Charlie Chuck Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 I should have said potential financial disaster. Worst case scenario - get relegated on the back of a big point deduction and end up in league one with players on big contracts. It’s a scary thought for the club we love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 19 minutes ago, nilsson said: For all the money he’s spent and the wages we’ve paid, the odds have never actually been in our favour of getting promoted. If you look at this season as an example, Leeds are currently 2/7 for promotion and West Brom are 1/2. Leeds may choke again but according to the bookies there’s a 78% chance they’ll be promoted and a 67% chance West Brom will be promoted. The bookmakers have never had us odds on for promotion at any point in the last 5 years. It's testament to both how far behind we'd fallen and to how ill-advised some of our spending has been, really. When Chansiri arrived, we were starting from a position in which at least half the Championship had a huge head-start in terms of investment in their squads over the past half-decade or so. The investment in many a Championship club over the past two decades dwarfs ours. Their infrastructures, academies, technical teams, scouting networks etc... were funded by Premier League money and parachute payments. Many may not have spent as heavily in the past few seasons, but we've been playing catch-up in a major way after the best part of two decades being left to wither on the vine. Unfortunately, where cool heads and keen eyes were needed due to P&S rules, we've overstretched ourselves in our desperation to redress the balance. My worry is that, in typical Wednesday fashion, we've done so at the worst possible time, and the EFL are going to throw the book at us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Charlie Chuck said: I should have said potential financial disaster. Worst case scenario - get relegated on the back of a big point deduction and end up in league one with players on big contracts. It’s a scary thought for the club we love. And totally defeats the object as to why these rules are in place You’ve just got to love the EFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HIGHERSTATE Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, Charlie Chuck said: I should have said potential financial disaster. Worst case scenario - get relegated on the back of a big point deduction and end up in league one with players on big contracts. It’s a scary thought for the club we love. Can we then market the season tickets as return to the Championship? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick_Turpin Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Just now, HIGHERSTATE said: We just have to adjust these seasons targets thats all. Probably wasn't going to buy anyone in January anyway If we get hit by the 21 point deduction the Guardian suggested was the top end of the possibilities - plus presumably a transfer embargo - we’d be 9 points behind 4th from bottom. The target would be safety and it would depend on the mentality of the players. Not guilty and no penalty at all - what a boost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Willow Owl Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 52 minutes ago, Stoop said: My take. For what it’s worth Chansiri has tried every trick in the book to try and get his money into the club. He’s gambled massively and it’s not worked. The rest is just hindsight Take the hit and hopefully move onto better things under Monk next year and beyond Great post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spookone Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, rickygoo said: If we get hit by the 21 point deduction the Guardian suggested was the top end of the possibilities - plus presumably a transfer embargo - we’d be 9 points behind 4th from bottom. The target would be safety and it would depend on the mentality of the players. Not guilty and no penalty at all - what a boost. I really cant see us getting anywhere near a 21 point deduction, I think around 12 which though hugely frustrating, should be manageable in terms of keeping in the Championship - especially when Rhodes shows his fighting spirit and starts banging them in for fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handworth52 Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 6 minutes ago, SouthRustyOwl said: Needs to be some perspective here. It does look as though we have done wrong, and they will look to make an example of us, but they aren't going to throw us out of the league, and suggestions we won't have a club to support are just sensationalist. Worst case scenario is they relegate us, either outright or by a strict points deduction that makes it all but a given. More likely is they give us a hefty points deduction (I'm guessing at 15 points) and a transfer embargo, and even with that I'd more than fancy our chances of staying up. It's bad, but it isn't Armageddon. im hoping your right . but what chansiri has done and is doing stinks I just don't get the selling of the ground for 60 million to yourself what already owns it then puts it in accounts over a year before, has companies what don't exist d taxi,drink company etc etc im sure there will be a big fall out with this. what if they throw the book at us? and chansiri? how will he react? will he just bugger off and leave us crippled in debt what he has caused? and half the money for the next 3-5 years has already been spent with advance season tickets and having to sell stock for free in 12 months due to his voucher scheme which is another way of coving the huge amount of money we are losing . what worries me most is the reaction of chansiri to any bad news that`s what could mean curtains for us , what buyer would buy a club with huge debts/wage bill/costs and having there turnover halved if we went down as well as only getting half the season ticket money as a lot have been sold for next 3-5 years . I don't think there will be a big line wanting to buy us at 100 million as that's what he would be asking . even selling us for a £1 would require a huge amount of money to keep us going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoop Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, Spookone said: I really cant see us getting anywhere near a 21 point deduction, I think around 12 which though hugely frustrating, should be manageable in terms of keeping in the Championship - especially when Rhodes shows his fighting spirit and starts banging them in for fun I reckon it’ll be 12 points 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizzard1867 Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Jeffjohnsonmyhero said: Nobody has hit on the problem.OK we have broke the rules ,But 3 clubs every season can spend more than the rest of the division.Parachute payments ,Scrap them , Clubs will try to match this anyway they can,Just like we have. Stoke next season will have a clear out and money in abundance ,Heaven knows where we will be ,But I know where I will be Hillsborough ,Hopefully the owner wont be. The Premier League can't explicitly ban promotion and relegation, but with the parachute payments they have done the next best thing. The worst thing about it is Wilder has beat the system, whilst we were blazing money up the wall. The solution has always been, buy the right players and play the right type of football: Winning football. I think Monk sees this. I think Mr C now sees it. He only had a Plan A. poo or Bust. I prefer the new plan anyway, it's more like the Wednesday way, victory against all odds. Unfortunately, the results of Plan A have not concluded. There are no quick fixes in football. Edited November 16, 2019 by Ozymandias Owl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelowl Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 25 minutes ago, Stoop said: Let’s be honest, the EFL aren’t going to throw us out of the league. So how would a 12 point deduction and a transfer embargo be catastrophic. Bad, as in it’ll kill our season, yes. catastrophic, no stoop I think if we haven't a good defence i'd be happy with 12 points if thats all it is i think the EFL will love to throw the kitchen sink at us then there's the hmrc aspect there are a couple of things a bit clearer now regarding resignations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoop Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Just now, steelowl said: stoop I think if we haven't a good defence i'd be happy with 12 points if thats all it is i think the EFL will love to throw the kitchen sink at us then there's the hmrc aspect there are a couple of things a bit clearer now regarding resignations 12 points deducted and we’ll still be above Middlesbrough, imagine the look on Steve Gibson’s face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelowl Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Just now, Stoop said: 12 points deducted and we’ll still be above Middlesbrough, imagine the look on Steve Gibson’s face tbf i hope that tw@ gets visited by karma Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick_Turpin Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 9 minutes ago, Stoop said: I reckon it’ll be 12 points That would be lenient - if we get done we’d get a penalty for misconduct and then one for the FFP that we’d cheated to avoid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torres Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 6 minutes ago, Ozymandias Owl said: The Premier League can't explicitly ban promotion and relegation, but with the parachute payments they have done the next best thing. The worst thing about it is Wilder has beat the system, whilst we were blazing money up the wall. The solution has always been, buy the right players and play the right type of football: Winning football. I think Monk sees this. I think Mr C now sees it. He only had a Plan A. poo or Bust. I prefer the new plan anyway, it's more like the Wednesday way, victory against all odds. Unfortunately, the results of Plan A have not concluded. There are no quick fixes in football. The parachute payments are ridiculous and they should make it a closed shop but teams are so badly run it really hasn’t been the case. Sunderland went down again Stoke have had a season and a half in the lower half of the league Villa spent far too long down M’boro blew it Huddersfield struggling WBA blew it Hull not doing anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoop Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 1 minute ago, rickygoo said: That would be lenient - if we get done we’d get a penalty for misconduct and then one for the FFP that we’d cheated to avoid. Surely there will be s substantial fine thrown in too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wizzard1867 Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Johnny Concrete said: I agree, I think after the Playoff final season most, if not all, got that taste of chasing success and been one of the more stronger sides in the division. After all the years of watching the club struggling to its knees in debt whilst yo-yoing between the championship and league one, it made a refreshing change to see us competing in the transfer market and we wouldn't really question the off the field stuff or were blind to it. Just a shame this latest hammer blow could see us set back even further from before Chansiri took over. Competing for the wrong players though. Most of us must have questioned the signing of Winnall and Rhodes in the same transfer window. And as for Abdi, Jones and Boyd. Who else was competing for them? They were never going to come with a desire to prove they could win promotion and play in the Premier League. They had been there and done that, and been chewed up and spat back out. We've still got Hutch, Bannan and Lee playing in midfield after spendaggedon has finally unwound. A truely awful transfer policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mkowl Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 I am not sure why folk are being judge and jury on this This is about evidence and really whether the judgement of the EFL is more appropriate than that of the Club and the auditors. There is no lower burden of proof here. The EFL rules categorically state the audited accounts are the starting point. If these are deemed to show a true and fair view then the EFL can not argue on the timing point. This seems to be the purpose of the disciplinary meeting not the valuation. And in terms of the valuation this again is an accounting concept. It is an in use valuation, depreciated replacement cost. Whether it is in a nice area, industrial or housing alternative valuation is totally irrelevant, a Maguire red herring. It is simply How much would it cost today to re-build to the same specification Reduced by the remaining useful life So if it would cost 120m to rebuild, has a useful life of 50 years and we are 25 years into it / remaining that is where the 60m comes from Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradowl Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 1 minute ago, torres said: The parachute payments are ridiculous and they should make it a closed shop but teams are so badly run it really hasn’t been the case. Sunderland went down again Stoke have had a season and a half in the lower half of the league Villa spent far too long down M’boro blew it Huddersfield struggling WBA blew it Hull not doing anything To that lot you can add..... Swansea Cardiff Fulham all came down recently and not set the world on fire. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelowl Posted November 16, 2019 Share Posted November 16, 2019 Just now, Stoop said: Surely there will be s substantial fine thrown in too prob but I Suspect DC will be expecting that hopefully we have a defence anyone know if Borner has a law degree ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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