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Blaming the manager misses the bigger picture


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3 minutes ago, Hitcat said:

 

Hi. Yes indeed, but they're also a club that will always sell it's better players and therefore never progress further than they are at the moment.

We'll have to agree to disagree Hitcat. In many peoples eyes Brentford are already over achieving and developing further, is that not enough to be impressed no? I know which model I'd prefer. 

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The blame lays squarely with Chansiri, he came in to a club which was largely a blank canvas, spent money and has systematically taken us back years with his clueless leadership.

The man needs to wise up or feck off, he is running the show like a bloody pub team and if he isn't prepared to sell up then he needs to get someone on board who knows how to run a club because promotion is a million miles away.

As fans we are paying champagne prices whilst been served up a skol product.

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1 minute ago, j-savas said:

We'll have to agree to disagree Hitcat. In many peoples eyes Brentford are already over achieving and developing further, is that not enough to be impressed no? I know which model I'd prefer. 

 

I am impressed with what they've achieved, but I honestly don't believe their model will get them to the Premier League. 

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6 minutes ago, Minton said:

Brentford don't have a youth setup. At all. They closed their academy to save money.

Technically true, a small club that needed to do what it needed to do, but that's not resulted in a lack of youth players. We know what they replaced it with, and its intelligant, outward looking and its worked. You'd like to think a club the size of Wednesday could do both. 

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1 hour ago, j-savas said:

Because without football directors, a comprehensive coaching team, comprehensive scouting networks, up to date training infrastructure, a thriving commercial set up and youth team with players loaned out accordingly, a good analytics team etc we are basically a second rate club that's stuck in the 20th century. The opposite to the Brenfords of this world if you like. 

 

20 years of systemic failings at wednesday with no long term strategic planning, and all a lot of us can do us blame one isolated head coach after another. We as a club need a LONG Term comprehensive, coherent strategic plan going forward in the summer that needs to be presented to the fan base. 

 

My incling though is that we will continue to lerch from one random manager to the next and sign over 25 ex stars such as Whickham to try and paper over the cracks... 

A random manager has worked miracles across the city, all without directors of football and comprehensive coaching teams, his side kick is a former Rotherham manager.  

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Just now, Kameron said:

A random manager has worked miracles across the city, all without directors of football and comprehensive coaching teams, his side kick is a former Rotherham manager.  

Hi kameron. I disagree when you look at the Sheffield Uniteds overall infrastructure compared to ours. In addition I would argue that relying on randomness even in the most ideological of world decreases your chances of success in many aspects of life. 

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2 minutes ago, j-savas said:

Technically true, a small club that needed to do what it needed to do, but that's not resulted in a lack of youth players. We know what they replaced it with, and its intelligant, outward looking and its worked. You'd like to think a club the size of Wednesday could do both. 

 

Not technically true. Actually true. Any young players they have are either bought or loaned for a fee. They spend their money on that rather than a youth setup. Which is only a few bad buys away from leaving them on a slippery slope. It's working well for them right now, but a few bad seasons and all of a sudden they are in the position of having to spend and spend and spend just to keep treading water. 

 

Not for me, thanks.

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1 minute ago, j-savas said:

Hi kameron. I disagree when you look at the Sheffield Uniteds overall infrastructure compared to ours. In addition I would argue that relying on randomness even in the most ideological of world decreases your chances of success in many aspects of life. 

 

United have the same category as us for youth setup. They haven't produced anyone of note recently either. 

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Guest The Horse

Far too obvious a strategy this sustainable and sensible approach.

Chansiri's strategy was simply to step up to the table and go all in.

 

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Unfortunately, he lost and now our strategy is:

 

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Seriously though, we can only hope he's learned some hard lessons and does things right once the P&S dust has settled.

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Just now, Minton said:

 

Not technically true. Actually true. Any young players they have are either bought or loaned for a fee. They spend their money on that rather than a youth setup. Which is only a few bad buys away from leaving them on a slippery slope. It's working well for them right now, but a few bad seasons and all of a sudden they are in the position of having to spend and spend and spend just to keep treading water. 

 

Not for me, thanks.

Fair enough with your opinion Minton. I hope using the world Brentford in the initial post however hasn't distracted from the bigger picture. Perhaps the example wasn't necessarily needed 

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1 hour ago, j-savas said:

Because without football directors, a comprehensive coaching team, comprehensive scouting networks, up to date training infrastructure, a thriving commercial set up and youth team with players loaned out accordingly, a good analytics team etc we are basically a second rate club that's stuck in the 20th century. The opposite to the Brenfords of this world if you like. 

 

20 years of systemic failings at wednesday with no long term strategic planning, and all a lot of us can do us blame one isolated head coach after another. We as a club need a LONG Term comprehensive, coherent strategic plan going forward in the summer that needs to be presented to the fan base. 

 

My incling though is that we will continue to lerch from one random manager to the next and sign over 25 ex stars such as Whickham to try and paper over the cracks... 

Today i think we can blame monk for me he got the subs all wrong for starters forestieri looked are most dangerous player but took him off 

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15 minutes ago, Minton said:

 

United have the same category as us for youth setup. They haven't produced anyone of note recently either. 

David brooks

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1 hour ago, Anlaby Owl said:

Nothing is going to change on the field without the right manager. I grant you that i might be feeling a bit temperamental after todays showing but trying hard to maintain faith in monk is becoming soul destroying.  

your right bud,he picks the team,implement's the system,tells the player's the formation,and should be able to change it if need be,,not wait till 75th min and thro Nuhui on and  hope !!!!!

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We need a long term plan as nothing can be fixed overnight. Think the first step it to clear the decks in the Summer, that should include not renewing the Monk contract. Why? We need to freshen up and I’d like us to bring in a fresh new manager, similar to the clubs that took the risk on the likes of a Lampard and Gerrard.
 

We then need to get our own club identity, similar if you will to Brentford who many think we need to model ourselves on. They’ve been through 3 or 4 managers now where each manager comes in and doesn’t change too much as the players they sign play to a specific system and play it WELL.

 

The one thing I believe will hold us back here is the man at the top of the tree. He’s doesn’t know enough about football to get the infrastructure right and won’t change. If he could sell us then brilliant, best news for a long time. Can’t see it happening anytime soon though. We’re not a good proposition right now.

 

As fans we need to forget the past and look to the future.

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25 minutes ago, Junk Smuggler said:

We need a long term plan as nothing can be fixed overnight. Think the first step it to clear the decks in the Summer, that should include not renewing the Monk contract. Why? We need to freshen up and I’d like us to bring in a fresh new manager, similar to the clubs that took the risk on the likes of a Lampard and Gerrard.
 

We then need to get our own club identity, similar if you will to Brentford who many think we need to model ourselves on. They’ve been through 3 or 4 managers now where each manager comes in and doesn’t change too much as the players they sign play to a specific system and play it WELL.

 

The one thing I believe will hold us back here is the man at the top of the tree. He’s doesn’t know enough about football to get the infrastructure right and won’t change. If he could sell us then brilliant, best news for a long time. Can’t see it happening anytime soon though. We’re not a good proposition right now.

 

As fans we need to forget the past and look to the future.

Agreed. Even if we'd appointed someone like the cowley brothers (like them or not) it may have arguably shown some sort of active planning and thought as to a new direction. Monk like him or not is just a typical 'he's available, let's give him a whirl' Wednesday approach, symptomatic of everything about the club. 

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1 hour ago, j-savas said:

Hi Hitcat. Brentford are a relatively small club that have slowly and carefully progressed with some very intelligent strategies. It's all cumulated in a club punching above its weight, making huge profits on transfers and now moving into an excellent new stadium next season. Its a club that I'm sure most people would envy. 

Excellent ground?  It's a standard issue bore that retains none of the charm of the original. 

 

I like their youth-first initiatives, but that's been hewn in over years of midtable or less.

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1 hour ago, Kameron said:

A random manager has worked miracles across the city, all without directors of football and comprehensive coaching teams, his side kick is a former Rotherham manager.  

United got lucky with Wilder.

 

Is that our plan? Keep sacking managers till we get lucky 

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5 minutes ago, j-savas said:

Agreed. Even if we'd appointed someone like the cowley brothers (like them or not) it may have arguably shown some sort of active planning and thought as to a new direction. Monk like him or not is just a typical 'he's available, let's give him a whirl' Wednesday approach, symptomatic of everything about the club. 

 

Agree. Bring in a manager with his own plan and back it but ultimately that man has to want to invest in youth - no quick fixes. We could have done that 4 years ago and be in a much richer position now. We may well have been in the same division but by investing in youth they are either a success and the investment pays off in sales or not a success and the losses are minimal.

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