Past Member Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 11 minutes ago, Grandad said: This has been a stick used to beat the manager and team for the second half of the season Anybody who had watched us home and away in that first half of the season knew it was a false position. We really didnt deserve to be there False position after 10 games maybe, but not after 20+ games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manwë Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 It takes something special to get down to the level of mess that we've found ourselves up to our knees in. The answer isn't binarу, it's the perfect harmony between a chairman who doesn't really have a clue about anything (football or business), a manager who is poor to middling with a squad that either doesn't care or doesn't have the quality to produce anything decent. All those things collided this year to give us one game away from League One potentially at a cost of tens of millions of pounds and the loss of our ground. Wonderful. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 minute ago, Grandad said: Do you think there is any mileage in the claim that it was the discussions over new contracts to the squad that led to the fall in form? I don't know, it seems too much of a coincidence not to have been a factor but still shouldn't have caused such a drop off and who would this be affecting anyway? Forestieri - hardly ever involved anyway, Fox, didn't see a noticeable downturn in his own performance, Fletcher - injured for much of the year, Nuhiu, has done OK recently, Hutchinson, cast aside for other reasons anyway, Lee- don't see him as downing tools at any point based on perhaps being told he wouldn't get another deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIGHERSTATE Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I am pretty much at the point that I reckon DCs thinks he can just throw money (backed up by his legal team) at things and they will always come out on top. In fact over the last 20 years a LOT of Championship chairman have had this belief. His stubbornness stopped him getting advice from the right people and he turned to the wrong people in his naivety. It annoys me that he hasn't appeared to engage in the football world or fans on a level footing, as well as trying to understand the transfer market or keeping a squad fresh (Maybe i'm wrong). It sounds like he has conducted his business with agents and has very few contacts in football. To be honest it looks as if he just doesn't get it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deepcar_lights Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 28 minutes ago, HIGHERSTATE said: Blame culture... Not really healthy though is it. At least it give people something to do. Ahh Culture, yes I forget about that sometimes, it's everywhere Fans & Club though, when always looking to pull down and blame, only works against the ideal we're all striving for..... Success! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, zzmdu said: False position after 10 games maybe, but not after 20+ games. The table was very tight and it could be argued that 3rd wasn't reflective but we were certainly good enough on merit for top 8/10 at worse at that stage and I don't think we had conceded more than two goals in any game at that time. You can point the finger at the owner for the overall predicament but you can't blame the owner for the contrast that followed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sMacLean Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Mike Ashley for going for Bruce. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deepcar_lights Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 31 minutes ago, @owlstalk said: It's not 'blame' culture It's fans trying to understand what's happening, what's causing the underperformance, what's behind the issues etc It says 'blame' in the thread title. It literally says blame right here in the title. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Past Member Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Just now, hirstyboywonder said: The table was very tight and it could be argued that 3rd wasn't reflective but we were certainly good enough on merit for top 8/10 at worse at that stage and I don't think we had conceded more than two goals in any game at that time. You can point the finger at the owner for the overall predicament but you can't blame the owner for the contrast that followed. Exactly, the state of the club, down to Chansiri. The collapse of the team, down to Monk. Both are interlinked, but Monks done nothing to suggest he's good enough. The timing of Newcastle's offer wrecked our season. Can't blame monk or Chansiri for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSandersonOWL Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I am very surprised that Atdhe Nuhui and Pelepussy are not on this list of only two to blame. Many on here would have surely voted for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonofbert2 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Bruce was a huge factor. Christmas and whatever went on was also a huge factor. The biggest problem has been continuing with the same senior group of players and their “legacy” from the first three seasons for too long. The club has had no spine both on and off the pitch. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIGHERSTATE Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 4 minutes ago, TheOwlsofDodworth said: ideal we're all striving for..... Success! You're right, I agree. I just always think fans overestimate the influence on the club they support. The club just look at the how many fans will turn up regardless of where we are, the prices and how crap we are. And there always will be that core support that keeps the club ticking over. There is a lot of fans that don't know or even care about the inner workings of the club and still think DC is a fine chairman and figurehead of our club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat blondeau Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 5 minutes ago, sMacLean said: Mike Ashley for going for Bruce. We’d have still been charged by the EFL for FFP breaches and misconduct if Bruce was here. Realistically we were never going to have a good season with that charge hanging over us since November whoever was managing us. And who do you blame for that and having to sell the ground in the first place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, zzmdu said: Exactly, the state of the club, down to Chansiri. The collapse of the team, down to Monk. Both are interlinked, but Monks done nothing to suggest he's good enough. The timing of Newcastle's offer wrecked our season. Can't blame monk or Chansiri for this. On December 25th, Garry Monk had managed his squad to this position in games under his charge: Since Dec 25th he has managed this with the same squad available plus the January loan signings: As manager he is ultimately responsible for this and has been working under the same conditions throughout this time. I don't think the 2nd table includes yesterdays results which leaves us even further behind the rest of the division other than Hull. Edited July 19, 2020 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carbone Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 hour ago, TheOwlsofDodworth said: Why do we want to look for someone to blame? Because we are in a terrible mess and should try and identify why it’s going wrong and whose responsibility it is 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIGHERSTATE Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 2 minutes ago, sonofbert2 said: continuing with the same senior group of players and their “legacy” from the first three seasons for too long. ......like a 'family'... UGGH! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 minute ago, sonofbert2 said: Bruce was a huge factor. It was, but Chansiri's decision to allow the transfer window to close before bringing in a new manager was crazy. Just now, sonofbert2 said: Christmas and whatever went on was also a huge factor. I'm not one for conspiracy theories, but I keep coming back to this - something must have gone on around this time which severely impacted the morale and togetherness of our squad. Just now, sonofbert2 said: The biggest problem has been continuing with the same senior group of players and their “legacy” from the first three seasons for too long. The club has had no spine both on and off the pitch. It's hard to argue with this. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveyboy66 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I've never been into the blame culture wherever I've worked...it does not serve any purpose. I've always asked these question instead How can we improve things to prevent this happening again? How can we learn from this? If DC looks at setbacks this way he won't make the same mistakes again. We don't know if he has had these discussions with Monk but Monk has said we will be looking at young hungry players as a way forward and everyone has been asking for that for the last two years. The other thing is...before lockdown we would have laid down and surrendered yesterday in the second half. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nevthelodgemoorowl Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 hour ago, @owlstalk said: I think just saying 'Steve Bruce' is way too simplistic What you have to ask is 'how has Chansiri managed the club since Steve Bruce left?' Has he given us the best possible chance of success? Has he provided his manager with all the tools he needs to do his job? etc etc etc What is simplistic is finger pointing. Bruce was replaced by Monk and he gave everything a shake other than his inherited back room staff. Bruce and the back room staff were very dependent on keeping the key squad members together Monk saw things differently. So we are where we are bereft of quality players; It's not an easy fix, not for Monk or anyone, fingers crossed for a bumpy ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLOwl Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 50 minutes ago, hirstyboywonder said: You don't think the manager should be able to get more out of this squad then 23rd best for half a season by some distance and conceding 3+ goals every other game? All we needed to do from Christmas, when we were 20 points clear of the bottom 3, was match the results of the worst 3 teams in the division and a points deduction would not be causing any relegation concerns. You could put guardiola or klopp in charge of this team but the individual errors would still be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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