SWFC Strikers Stats

[Holmowl]

2 hours ago, clud17 said:

Rhodes stats really do stand out as being shocking, wonder who his stats faired at other clubs.

 

 

He averaged a goal every 190 minutes in the Championship - everywhere except with us.

 

In his season at Norwich it was a goal every 160 minutes.

[Holmowl]

58 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

Joao, as I thought, head and shoulders above all the others, and we sold him. Not only that, stats apart, my eyes tell me, he has the best all round game He was inconsistent, whereas most of the others were consistent, consistently bad

 

And FF, Nuhiu and Fletcher have a few penalties in their goals. Makes Joao (no pens) and Hooper (1 pen) look even better as you should always strip pens out of striker comparisons.

[Guest Kagoshimaowl]

3 hours ago, A E Neuman NYowl said:

If anyone else's has already produced these stats apologies and please pull this topic.

 

We all have differing opinions on who should play up front for us, some of the comments on here have been

 

" We should re-sign Hooper"

" We should never have sold Joao"

" Nuhiu can't get a shot on target in 3 games"

"Rhodes is shot"

" Give Rhodes 5 games and he will start to score"

" Give Winnall 5 games and he will start to score "

 

Like many I have been frustrated And critical of our strikers this season so I thought I would get some stats to see if it backs up any of these theories.

To get a large volume of minutes played  and to try to even out players peaks and troughs I have gone back to the start of the 2016-2017 season, the season Winnall and Rhodes joined us.

The minutes played are for league games only played for us, and also these players have played the majority of games with the same managers and team mates.

I have included Hooper and Joao for reference and comparison.

 

Stats

 Player.                Mins Played.         Goals.           Assists

Fletcher.              6571.                      29.                6.                Goal every 226 mins.       Assist every 1095 mins

FF.                       4825.                      23                  6.               Goal every 219 mins.       Assist every 804 mins

Joao.                   3984.                      20.                 6.               Goal every 199 mins.       Assist every 664 mins

Hooper.               3737.                      17.                  7.               Goal every 219 mins.       Assist every 533 mins

Nuhiu.                 3585.                       16.                 8.                Goal every 224 mins.       Assist every 448 mins

Winnall.               1318.                        5.                  1.                Goal every 263 mins.       Assist every 1318 mins

Rhodes.              3027.                        4.                   2.                Goal every 756 mins.      Assist every 1513 mins

 

 

 

Simply shows how appalling Rhodes is. Top 3 strikers at the club are Fletcher, Forestieri and Nuhiu in that order. The other two are crap. Don’t need stats to tell me that, I have something called eyes.

[Guest Kagoshimaowl]

1 hour ago, gurujuan said:

Joao, as I thought, head and shoulders above all the others, and we sold him. Not only that, stats apart, my eyes tell me, he has the best all round game He was inconsistent, whereas most of the others were consistent, consistently bad

While I agree with you at 5 million we had to sell him. Shame because he was by far the most talented striker at the club.

[DJMortimer]

56 minutes ago, Holmowl said:

 

He averaged a goal every 190 minutes in the Championship - everywhere except with us.

 

In his season at Norwich it was a goal every 160 minutes.

 

Statistics without context prove nothing. What would be a more creditable achievement - Aguero scoring 30, Jiminez getting 20 or Deeney 15? Rhodes' most notable exploits are largely ancient history. Whatever it was he possessed back then seems to be long gone.

 

It was 170 minutes per goal at Norwich unless you include his hat-trick against a lower league team (Wycombe?) in the cup. And compared with the exploits of their squad as a whole, how impressive was that really? Look at the output from their midfield (one of them averaged a goal every 148 minutes for example). For what it's worth, Rhodes ranked 20th of their 24 players that season on whoscored.com in their ratings system. And the only four players finishing below him played just 348 minutes between them. They showed some interest in having him back but seemingly balked at the idea of even paying £1 in a transfer fee (obviously the salary commitment would have been considerable).

 

It is disconcerting to see this being implicitly blamed on Sheffield Wednesday as if we have given him some sort of disease and he is absolved of responsibility. Forget the vagaries of scoring statistics (unless you're still collecting Panini stickers) and just watch his contribution. He offers none of the attributes you want from a striker, whether he gets on the score sheet or not. Do you think it's an accident that in the last 4 years, the 4 clubs he's been at under 7 managers have awarded him only 77 starts combined?

 

How do you account for ALL SEVEN of the forwards he's been at Hillsborough with, despite all their different skills, outscoring him comfortably? Even Dominic Iorfa has a better return.

 

No more excuses. He's at the bottom of the pecking order with very good reason.

 

Edited October 3, 2019 by DJMortimer

[pazowl55]

32 minutes ago, Kagoshimaowl said:

Simply shows how appalling Rhodes is. Top 3 strikers at the club are Fletcher, Forestieri and Nuhiu in that order. The other two are crap. Don’t need stats to tell me that, I have something called eyes.

Have to agree if Winnall and Rhodes dont score goals then they really dont bring alot else to the team.

[pazowl55]

11 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Statistics without context prove nothing. What would be a more creditable achievement - Aguero scoring 30, Jiminez getting 20 or Deeney 15? Rhodes' most notable exploits are largely ancient history. Whatever it was he possessed back then seems to be long gone.

 

It was 170 minutes per goal at Norwich unless you include his hat-trick against a lower league team (Wycombe?) in the cup. And compared with the exploits of their squad as a whole, how impressive was that really? Look at the output from their midfield (one of them averaged a goal every 148 minutes for example). For what it's worth, Rhodes ranked 20th of their 24 players that season on whoscored.com in their ratings system. And the only four players finishing below him played just 348 minutes between them. They showed some interest in having him back but seemingly balked at the idea of even paying £1 in a transfer fee (obviously the salary commitment would have been considerable).

 

It is disconcerting to see this being implicitly blamed on Sheffield Wednesday as if we have given him some sort of disease and he is absolved of responsibility. Forget the vagaries of scoring statistics (unless you're still collecting Panini stickers) and just watch his contribution. He offers none of the attributes you want from a striker, whether he gets on the score sheet or not. Do you think it's an accident that in the last 4 years, the 4 clubs he's been at under 7 managers have awarded him only 77 starts combined?

 

How do you account for ALL SEVEN of the forwards he's been at Hillsborough with, despite all their different skills, outscoring him comfortably? Even Dominic Iorfa has a better return.

 

No more excuses. He's at the bottom of the pecking order with very good reason.

 

But if we only give him a run of games in a two and get balls into the box.

[trumbullowl]

Stats add up to 114 goals in 27,047 minutes or 300 games. So a goal per striker every 2.6 games, or 0.38 goals per striker per game. If we field two strikers each

game then we've been scoring 0.76 goals per game from strikers. I hope the midfield has been chipping in then!

[bobness]

6 hours ago, A E Neuman NYowl said:

No you are correct it was me who put the wrong info in.  Rhodes stats stats should have read

 

8 goals and 2 assists.    A goal every 378 minutes and an assist every 1513 minutes.

 

Sorry Jordan I am making your stats look much worse than they are.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Perhaps ask a mod to edit this, because leaving it up there is how fake news works. Most people won't scroll down to read your edit.

Just to be clear, I'm not suggesting Rhodes isn't an overpaid waster...

 

[Holmowl]

6 hours ago, DJMortimer said:

 

It was 170 minutes per goal at Norwich unless you include his hat-trick against a lower league team (Wycombe?) in the cup. And compared with the exploits of their squad as a whole, how impressive was that really? Look at the output from their midfield (one of them averaged a goal every 148 minutes for example). For what it's worth, Rhodes ranked 20th of their 24 players that season on whoscored.com in their ratings system. And the only four players finishing below him played just 348 minutes between them. They showed some interest in having him back but seemingly balked at the idea of even paying £1 in a transfer fee (obviously the salary commitment would have been considerable).

 

It is disconcerting to see this being implicitly blamed on Sheffield Wednesday as if we have given him some sort of disease and he is absolved of responsibility. Forget the vagaries of scoring statistics (unless you're still collecting Panini stickers) and just watch his contribution. He offers none of the attributes you want from a striker, whether he gets on the score sheet or not. Do you think it's an accident that in the last 4 years, the 4 clubs he's been at under 7 managers have awarded him only 77 starts combined?

 

 

I guess some of that is aimed at my earlier post?

 

Three or four seasons ago in the many Rhodes threads I was one of very few fans posting that we didn’t need him, because Hooper’s record was better and his all round game was better, and I doubted you could play both in the same side. However, once he signed I supported him without hesitation.

 

There is no doubt that something has caused him to be MUCH less effective at Wednesday than at his three other Championship clubs. Some say he has lost it. Well, if “it” is his ability to score a goal every 180 minutes or so, they are wrong.

 

Blackburn - goal every 168 minutes

Boro - 193 minutes

Owls - 365 minutes

 

Based on that surely he has lost it? Obvious isn’t it?

But then how, in his most recent season, did he do this:-

 

Norwich - goal every 168 minutes 

 

He clearly has not lost the goal scoring touch. Some of his Norwich goals were vital and worth their weight in gold.

 

Something has gone very very wrong for him/us at S6. I know (won’t say how) that he feels he was treated very badly under Carlos. I have no reason to believe that is the case under Monk. 

 

I am not qualified to theorise why a player who can score every two games at Blabkburn, Boro and Norwich scores every 4 games here. But logic suggests it’s not him, it’s not us - it’s a combination of him and us.

 

As for his managers not starting him, you are a bit off there too. After being introduced into the team Boro started him in 13 of their last 17 promotion winning games. OK, at Norwich, Pukki kept him out...we see why. Oh to unearth a Pukki !

 

The reality is he was an effective starter at one promotion side, Boro, and a very effective late sub at another, Norwich.

 

Is he quick? Lord no. Is he strong? Not at all. Is he a workhorse? Nope. Does he link play well? Not particularly. 

 

Does he get into scoring opportunities? Massively yes. His greatest asset.

Does he finish? Apart from under Carlos, yes. 

 

I am genuinely not his champion. When I watched Hooper and when I watch Fletcher I am in awe and I was/am thrilled they wear our shirt. When I watch Rhodes I don’t get any of that. 

 

However, what a boost it would be if Rhodes gets a goal every 180 minutes for us this season. Whether he starts or comes on as a sub, if he can be a source of goals it could make our season. Fletcher will miss games and minutes. Neither Winnall nor Nuhiu are gold-dust. Forestieri is not a CF. 

 

Looking at the present. On Tuesday Rhodes played 22 minutes and got himself 3 good scoring opportunities. Between them Nuhiu and Winnall played 158 minutes and had 3 good chances. I had all ten fingers and toes crossed for him to score. A confident firing Rhodes would be a fantastic addition.

 

Edited October 4, 2019 by Holmowl

[Mr Hooper]

I'm still available lads

[Andrew6666]

Highlights our desperate need for a pacey goal poacher.

Fletcher seems to be the main target man, we need someone to play off him.

[tarn owl]

34 minutes ago, Mr Hooper said:

I'm still available lads

Mr Hooper, you were the best strike partner for our main lad Fletcher. Can i start the negotiations now. No executive box this time, but i will give you all the seats in the uncovered bit between the north and leppings lane end (good luck getting to your seat via SAG bods). £250 a week and a membership to any golf course you want in the Sheffield area. Contract is until 12th Jan (after Leeds away). If we have no money we may keep you, if we find a younger and fitter model then we will probably break up. Give us your response to the managers email themonkster@swfc.org.owl.com.

[NorthernOwl]

15 hours ago, gurujuan said:

Joao, as I thought, head and shoulders above all the others, and we sold him. Not only that, stats apart, my eyes tell me, he has the best all round game He was inconsistent, whereas most of the others were consistent, consistently bad

 

1 goal for Reading so far this season and not a regular starter. Bit part player at this level at best. 

[Guest wilyfox]

We had two form strikers and sold the youngest of them, so we're left with Fletcher and a load of has-beens. Don't really need the stats. We need movement in January. Otherwise, when the workload inevitably breaks Fletcher...we're fooked. 

[keepitsteel89]

52 minutes ago, wilyfox said:

We had two form strikers and sold the youngest of them, so we're left with Fletcher and a load of has-beens. Don't really need the stats. We need movement in January. Otherwise, when the workload inevitably breaks Fletcher...we're fooked. 

I hope when GM has the faith in our midfield to play 442 some special things will start to happen

[toooldforthis]

17 hours ago, Brando17 said:

Nuhui and Hooper nearly the same,anybody who goes regular,like me will find that very,very hard to digest .....

 

Hooper didn't take any pens

[victorturner]

13 hours ago, bobness said:

 

Perhaps ask a mod to edit this, because leaving it up there is how fake news works. Most people won't scroll down to read your edit.

Just to be clear, I'm not suggesting Rhodes isn't an overpaid waster...

 

Agree-get it edited

[victorturner]

15 hours ago, trumbullowl said:

Stats add up to 114 goals in 27,047 minutes or 300 games. So a goal per striker every 2.6 games, or 0.38 goals per striker per game. If we field two strikers each

game then we've been scoring 0.76 goals per game from strikers. I hope the midfield has been chipping in then!

Two key points made here. Strikers don't score as regularly as they should ( is it because nothing gets presented to them from midfield?) and midfielders do not score many either.

More importantly, our goals have been mainly opportunistic solo efforts until Harris arrived ---and Murphy too-- and started to provide a service for the strikers, and they are presenting the opportunities which have been very few in recent seasons. Bannan playing further forward is also now providing the opportunities which strikers need.

[dorian gray]

20 hours ago, flo said:

I always thought João was good he scored regularly. People wrote him off because he was inconsistent when most players are inconsistent outside the top 7-8 of the Prem. 

I think in fairness most 'people wrote him off because' of that I don't give a **** laid back appearance.