale paperwork. It appears that DC wanted the sale to go ahead, so why didn't the executive team get it together; not wait until the last minute and left scrambling around emailing and meeting the EFL in early August, after the accounts deadline date. The whole thing is a mess and now recorded in black and white exposes DC for what he is - a fool running a football club. You could say Redgate should take the blame as executive FD but he simply stepped down from the board and carried on as usual. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbob1867 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Just now, Animis said: The issue for me is that the club knew for a while in the early months of 2018 that without some serious player sales we would breach P&S. It beggars belief that the three Directors didn't get a plan together to ensure we managed this - either take it on the chin and accept a 12 point deduction when the accounts were posted in the Summer of 2018 or sort out the ground sale paperwork. It appears that DC wanted the sale to go ahead, so why didn't the executive team get it together; not wait until the last minute and left scrambling around emailing and meeting the EFL in early August, after the accounts deadline date. The whole thing is a mess and now recorded in black and white exposes DC for what he is - a fool running a football club. You could say Redgate should take the blame as executive FD but he simply stepped down from the board and carried on as usual. Indeed...and in fact who even are the directors? They are not mentioned in the judgment unless they are referenced in their other, primary, roles and are also directors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spondon Owl Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Animis said: The issue for me is that the club knew for a while in the early months of 2018 that without some serious player sales we would breach P&S. It beggars belief that the three Directors didn't get a plan together to ensure we managed this - either take it on the chin and accept a 12 point deduction when the accounts were posted in the Summer of 2018 or sort out the ground sale paperwork. It appears that DC wanted the sale to go ahead, so why didn't the executive team get it together; not wait until the last minute and left scrambling around emailing and meeting the EFL in early August, after the accounts deadline date. The whole thing is a mess and now recorded in black and white exposes DC for what he is - a fool running a football club. You could say Redgate should take the blame as executive FD but he simply stepped down from the board and carried on as usual. Unless Chansiri is some interfering megalomaniac i honestly do not understand how katrien Miere is coming out smelling of roses. Was she not charged with the running of the club? Don't get me wrong, DC doesn't come out of this well, but it appears, from references to him being in Thailand, that the responsibility (as you would expect with the hierarchy in place) to complete, or at the very least setup with sufficient clarity to allow completion of, the transaction fell to the incumbent UK based directors? Chiefly, the CEO. No? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Notts Owl Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 4 hours ago, Manwë said: There is no prize fund for placement in the Championship, all clubs are paid the same. Even better no fine to pay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owl1987 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 I think there is some mileage in this. EFL have acted shambolically. Appears to me we were found against because of the wrong accounts year which technically is correct. But when the club is given the okay by the EFL to do that then I think this appeal may be a goer. This ones not over in my view. Chansiri might be a few things but he is a businessman and far from stupid. He has a decent legal team and advisors. The decision reasons released lead me to have a lot of optimism.. EFL not fit for purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick_Turpin Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 46 minutes ago, Owl1987 said: He has a decent legal team Apart from property lawyers 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swifty75 Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 3 hours ago, Triple O said: They did decide on charge 2 and found in our favour. It's in the report. That is correct. They dismissed it saying that the EFL had done no thorough investigation on the charges but charged anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherlyegg Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 Does anyone know how long Wednesday / EFL have had the report.? Appeals must be within 2-weeks, if only had it recent, appeal went in early...or have we had it 13 days ish. Just wondered, are the EFL likely to appeal especially because the IP called em a bunch of vindictive tw@ts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plonk Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 Couple of very crucial points in all this that seem a bit odd to me. 1. Why were no minutes taken at the August meeting between the club and the EFL? 2. Why, when the EFL knew knew no written agreement was in place before 31/7 did they then accept what seems to be a backdated agreement after that date? 3. Why, some ten months later, has someone at the EFL found that agreement and called foul? sorry but non of that adds up. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mkowl Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 3 hours ago, Plonk said: Couple of very crucial points in all this that seem a bit odd to me. 1. Why were no minutes taken at the August meeting between the club and the EFL? 2. Why, when the EFL knew knew no written agreement was in place before 31/7 did they then accept what seems to be a backdated agreement after that date? 3. Why, some ten months later, has someone at the EFL found that agreement and called foul? sorry but non of that adds up. It seems to me that the EFL executive wanted an easy life and actually concentrate on football not regulations. Reading the report it seems to me Villa were fairly creative and the EFL accepted it, so let's try it here again and brush / carpet scenario. Perhaps there was a reason Shaun Harvey got out - who knows. It seems that because we then failed to send accounts in March 19 this got brought back up the agenda and we got placed under embargo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Jack Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 1 hour ago, mkowl said: It seems to me that the EFL executive wanted an easy life and actually concentrate on football not regulations. Reading the report it seems to me Villa were fairly creative and the EFL accepted it, so let's try it here again and brush / carpet scenario. Perhaps there was a reason Shaun Harvey got out - who knows. It seems that because we then failed to send accounts in March 19 this got brought back up the agenda and we got placed under embargo I believe there are emails from Shaun Harvey to the club which were considered but not mentioned in the report. The club want these emails given further consideration by the committee. Shaun Harvey appears to have acted some what independently and this is what I believe to be the crux of the appeal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heppers Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 9 hours ago, Owl1987 said: I think there is some mileage in this. EFL have acted shambolically. Appears to me we were found against because of the wrong accounts year which technically is correct. But when the club is given the okay by the EFL to do that then I think this appeal may be a goer. This ones not over in my view. Chansiri might be a few things but he is a businessman and far from stupid. He has a decent legal team and advisors. The decision reasons released lead me to have a lot of optimism.. EFL not fit for purpose. His dad is a businessman who chooses to gift DC money rather than have him in the family business. Hardly a glowing testimony to his business acumen. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulva Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 14 minutes ago, heppers said: His dad is a businessman who chooses to gift DC money rather than have him in the family business. Hardly a glowing testimony to his business acumen. You don’t know that. Totally made up story. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pioowl Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 23 minutes ago, heppers said: His dad is a businessman who chooses to gift DC money rather than have him in the family business. Hardly a glowing testimony to his business acumen. Where the ---- have you got that from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bassetts Allsorts Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 Shambolic from both sides. Skimmed the thread but I can't see an answer to this, is the appeal a free shot at getting this overturned or is there further punishment should we lose it? There's plenty of ammo for lawyers in that report, but whatever happens it doesn't change how badly the club is run behind the scenes. It was obvious to everybody that we were on track to breach FFP, but this was the best plan we could muster, a back of an envelope solution copied from other clubs and hurried through at the last possible minute. The incompetence from DC actually worries me when it comes to the future of this football club. Things need to change. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthefish2002 Posted August 18, 2020 Share Posted August 18, 2020 10 hours ago, Owl1987 said: I think there is some mileage in this. EFL have acted shambolically. Appears to me we were found against because of the wrong accounts year which technically is correct. But when the club is given the okay by the EFL to do that then I think this appeal may be a goer. This ones not over in my view. Chansiri might be a few things but he is a businessman and far from stupid. He has a decent legal team and advisors. The decision reasons released lead me to have a lot of optimism.. EFL not fit for purpose. I respectfully disagree on this point. But more or less agree on the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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