Dejphon Chansiri - Sheffield Wednesday Chairman - Thread

[Animis]

45 minutes ago, ChinaOwl said:

 

The investment is completely independent of Thai Union. His family members all have substantial private wealth and holdings in other companies. I suspect that DC's father and brother have no interest in Sheffield Wednesday though whether they have or not is entirely a matter for them. The assumption that I use for them having no interest is the fact that in all of the time that DC has been Chairman, there is no evidence that either his father or brother have stepped inside Hillsborough.

 

Had they attended a match, it would obviously have been all over social media. It goes without saying that they have both attended numerous business meetings in the UK and Europe during that time and the fact that they have not even bothered to attend a match at their own family member's football club speaks volumes to me. For them to break off from a business meeting at John West or other subsidiary would have been very easy indeed.

 

I was reliably informed that a certain dude often seen at Hillsborough in the build up to the Chansiri takeover had a lot to do with the sale. He has been mooted as an intermediatery or middle man and has substantial connections with football investment in HK and the far east.

 

So you are implying that we could be 'owned' by a collection of far East investors, with DC as the figure-head?

[Guest Grandad]

2 minutes ago, Animis said:

 

So you are implying that we could be 'owned' by a collection of far East investors, with DC as the figure-head?

 

I hope Nev doesn't get wind of this 

[ChinaOwl]

1 minute ago, Animis said:

 

So you are implying that we could be 'owned' by a collection of far East investors, with DC as the figure-head?

 

I am treading carefully on the matter. I was told something by an executive within Thai Union China and connecting it with something said by a sports journalist in the far east. I have no reason to doubt the information but I certainly cannot independently verify it.

[Animis]

Just now, ChinaOwl said:

 

I am treading carefully on the matter. I was told something by an executive within Thai Union China and connecting it with something said by a sports journalist in the far east. I have no reason to doubt the information but I certainly cannot independently verify it.

 

I understand - not sure that choosing DC as a figure head is a master stroke or incompetency of the highest order.

[StudentOwl]

 

6 minutes ago, Animis said:

 

So you are implying that we could be 'owned' by a collection of far East investors, with DC as the figure-head?

Actually I think what CO is implying 

a) something that has been implied repeatedly on here by some posters

b) Absolutely 100% does not require these hypothetical far eastern investors to be far eastern. They could be from anywhere. 

[ChinaOwl]

Just now, Animis said:

 

I understand - not sure that choosing DC as a figure head is a master stroke or incompetency of the highest order.

 

I hope that we can agree that morals and ethics don't come into things vis-a-vis football investment. I am sure these people had no concern about the outcome and focussed solely on the income, namely their own.

[Animis]

1 minute ago, ChinaOwl said:

 

I hope that we can agree that morals and ethics don't come into things vis-a-vis football investment. I am sure these people had no concern about the outcome and focussed solely on the income, namely their own.

 

Yes - but DC's actions, if they are his actions, are clearly directly jeopardising their income.

[ChinaOwl]

1 minute ago, Animis said:

 

Yes - but DC's actions, if they are his actions, are clearly directly jeopardising their income.

 

I am talking about the guys that act as in intermediateries or agents. Investors know that there is a very big risk of losing money in football. They simply spread the risk among several different innvestments and accept that most are likely to fail. The middle men get rich linking the investors with potential projects. 

[Animis]

2 minutes ago, ChinaOwl said:

 

I am talking about the guys that act as in intermediateries or agents. Investors know that there is a very big risk of losing money in football. They simply spread the risk among several different innvestments and accept that most are likely to fail. The middle men get rich linking the investors with potential projects. 

 

I see - I've never really understood the attractiveness of football investment, other than the top few clubs who can generate significant turnover and profits. I suppose for these investors, its that hope, although there's got to be a better; safer and more guaranteed RoI vehicle than the likes of a provincial championship club. The other motivation is of course personal - the fame, prestige, glamour of 'owning' an English football club, particularly for a foreign investor. Hidden investors get no exposure or benefit of this and DC looks rather uncomfortable.

 

I also would have thought that the agents would be paid on some form of insensitive basis based on results. Can't see them making much at present.

[ChinaOwl]

1 minute ago, Animis said:

 

I see - I've never really understood the attractiveness of football investment, other than the top few clubs who can generate significant turnover and profits. I suppose for these investors, its that hope, although there's got to be a better; safer and more guaranteed RoI vehicle than the likes of a provincial championship club. The other motivation is of course personal - the fame, prestige, glamour of 'owning' an English football club, particularly for a foreign investor. Hidden investors get no exposure or benefit of this and DC looks rather uncomfortable.

 

I also would have thought that the agents would be paid on some form of insensitive basis based on results. Can't see them making much at present.

 

People get into things for all kinds of nefarious or clandestine reasons. About five years ago, there was a rush in interest for the nouveau riche in China to get capital offshore through investments. There are groups of business people out there that dream about owning Premier League football clubs but individually they are not cash rich enough to do it. They can form consortia or hedge funds and back other primary investors.

 

It is always a risk but it is one they can afford to take. It also opens opportunities for these business people overseas not directly related to football. Since that time, the Chinese government closed windows for overseas investment so it is now difficult for the same people to get money out of the country. It will get even more difficult if Hong Kong free markets are closed.

[Animis]

8 minutes ago, ChinaOwl said:

 

People get into things for all kinds of nefarious or clandestine reasons. About five years ago, there was a rush in interest for the nouveau riche in China to get capital offshore through investments. There are groups of business people out there that dream about owning Premier League football clubs but individually they are not cash rich enough to do it. They can form consortia or hedge funds and back other primary investors.

 

It is always a risk but it is one they can afford to take. It also opens opportunities for these business people overseas not directly related to football. Since that time, the Chinese government closed windows for overseas investment so it is now difficult for the same people to get money out of the country. It will get even more difficult if Hong Kong free markets are closed.

 

Thanks for the insight.

 

So, this doesn't pose well for the football clubs, if the investors' choose to stop the annual funding of the club, or the Chinese Government blocks further money coming out.

 

I suppose the nuclear option for them is to sell their investment at a loss and move on.

[S36 OWL]

58 minutes ago, Animis said:

 

So you are implying that we could be 'owned' by a collection of far East investors, with DC as the figure-head?

 

Put it this way, I've always been of the opinion that a certain "advisor" to Chansiri, who has well known links to the far East through his sports management company is more than just an advisor on transfer policy. 

[ChinaOwl]

3 minutes ago, Animis said:

 

Thanks for the insight.

 

So, this doesn't pose well for the football clubs, if the investors' choose to stop the annual funding of the club, or the Chinese Government blocks further money coming out.

 

I suppose the nuclear option for them is to sell their investment at a loss and move on.

 

The reality is that high wealth individuals, of which there are now many in China, will get money out of the country at any opportunity. Western currencies are more stable are not restricted by socialist monetary systems. The Chinese government did briefly open up foreign investment channels when it seemed like a win-win situation resulting in equal or greater inward investment. That channel has now been firmly closed and only selected people get the same opportunities, (usually those directly connected to the Beijing government hence Chinese investment in football has taken a hit). 

[S36 OWL]

49 minutes ago, ChinaOwl said:

 

I am talking about the guys that act as in intermediateries or agents. Investors know that there is a very big risk of losing money in football. They simply spread the risk among several different innvestments and accept that most are likely to fail. The middle men get rich linking the investors with potential projects. 

 

I suppose that would depend the said agents actually have a vested interest in the club themselves, and have an active day to day role in the club. 

[ChinaOwl]

1 minute ago, S36 OWL said:

 

I suppose that would depend the said agents actually have a vested interest in the club themselves, and have an active day to day role in the club. 

 

The one I was referring to (SY) simple had the contacts in the far east, a reputation in football that worked to his advantage, and connections in the UK looking for potential buyers e.g. MM. Connect two sets of people together, do the donkey work and take the commission from both parties. Nice little earner and has the added advantage of avoiding having to watch BCFC.

[Guest Grandad]

11 minutes ago, S36 OWL said:

 

Put it this way, I've always been of the opinion that a certain "advisor" to Chansiri, who has well known links to the far East through his sports management company is more than just an advisor on transfer policy. 

 

This has long been my own worry

[Animis]

51 minutes ago, ChinaOwl said:

 

The reality is that high wealth individuals, of which there are now many in China, will get money out of the country at any opportunity. Western currencies are more stable are not restricted by socialist monetary systems. The Chinese government did briefly open up foreign investment channels when it seemed like a win-win situation resulting in equal or greater inward investment. That channel has now been firmly closed and only selected people get the same opportunities, (usually those directly connected to the Beijing government hence Chinese investment in football has taken a hit). 

 

What's the motivation in getting money out of the country, when it is essentially paying a loss-making business' debt?

[ChinaOwl]

1 minute ago, Animis said:

 

What's the motivation in getting money out of the country, when it is essentially paying a loss-making business' debt?

 

Because if you look at the way that money launderers work, having legitimate business investments is often a cover for other activities. It does not necessarly mean illegal activity but sometimes having a visible investment overseas makes it easier to conduct other financial transactions or a bridge to opening non related business activity. There are other reasons as well such as business kudos created. The risk for investors in consortia or hedging groups is relatively small compared to potential gains.

[S36 OWL]

57 minutes ago, Grandad said:

 

This has long been my own worry

 

I find it strange for someone who is supposed to be merely an advisor on transfers to spend so much time at the club even outside of the transfer window. 

[Animis]

5 minutes ago, ChinaOwl said:

 

Because if you look at the way that money launderers work, having legitimate business investments is often a cover for other activities. It does not necessarly mean illegal activity but sometimes having a visible investment overseas makes it easier to conduct other financial transactions or a bridge to opening non related business activity. There are other reasons as well such as business kudos created. The risk for investors in consortia or hedging groups is relatively small compared to potential gains.

 

But surely the HMRC's rules on anti money laundering would prevent UK-based businesses being involved in this practice. The EFL also have their own Directors & Owners test.