Roy Of The Roasters Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 hour ago, torryowl said: Whether he's a decent manager or not is down to people's opinions but to blame him for where we are financially beggars believe . He signed the players. Obviously DC signed the cheques and so has to share the blame, but Carlos signed the players. Steve Bruce showed what was achievable on a fraction of the budget Carlos had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the monk Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 18 minutes ago, vulva said: You been watching the same club as me? If after 55 years watching this lot you were disappointed by a trip to Wembley then I think you might just need to adjust your expectations. Dont know of any other clubs fans that talk fondly of a defeat at Wembley with the prem within sight But like you say my expectations may be a little high , was expecting the team to turn up ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torryowl Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 (edited) 28 minutes ago, handworth52 said: the players what he had either before he came or before he took over from transfers 2016 jan onwards )chansiri said carlos had full control/final say on transfers from then onwards and why we called him head coach he is/was our manager,those were his words . we had westwood,hunt,palmer,lees,loovens,wallace,hooper,bannan ,lee, Hutchinson , forestieri ,pudil ,joao all signed by stuart gray or previous manager and newer ones on that list by committee of rhoder and 2 other guys they left in October/November 2015 . I wont list the carlos signings as only 2 were decent out of 30 loan/full signings some never even played. that's his legacy the dream what failed ,his best attempts to bankrupt a club and leave them with a huge wage bill which if we went down 2 seasons ago would have been catastrophic leaving us with dodos like abdi on 35k a week in league 1 which would have resulted in the club in administration and almost certainly ending up in league 2 were Bolton are going . thankfully most of rubbish has gone and what the efl tries to throw at us we should have enough to stop up at least. So all the good players were signed by someone else and all the crap by carlos and yet at 2017 fans forum chansiri explained that carlos identified a position that needed strengthening and his advisors would find him a list of players for him to choose from .which is different to signing who he wanted .I'm fairly confident what abdi earnt had sod all to do with carlos ...... Edited December 17, 2019 by torryowl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanharper Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 I'd have him back... ...purely in an advisory role telling us how to see out a game when a goal up in the last 5 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowl Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 48 minutes ago, vulva said: You been watching the same club as me? If after 55 years watching this lot you were disappointed by a trip to Wembley then I think you might just need to adjust your expectations. A trip to Wembley is great but you expect a little bit of fight from your team. We were gutless. If we'd really gone for it maybe we would have won, maybe not. I don't blame the players, Carlos has a history of chickening out and going defensive when the pressure comes on. Huddersfield in his second season, barely tested their stand in keeper in the first game and should have hammered them at ours. We didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
james o connor Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 hour ago, vulva said: You been watching the same club as me? If after 55 years watching this lot you were disappointed by a trip to Wembley then I think you might just need to adjust your expectations. I was disappointed with paying extortionate prices to find very expensive poor signings and fail in the play offs twice . right now I’m still disappointed at being ripped off but I’m enjoying watching a decent knowledgeable manager working with ‘past it’ players and freebies and getting some pretty impressive results . I’m enjoying going to Hillsborough and have done more away games this year than I have in the previous 3 years . Forget Carlos , let’s look forward having finally got a manager up to the required standard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handworth52 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 4 hours ago, torryowl said: So all the good players were signed by someone else and all the crap by carlos and yet at 2017 fans forum chansiri explained that carlos identified a position that needed strengthening and his advisors would find him a list of players for him to choose from .which is different to signing who he wanted .I'm fairly confident what abdi earnt had sod all to do with carlos ...... yes of cause ,no manager goes up and down the country scouting ,as he would be far too busy with looking after team. it still don't answer my question that when you sign a player its someone to fit into your style you play , as if and when fletcher leaves you wont replace him with a fox in the box etc ,his signings were disastrous but what they were paid and how long there contracts were had nothing to do with him of coarse. the point you are almost saying is that no manager of any team can be blamed for players signed under his watch? im sure that wilder has final say on who he signs ,I bet he looks into everything about the players he signs, attitude,work rate how they fit in ,even if he has a team of people looking for players . we have never agreed regards carlos and it certainly divided opinions while he was here. if bruce or monk had his war chest of 100million worth of contracts ,transfer fees they would have done much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellis Rimmer Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 The most frustrating thing about Carlos was how well we played that first season compared to how poor the style became in the 2nd. Even though they were probably a better side. Taking Fletcher off when playing Huddersfield at Hillsborough, just as we were getting on top of them was one of the worst decisions I've seen at Hillsborough. I wouldn't ever want him back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthernOwl Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, handworth52 said: yes of cause ,no manager goes up and down the country scouting ,as he would be far too busy with looking after team. it still don't answer my question that when you sign a player its someone to fit into your style you play , as if and when fletcher leaves you wont replace him with a fox in the box etc ,his signings were disastrous but what they were paid and how long there contracts were had nothing to do with him of coarse. the point you are almost saying is that no manager of any team can be blamed for players signed under his watch? im sure that wilder has final say on who he signs ,I bet he looks into everything about the players he signs, attitude,work rate how they fit in ,even if he has a team of people looking for players . we have never agreed regards carlos and it certainly divided opinions while he was here. if bruce or monk had his war chest of 100million worth of contracts ,transfer fees they would have done much better. Some managers have more say on transfers than others. Pretty sure Bruce identified the signings he made himself without the help of a committee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handworth52 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, NorthernOwl said: Some managers have more say on transfers than others. Pretty sure Bruce identified the signings he made himself without the help of a committee. he fetched in 2 guys from villa early January 1 called david downs there now head scouts and are still here that's why we have improved massively on signings since January and for a fraction of the cost. also we have tony strudwick who keeps players fit and keeps them right unlike the farce when carlos was here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inspector Lestrade Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Im sure CC spent 200 million, or was it 300 million? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonofbert2 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Ellis Rimmer said: The most frustrating thing about Carlos was how well we played that first season compared to how poor the style became in the 2nd. Even though they were probably a better side. Taking Fletcher off when playing Huddersfield at Hillsborough, just as we were getting on top of them was one of the worst decisions I've seen at Hillsborough. I wouldn't ever want him back He was injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twaddle Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 hour ago, handworth52 said: he fetched in 2 guys from villa early January 1 called david downs there now head scouts and are still here that's why we have improved massively on signings since January and for a fraction of the cost. also we have tony strudwick who keeps players fit and keeps them right unlike the farce when carlos was here. Just as an extra. This was an article in the Star from June 2019 How Sheffield Wednesday transfers actually work: who finds players, who is on the transfer committee and who has the final say The transfer window is a baffling time of rumours, eleventh hour deals and missed opportunities – but how do transfers really work at Sheffield Wednesday? By Nancy Frostick Thursday, 6th June 2019, 11:11 am Updated Thursday, 6th June 2019, 10:17 pm Shortly after Dejphon Chansiri completed his buy-out of the Owls in March 2015, he hired Adam Pearson and Glenn Roeder to work alongside Stuart Gray as part of a transfer committee. After Gray lost his job in the summer and Pearson departed the club, Carlos Carvalhal brought changes to the transfer structure at Hillsborough.The club eventually decided to streamline their committee, prompting the Owls to adopt a more traditional model where the head coach has a significant input into their transfer business but the final word – and responsibility for negotiations – lies with Chansiri and his global advisers."It is down to the coach to identify players but, of course, I still have the final say,” said Chansiri."If I'm the one who chooses the players, I should not hire a coach and I should be the coach!" THE FIVE KEY MEN Dejphon Chansiri Based in Bangkok but regularly attends Wednesday matches – Chansiri plays a big part in the transfer committee. Agents frequently contact Chansiri but he has stressed: "I have always said it is down to the coach to identify potential transfer targets, not me." Amadeu Paixao Paixao, formerly an agent with Doyen Sports, has been a close advisor to Chansiri for a number of years. He has his own football connections and is heavily involved in the negotation process. Steve Bruce This summer is Bruce's first full transfer window and the Owls boss is vastly-experienced with an array of contacts in the game. Bruce, together with Steve Agnew and Stephen Clemence, identifies potential targets and puts forward names of players he wants. David Downes and Dean Hughes Bruce raided his former club Aston Villa to bring in the pair earlier this year. Downes was appointed Wednesday's head of recruitment while Hughes is their recruitment analyst. Downes worked closely with Bruce at Villa Park and will go to watch players home and abroad. Hughes, meanwhile, was part of Bruce's Hull City set-up. THE OWLS’ TRANSFER RECORDSome observers have criticised the club's transfer dealings since Wednesday lost to Hull City in the play-off final three years ago. Almen Abdi, David Jones, George Boyd and Joost van Aken - to name a few - all flopped.But Chansiri has repeatedly defended their transfer policy, pointing out that even the top clubs in the country do not hit the jackpot when it comes to buying and selling players.It is worth pointing out that Adam Reach's market value has risen considerably in recent years following a string of eye-catching performances and Steven Fletcher has proven a solid free recruit.Bruce has only signed three players so far. Dominic Iorfa has showed glimpses of his ability and should only get better. The loan signings of Rolando Aarons and Achraf Lazaar looked good in patches but injuries prevented them from making a bigger impact.Only time will tell whether Bruce's decision to restructure their recruitment team has paid off. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 8 hours ago, vulva said: I did. Maybe you hadn’t sat through 20 odd years of rubbish like I had. Drawing with 9 man Yeovil, getting beat at Stockport and watching Bothroyd failing to break sweat. The ‘hardcore’ ‘get it’. Really enjoyed the Carlos reign. I've sat (n' stood) for double your 20 years, and I never want to see anyone pi$$ our best (and perhaps only) chance up against the wall with utterly stupid decisions on fitness, training, injuries, and tactic. ooops! I forgot bottling it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Inspector Lestrade said: Im sure CC spent 200 million, or was it 300 million? i'm not sure how much it was, but it's ALL we had, and every chance we had with it too, time to take your hero's piccy down, he in't worth a throw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inspector Lestrade Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, dorian gray said: i'm not sure how much it was, but it's ALL we had, and every chance we had with it too, time to take your hero's piccy down, he in't worth a throw. Shush child, you know naught of what you speak of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellis Rimmer Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 1 hour ago, sonofbert2 said: He was injured. He was playing well. What injury did he have?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonofbert2 Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 Just now, Ellis Rimmer said: He was playing well. What injury did he have?? He was injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorian gray Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 22 minutes ago, Inspector Lestrade said: Shush child, you know naught of what you speak of. you know 'naught' of anything on here, and it shows, big time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincs Owl Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 6 hours ago, james o connor said: I was disappointed with paying extortionate prices to find very expensive poor signings and fail in the play offs twice . right now I’m still disappointed at being ripped off but I’m enjoying watching a decent knowledgeable manager working with ‘past it’ players and freebies and getting some pretty impressive results . I’m enjoying going to Hillsborough and have done more away games this year than I have in the previous 3 years . Forget Carlos , let’s look forward having finally got a manager up to the required standard You say 'forget Carlos' and nearly every post of yours brings him into the argument. The irony. As for bottling it against Hull, we were never likely to win that. Hull were packed with Premier League quality. We had a team of cast offs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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