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Interesting tweet (if genuine)

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Posted (edited)

I just wonder if our wage structure is an absolute disaster in times of a struggle - where nothing they do is penalising their earnings whatsoever.

 

I'm talking club-wide contractual decisions that are utterly detrimental to a player's motivation - would certainly explain a 'cultural' problem.

 

We know they get a huge wage - I get the impression the numbers are ridiculous.  Some are on a lot more than others - which is something else that doesn't help.  Especially when the big earners don't 'earn' that money whatsoever.

 

Perhaps they don't get goal bonuses, clean sheet bonuses, appearance fees - so therefore they don't care whether they do or don't play, or score?  Just one massive wage that they get regardless of results or performances.

 

Or maybe they get huge bonuses for achieving very little?  Like playing 20 games, for example.  Job done already if so for most.

 

Perhaps they've already got deals lined up by their agents, so they really don't care whether they play or not?  Paid in full while they're injured - do they really want to get back playing for a club they're going to leave?

 

Perhaps these decisions were made in order to get them to join the club in the first place.  I'm sure plenty others around the world are like this - but get them all together in one club, combine that with clumsy mistakes, players with VERY frail mentalities (there really are no leaders - look at our last minute collapses) then its a horrible combination.

 

No pressure, no competition for their place, huge wages, weak mentality - its a bad combination for sure. 

 

Personally, I think while some of the above may be very true, I think its a complete lack of structure and leadership in the club that is the underlying problem.  I think all the stories of DC using SWFC as a 'toy' of sorts for personal ego and his family is bang on true.  He doesn't want anyone telling him what to do and what to spend his money on.  He can't take personal criticism, insisting he's "doing his best" - but that best is just woefully wide of the mark and no-one is aloowed in to help guide him.  This might not be so bad if we had a structure of management below him who kept him in-line and 

 

All this about SWFC being a family, where no players are sold, we already know IS true.  These stories of last minute hikes in transfer fees for the like sof Jordan Rhodes (actually... we now want £1 million pounds please") is all too true. 

 

Its all led to a horribly comfy scenario where players have felt 100% at ease all the time.  No management structure of the club itself, no clear plans, no objectives, no investment plans (albeit anything would be restricted under FFP anyway) - and this EFL charge is looking more and more likely to go through with every passing day.  Its ridiculous that we can suddenly sell the stadium to ourselves for a ridiculous value, place it in the previous year's accounts (which we conveniently delayed) and think we can get away with it - but that just about sums up the lack of commercial awareness, experience and structure we have at the club.

 

Everything adds up - the god-awful scouting system, hap-hazard management appointments, the woeful commercial department and merchandise, awful catering, badly thought out commercial ideas like a 10 year season ticket and gold plated seat, overpriced tickets, shirts... the list goes on and on and on...

 

This first half of the season - we've fluked it, its as simple as that.  We've seen it before - the performances we put in are largely poor yet we sometimes get away with it through individual excellence of some of our players.  Is it any wonder we're struggling now, really?  Feels to me like this period is our 'norm' and the first half of the season was the exception to that.  

Edited by davey_wells
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5 minutes ago, davey_wells said:

I just wonder if our wage structure is an absolute disaster in times of a struggle - where nothing they do is penalising their earnings whatsoever.

 

I'm talking club-wide contractual decisions that are utterly detrimental to a player's motivation - would certainly explain a 'cultural' problem.

 

We know they get a huge wage - I get the impression the numbers are ridiculous.  Some are on a lot more than others - which is something else that doesn't help.  Especially when the big earners don't 'earn' that money whatsoever.

 

Perhaps they don't get goal bonuses, clean sheet bonuses, appearance fees - so therefore they don't care whether they do or don't play, or score?  Just one massive wage that they get regardless of results or performances.

 

Or maybe they get huge bonuses for achieving very little?  Like playing 20 games, for example.  Job done already if so for most.

 

Perhaps they've already got deals lined up by their agents, so they really don't care whether they play or not?  Paid in full while they're injured - do they really want to get back playing for a club they're going to leave?

 

Perhaps these decisions were made in order to get them to join the club in the first place.  I'm sure plenty others around the world are like this - but get them all together in one club, combine that with clumsy mistakes, players with VERY frail mentalities (there really are no leaders - look at our last minute collapses) then its a horrible combination.

 

No pressure, no competition for their place, huge wages, weak mentality - its a bad combination for sure. 

 

Personally, I think while some of the above may be very true, I think its a complete lack of structure and leadership in the club that is the underlying problem.  I think all the stories of DC using SWFC as a 'toy' of sorts for personal ego and his family is bang on true.  He doesn't want anyone telling him what to do and what to spend his money on.  He can't take personal criticism, insisting he's "doing his best" - but that best is just woefully wide of the mark and no-one is aloowed in to help guide him.  This might not be so bad if we had a structure of management below him who kept him in-line and 

 

All this about SWFC being a family, where no players are sold, we already know IS true.  These stories of last minute hikes in transfer fees for the like sof Jordan Rhodes (actually... we now want £1 million pounds please") is all too true. 

 

Its all led to a horribly comfy scenario where players have felt 100% at ease all the time.  No management structure of the club itself, no clear plans, no objectives, no investment plans (albeit anything would be restricted under FFP anyway) - and this EFL charge is looking more and more likely to go through with every passing day.  Its ridiculous that we can suddenly sell the stadium to ourselves for a ridiculous value, place it in the previous year's accounts (which we conveniently delayed) and think we can get away with it - but that just about sums up the lack of commercial awareness, experience and structure we have at the club.

 

Everything adds up - the god-awful scouting system, hap-hazard management appointments, the woeful commercial department and merchandise, awful catering, badly thought out commercial ideas like a 10 year season ticket and gold plated seat, overpriced tickets, shirts... the list goes on and on and on...

 

This first half of the season - we've fluked it, its as simple as that.  We've seen it before - the performances we put in are largely poor yet we sometimes get away with it through individual excellence of some of our players.  Is it any wonder we're struggling now, really?  Feels to me like this period is our 'norm' and the first half of the season was the exception to that.  


Brilliant post. 

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12 hours ago, darra said:

found this on Twitter. 

Monk had his targets and deals for 4 players leaving. Chansiri got none of Monks targets, scuppered deals for players going out by being like a child asking too much money again. And then panicked and used Doyen again to bring in these panic buys. 

Monk dealt a crap hand.

 

Sounds possible except that Doyen doesn't have anything to do with the club anymore?

Sounds plausible but why his he playing Cruz ?

unless he is being instructed to !

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9 minutes ago, hugeowl said:

Sounds plausible but why his he playing Cruz ?

unless he is being instructed to !


Yes there will often be an agreement to play loan players for a percentage of games, or there’s a larger loan fee to pay. If they don’t.  

 

What a mess we are in till May   

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2 minutes ago, Owls-Fan said:


Yes there will often be an agreement to play loan players for a percentage of games, or there’s a larger loan fee to pay. If they don’t.  

 

What a mess we are in till May   

 

Surely if Garry Monk had any integrity he'd just force a big pay-off if this was laid on his plate?

 

It completely undermines him as a manager.

 

Also, this quote at the time he signed suggests Monk is more than happy to play Da Cruz...

 

"Monk said: “Alessio is a player I know well through contacts.

"He fits the profile that we need. He is young, athletic, quick and we don't have that option in the squad. He comes with a hunger and a desire.

"Those are the type of players you need when you are recruiting.

"We are delighted he is in the building. He is something that we have not got.

"He can play in other positions but his main position is striker. It was important that we added that type of player so I am delighted he is here.”

 

Personally just think he was a very cheap (free) option that was all we could achieve in January.

 

Just in the same way that Wickham was free (Palace wanted him away to get fitness) and Windass wanted to get out of Wigan and they were more than happy to let him leave too.

 

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Posted (edited)

Don't doubt the players we brought in during January were not first choice. Panic deals of sorts, given we needed fresh faces. In principle, ok on paper, but Wickham doesnt look fit, Windass only given limited playing time despite scoring twice and not seen anything from Da Cruz yet. 

 

Successive managers reportedly frustrated with barriers to moving players out, suggests some truth in that rumour.

Edited by striker

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15 hours ago, modboy said:

Monk is like the supply teacher who doesn't know how to control the class.

 

No coincidence they listened to Bruce, a legend who'd been there and done it.

 

 

Bruce them ran..... 

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Dunno why Bruce gets the hard time he does from some fans

 

He got offered a much better gig with an emotional attachment - and took it

 

What's the drama?

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41 minutes ago, scram said:

Dunno why Bruce gets the hard time he does from some fans

 

He got offered a much better gig with an emotional attachment - and took it

 

What's the drama?

 

Depresing thing is that idiot in charge of Newcastle makes much better proposal then us, Premiership, or not... Ashley is a known trouble, yet Bruce knew how bad deal he would have got here.. 

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14 hours ago, darra said:

found this on Twitter. 

Monk had his targets and deals for 4 players leaving. Chansiri got none of Monks targets, scuppered deals for players going out by being like a child asking too much money again. And then panicked and used Doyen again to bring in these panic buys. 

Monk dealt a crap hand.

 

Sounds possible except that Doyen doesn't have anything to do with the club anymore?

 

Paxo is Doyens man , always has been . His ties with them go back a long way 

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7 hours ago, davey_wells said:

 

Surely if Garry Monk had any integrity he'd just force a big pay-off if this was laid on his plate?

 

It completely undermines him as a manager.

 

Also, this quote at the time he signed suggests Monk is more than happy to play Da Cruz...

 

"Monk said: “Alessio is a player I know well through contacts.

"He fits the profile that we need. He is young, athletic, quick and we don't have that option in the squad. He comes with a hunger and a desire.

"Those are the type of players you need when you are recruiting.

"We are delighted he is in the building. He is something that we have not got.

"He can play in other positions but his main position is striker. It was important that we added that type of player so I am delighted he is here.”

 

Personally just think he was a very cheap (free) option that was all we could achieve in January.

 

Just in the same way that Wickham was free (Palace wanted him away to get fitness) and Windass wanted to get out of Wigan and they were more than happy to let him leave too.

 


Not disagreeing with you,  I was saying why Da Cruz is still being picked despite being ineffective.  Maybe Monk did know and choose to sign him, but he now has to play him for the loan deal reasons I mentioned. 
 

Incidentally I remember Stuart Gray said he was delighted to get Sergio Bus in the building when he signed. Then when he left Wednesday revealed he had no idea who he was.  

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On 08/03/2020 at 13:49, hirstyboywonder said:

 

Who out of our current squad is going to retire at the end of this season?

who'd buy any of them 

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, steelowl said:

who'd buy any of them 

 

Nobody will but many if any of our players that are under contract in which case we are stuck with them, they won't retire. The ones out of contract will all find a club at some level. You said some would pack it all in, who were you referring to?

Edited by hirstyboywonder

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16 hours ago, malek said:

 

Depresing thing is that idiot in charge of Newcastle makes much better proposal then us, Premiership, or not... Ashley is a known trouble, yet Bruce knew how bad deal he would have got here.. 

 

I thought it was a bit rich of DC to cry about it, considering how short-term Bruce's contract was. If DC was that invested in Bruce, secure his services for more than a bleeding year!!

 

The whole episode with Ashley seemed more about DC's feelings being hurt than it did of DC realising how damaging for the club it was to lose a respectable manager and his coaching staff. The £2m compensation was to repair the damage done to DC's ego.

 

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On 08/03/2020 at 22:17, davey_wells said:

I just wonder if our wage structure is an absolute disaster in times of a struggle - where nothing they do is penalising their earnings whatsoever.

 

I'm talking club-wide contractual decisions that are utterly detrimental to a player's motivation - would certainly explain a 'cultural' problem.

 

We know they get a huge wage - I get the impression the numbers are ridiculous.  Some are on a lot more than others - which is something else that doesn't help.  Especially when the big earners don't 'earn' that money whatsoever.

 

Perhaps they don't get goal bonuses, clean sheet bonuses, appearance fees - so therefore they don't care whether they do or don't play, or score?  Just one massive wage that they get regardless of results or performances.

 

Or maybe they get huge bonuses for achieving very little?  Like playing 20 games, for example.  Job done already if so for most.

 

Perhaps they've already got deals lined up by their agents, so they really don't care whether they play or not?  Paid in full while they're injured - do they really want to get back playing for a club they're going to leave?

 

Perhaps these decisions were made in order to get them to join the club in the first place.  I'm sure plenty others around the world are like this - but get them all together in one club, combine that with clumsy mistakes, players with VERY frail mentalities (there really are no leaders - look at our last minute collapses) then its a horrible combination.

 

No pressure, no competition for their place, huge wages, weak mentality - its a bad combination for sure. 

 

Personally, I think while some of the above may be very true, I think its a complete lack of structure and leadership in the club that is the underlying problem.  I think all the stories of DC using SWFC as a 'toy' of sorts for personal ego and his family is bang on true.  He doesn't want anyone telling him what to do and what to spend his money on.  He can't take personal criticism, insisting he's "doing his best" - but that best is just woefully wide of the mark and no-one is aloowed in to help guide him.  This might not be so bad if we had a structure of management below him who kept him in-line and 

 

All this about SWFC being a family, where no players are sold, we already know IS true.  These stories of last minute hikes in transfer fees for the like sof Jordan Rhodes (actually... we now want £1 million pounds please") is all too true. 

 

Its all led to a horribly comfy scenario where players have felt 100% at ease all the time.  No management structure of the club itself, no clear plans, no objectives, no investment plans (albeit anything would be restricted under FFP anyway) - and this EFL charge is looking more and more likely to go through with every passing day.  Its ridiculous that we can suddenly sell the stadium to ourselves for a ridiculous value, place it in the previous year's accounts (which we conveniently delayed) and think we can get away with it - but that just about sums up the lack of commercial awareness, experience and structure we have at the club.

 

Everything adds up - the god-awful scouting system, hap-hazard management appointments, the woeful commercial department and merchandise, awful catering, badly thought out commercial ideas like a 10 year season ticket and gold plated seat, overpriced tickets, shirts... the list goes on and on and on...

 

This first half of the season - we've fluked it, its as simple as that.  We've seen it before - the performances we put in are largely poor yet we sometimes get away with it through individual excellence of some of our players.  Is it any wonder we're struggling now, really?  Feels to me like this period is our 'norm' and the first half of the season was the exception to that.  

Top notch post

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On 08/03/2020 at 08:16, ANDY said:

 


A very long tweet that tells us nothing.

 

It all looks like a load of poo.

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On 09/03/2020 at 17:08, steelowl said:

who'd buy any of them 

Bannan is the best midfielder in the league, FF is the best player in the league, Iorfa is close to being called up to an England squad in the near future and Westwood is the best keeper in the league. 
 

Surely someone must be interested in any of these players given their pedigree?

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Senior players that don't care then:

 

Palmer, Fox, Borner, Iorfa, Lees, Lee, Bannan, Fletcher, Harris and Forestieri.

 

Performances suggest, Fox, Borner, Iorfa, Lee, Bannan, Forestieri Harris and Fletcher care.

 

Palmer isn't a kid anymore and should be banging people out in the changing room, however, he's very laid back.

 

Tom Lees is a weird one, performances are weak but he retains the armband, surely if he wasn't getting vocal or angry then he would lose it.

 

Windass, Wickham, De Cruz and Murphy on loan.

 

Dawson a youngster really.

 

Not having it.

 

Now if Rhodes, Westwood, Winnall and Hutch are the players not caring then it shouldn't be impacting results.

 

However, Westwood and Hutch have always given 100% even when not in the best form.

 

None of it makes any sense.

 

The only option is the players have lost faith in Monk and are collectively trying to get rid.

 

 

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