Garry Monk Sheffield Wednesday Manager

[@owlstalk]

1 minute ago, Plonk said:

I understand that but monk has been sacked at Every club he has been at. 

Steve Bruce has been sacked by clubs

At other clubs he has ran off before getting out of any bad spell or before encountering any real issues.

At the clubs where he's had bad results he's been sacked.

[Owls Loyal]

It is true that most managers end up getting the sack.

 

Even Arsene Wenger's departure from Arsenal after 22 years in charge had a sour ending.

 

But Monk is only 41 and has already been fired by Swansea City, Middlesborough and Birmingham.  All pretty short stays.

 

Even Leeds where Monk could rightly say that he would have been kept on everything imploded in the last 8 games of the season and they missed out on the Play Off''s.  Their supporters were far from happy.

 

Monk has never won anything as a football manager and I saw nothing at SWFC to suggest that he ever will.

[@owlstalk]

3 minutes ago, Plonk said:

I fear for the quality of players he will bring in 

 

Let's be honest on this one mate. Even if you fired the manager as you want to, and got someone else in, do you honestly, genuinely, really believe that this football club is set up to bring in amazing players right now?

[@owlstalk]

Just now, Owls Loyal said:

Monk has never won anything as a football manager and I saw nothing at SWFC to suggest that he ever will.

So which manager would you get that has won stuff?

Who do you mean by that? Which managers are you referring to that we should have got instead of Monk?

[@owlstalk]

Just now, Dagmeister's Shadow said:

Personally I'm inclined to objectively judge him after he's been able to purge the rot and shape his own squad and after a pre-season to prepare properly albeit any preparation for a restart of activities will be so different to the norm.

 

 

Which would and should always be the sensible approach

[Owls Loyal]

It is a poisoned chalice to put forward a manager's name on here as an alternative because we all have different views.

 

However at the time Monk was appointed I would have preferred Gary Rowett because he built a good Burton Albion side and did pretty well at Brum and Derby though it all went wrong at Stoke.

 

Interestingly he was made Manager of Millwall shortly after we appointed Monk and they have been doing very well since.

[@owlstalk]

Just now, Owls Loyal said:

It is a poisoned chalice to put forward a manager's name on here as an alternative because we all have different views.

 

However at the time Monk was appointed I would have preferred Gary Rowett because he built a good Burton Albion side and did pretty well at Brum and Derby though it all went wrong at Stoke.

 

Interestingly he was made Manager of Millwall shortly after we appointed Monk and they have been doing very well since.

 

I'm not familiar with what Rowett has won mate so can't comment on his abilities.

What has Rowett won as a manager?

[mcmigo]

I know a couple of people who have coached with Monk over the years. Both experienced, both very much their own people and don’t hide anything in terms of opinions, and they both really rate him. He is by all accounts a very hard worker , very detailed on the training ground and in  match prep. Given the manager has little say in squad additions, then a coach of this nature is what we need
Unless major repair work done to the squad though we have no chance. We were so poor from Jan to March. Wickham, da Cruz, borner, Palmer, Joey, Lee, Dawson , even Iorfa and Bannan at times, were appalling. You can be as good a manager as their is in the game, but joi aren’t going to get any sort of tune out of a loan striker that can’t run in Wickham , and a loan ‘ player’ in da Cruz who is by far the worst player in the league.

 

[gurujuan]

I never wanted Monk, so I’m probably not the best person to answer this question, but what have others seen, that makes them so sure he is the right man for the job? 

[@owlstalk]

6 minutes ago, mcmigo said:

I know a couple of people who have coached with Monk over the years. Both experienced, both very much their own people and don’t hide anything in terms of opinions, and they both really rate him. He is by all accounts a very hard worker , very detailed on the training ground and in  match prep. Given the manager has little say in squad additions, then a coach of this nature is what we need
Unless major repair work done to the squad though we have no chance. We were so poor from Jan to March. Wickham, da Cruz, borner, Palmer, Joey, Lee, Dawson , even Iorfa and Bannan at times, were appalling. You can be as good a manager as their is in the game, but joi aren’t going to get any sort of tune out of a loan striker that can’t run in Wickham , and a loan ‘ player’ in da Cruz who is by far the worst player in the league.

 

 

Agreed

Plus anyone who tells me that Garry Monk spent weeks in Italy scouting Da Cruz has to be off their heads. He's not the one bringing players to the club.

[gurujuan]

4 minutes ago, Dagmeister's Shadow said:

Not so much what makes me sure that he is, more a case of waiting to see what a proper rebuild will bring. There's clearly been a persistent issue that needs resolving decisively. 

There are doubts for me sure but equally there are things that I've seen, read and heard including from some of our players that suggest he's not the pariah portrayed. Not much point me debating the specifics as views are too far entrenched.

As I say for me it's a wait and see what pre-season, prune and rebuild brings.

Over the years I've not seen many merits in constantly churning managers either.

Fair enough, but on the evidence of his January dealings, would you trust him with recruitment? If you believe that recruitment is not down to the manager, something I might agree on, then you want a manager who is tactically astute, and is a good man manager, able to work with whatever he is given. 
I’m not sure we’ve seen that he can even do that

[darra]

43 minutes ago, Plonk said:

Or look at his record which shows it’s true. If not why does keep getting sacked?

 

Why do managers et al keep. getting sacked? The stat is about a year or so old but the last time I saw anything the average time before getting sacked of an EFL manager is around 18 months

[mcmigo]

11 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

Fair enough, but on the evidence of his January dealings, would you trust him with recruitment? If you believe that recruitment is not down to the manager, something I might agree on, then you want a manager who is tactically astute, and is a good man manager, able to work with whatever he is given. 
I’m not sure we’ve seen that he can even do that

You can give da Cruz and a one quarter fit Wickham to any coach and any team in the league, and you won’t get a tune out of them. As Neil has pointed out, it seems absurd that monk scouted and brought in da Cruz. 

[gurujuan]

3 minutes ago, mcmigo said:

You can give da Cruz and a one quarter fit Wickham to any coach and any team in the league, and you won’t get a tune out of them. As Neil has pointed out, it seems absurd that monk scouted and brought in da Cruz. 

But that’s the way it’s always been under DC, I can remember saying the same during Carlos’s tenure. 
It’s the modern way I suppose, but then as I said, you look for someone who can work with the players he has

[Guest LondonOwl313]

10 minutes ago, darra said:

Why do managers et al keep. getting sacked? The stat is about a year or so old but the last time I saw anything the average time before getting sacked of an EFL manager is around 18 months

Tbh I don't think its the getting sacked part that's the problem. All managers get sacked unless they're Ferguson, Guardiola or Klopp. Most managers have a shelf life of maybe 3-4 years if they're successful then they have to move on. The issue with Monk is that he's never managed a team for a complete whole season and done well. He's done well in spells, but it's always fallen apart the same season. How can you achieve anything if you're unable to be consistent for 12 months... you can't really.

 

On top of that, his tactics and subs are questionable. People like to blame the players for the number of last minute goals we've conceded this season but that didn't happen under any of the other managers we've had. The tactics play a big part in that. Then there's his mana management skills... banishing players under contract is never a good thing. Even if he doesn't fancy Westwood or Hutchinson, he doesn't have to play them but we gain nothing from making them stay away. Just don't feel like he's the right man regardless of what other options (or lack of) are out there.. seen nothing to suggest he's going to build a team to get us promoted

[@owlstalk]

3 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

People like to blame the players for the number of last minute goals we've conceded this season but that didn't happen under any of the other managers we've had. The tactics play a big part in that. 

 

 

This statement is really confusing me

What tactics are you suggesting that Monk's using to concede late goals?

[Beighton Owl 87]

7 minutes ago, LondonOwl313 said:

Tbh I don't think its the getting sacked part that's the problem. All managers get sacked unless they're Ferguson, Guardiola or Klopp. Most managers have a shelf life of maybe 3-4 years if they're successful then they have to move on. The issue with Monk is that he's never managed a team for a complete whole season and done well. He's done well in spells, but it's always fallen apart the same season. How can you achieve anything if you're unable to be consistent for 12 months... you can't really.

 

On top of that, his tactics and subs are questionable. People like to blame the players for the number of last minute goals we've conceded this season but that didn't happen under any of the other managers we've had. The tactics play a big part in that. Then there's his mana management skills... banishing players under contract is never aeople like to blame the players for the number of last minute goals we've conceded this season but that didn't happen under any of the other managers we've had. good thing. Even if he doesn't fancy Westwood or Hutchinson, he doesn't have to play them but we gain nothing from making them stay away. Just don't feel like he's the right man regardless of what other options (or lack of) are out there.. seen nothing to suggest he's going to build a team to get us promoted

Factually incorrect. It's happened a fair few times over the last few years.

[matthefish2002]

4 minutes ago, Beighton Owl 87 said:

Factually incorrect. It's happened a fair few times over the last few years.

 

I agree for as long as I have watched Wednesday we are notorious for letting in late goals.

[Guest LondonOwl313]

6 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

 

This statement is really confusing me

What tactics are you suggesting that Monk's using to concede late goals?

 

I just mean the dropping deep, defensive substitutions etc. My point is, I can't recall it happening anywhere nearly as frequently under Carlos or Bruce, or even Jos. Maybe it's because the players are getting older as I've seen some people say but I'm not sure that would make it happen.

 

1 minute ago, Beighton Owl 87 said:

Factually incorrect. It's happened a fair few times over the last few years.

Are you sure? Name some games then where it happened to jog my memory. I can't recall any under Bruce, apart from maybe Norwich away. I don't recall many games under Carlos where we threw points away at the end. Also can't remember Jos throwing away winning positions either, not that he got us into that position very often 

[Beighton Owl 87]

Just now, matthefish2002 said:

 

I agree for as long as I have watched Wednesday we are notorious for letting in late goals.

In the short time Steve Bruce was hear we conceded a few late goals villa and Norwich spring to mind. Before that under luhukay too.