prowl Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Ethel The Tree said: I'm still not convinced Jos was leading some kind of youth crusade He was plugging gaps while the injury crisis cleared up, and as each senior pro recovered those juniors fell back down the pecking order I reckon it's a reflection of the size and quality of our senior squad that none of them have managed to break back in despite three managerial changes Thorniley, Penney & Baker are perhaps best placed to have a decent career ahead of them, but not necessarily with us Maybe our development squad still isn't attracting people good enough to step up to Championship level or once here the training isn't quite good enough. It may take a while to get some quality coming through. If we ever get to the Premiership we should upgrade our academy to the highest level as a priority. I wonder how Hirst is getting on at Leicester? Edited November 13, 2019 by prowl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethel The Tree Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, prowl said: Maybe our development squad still isn't attracting people good enough to step up to Championship level or once here the training isn't quite good enough. It may take a while to get some quality coming through. If we ever get to the Premiership we should upgrade our academy to the highest level as a priority. Absolutely, but we'll probably have to wait until we're established there before it happens The PDL2 is essentially the THIRD tier of youth football in this country and there is no results-based way of improving our status Plus, as we've found to our cost, PL sides can lure the best young talent by offering wages most Championship clubs are prohibited from paying their most valued senior players They can then claw back the expense by renting them out to the highest bidder Edited November 13, 2019 by Ethel The Tree 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheffwed1 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 2 hours ago, Ethel The Tree said: Agreed Potential-wise, I'd have put Jack Stobbs on a par with Sean Clare And that being the case I thought a move to the SPL might have worked for him Right now though, it looks as though the standard (don't laugh) is too high for both of them With the experience Clare has gained at Hearts, I can see him moving on to an English League 1 club without too much difficulty Not so Jack Unless he gets some senior games under his belt and quickly, he's more likely to be looking for a proper job next summer And maybe playing part-time in the Northern Premier If he has an agent then now is the time for him to earn his crust Disagree with that one. Clare looked a much better prospect than Stobbs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stowyowl Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 https://www.swfc.co.uk/news/2019/november/penney-thriving-in-germany/ Update on / interview with Penney on the OS. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethel The Tree Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 7 minutes ago, sheffwed1 said: Disagree with that one. Clare looked a much better prospect than Stobbs Well it depends Stobbs was the first to feature in our 1st team squad (under Stu) and was captain of the U23 side Clare played in Clare on the other hand was first to benefit from a loan out - Bury and then Accrington He then made his mark at Gillingham at the time Stobbs struggled at Port Vale Had Stobbs had more luck during that spell things might look a lot different now 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethel The Tree Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, stowyowl said: https://www.swfc.co.uk/news/2019/november/penney-thriving-in-germany/ Update on / interview with Penney on the OS. Encouraging that his focus is on returning to S6 as a better player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minton Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 1 minute ago, Slogboy said: Agree, not necessarily with SWFC. Believe Penney's free to talk to whoever come January as his contracts up in June. Same for Baker. Thornileys not had much game time neither, perhaps a move is on the cards for him too Only non UK clubs, UK teams have to wait until 3 months before the end of the deal. Both are under 23 as well, so would have to agree a compensation fee with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowl Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 6 minutes ago, Slogboy said: Hmmm, believe he's loving the St Pauli life at the minute and they love him. Why would he want to return just yet, haha. He's got to toe the line between not upsetting either club or their fans. The article was probably written by our media staff after chatting with him so they probably worded it very carefully. His contract is up next summer, better from his perspective to have 2 clubs interested in him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethel The Tree Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 21 minutes ago, Slogboy said: Size and quality, haha Well yes, size and quality There are currently twenty-five senior pros in our 1st team squad Over the past couple of years we've released (or sold) Loovens, Hunt, Wallace, Boyd, Hooper, Jones, Matias, Pudil, Joao plus Hector and others on loan That's a lot of serious competition for any 'up-and-coming' youngster to barge aside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prowl Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 If these lads are good enough Monk would play them. Football is results driven, Monk keeps his job by playing the best team irrespective of who they are. Unfortunately if he plays kids to develop them into first team players and we lose games it's his job that is at stake, on the other hand if a kid is better than what we've got he'd be daft not to play him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minton Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 @Slogboy, maybe read up on the contract rules for u23 players before negging me... https://www.inbrief.co.uk/football-law/bosman-decision-football-transfers/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StudentOwl Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Minton said: Only non UK clubs, UK teams have to wait until 3 months before the end of the deal. Both are under 23 as well, so would have to agree a compensation fee with us. No idea why you've been negged... this is spot on? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethel The Tree Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 Back to the footy ... 13th November Shrewsbury 3-1 Macclesfield (att: 1,065) So ... Macc bow out of this season's EFL Trophy. Probably the least of their worries Surprisingly,they fielded something close to their strongest XI but struggled to make an impression in the first half Picked it up a bit after the break and actually drew level on the hour but then let it slip, even though Shrewsbury played the last 15mins with ten men Connor Kirby picked up his fifth yellow card on his 20th appearance but as only one 'em came in the league I don't think he'll get suspended as a result Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Grez Bez Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 10 hours ago, Slogboy said: 2 clubs and the rest... Go on Do you still talk to him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buxtongent Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 The thing which has always worried me about the loan system is - does it really work? Just look at the number of youth players we have out on loan, and add up the number of minutes of actual playing time they have had. It doesn't apply to all, but many are warming subs benches at other clubs. This will not improve their playing ability. And one of the greatest proponents of this has been SWFC. During the last few seasons ,it has become a habit of having loanees and not playing them. That way, they get NO experience whatsoever/ . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRightSide Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Nice to see Penney’s family and friends back to their best of trying help him...by slagging all and sundry at the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRightSide Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 38 minutes ago, Buxtongent said: The thing which has always worried me about the loan system is - does it really work? Just look at the number of youth players we have out on loan, and add up the number of minutes of actual playing time they have had. It doesn't apply to all, but many are warming subs benches at other clubs. This will not improve their playing ability. And one of the greatest proponents of this has been SWFC. During the last few seasons ,it has become a habit of having loanees and not playing them. That way, they get NO experience whatsoever/ . Is that the fault of the loan system of symptomatic of the quality of our youth players? Stobbs is a perfect example. He’ll never make a pro-footballer, it’s been obvious for years and why he’s still here I’ll never know... But is it a failure of the loan system that he can’t get a spot on the bench in two bob Scottish football? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRightSide Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 3 hours ago, Slogboy said: And you really believe that's how it works with chansiri? ' playing the best team' You believe that then pal What is it then, play the team that buys the most tuna?’ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethel The Tree Posted November 14, 2019 Author Share Posted November 14, 2019 55 minutes ago, Buxtongent said: The thing which has always worried me about the loan system is - does it really work? Does it work? For some it does Is it fair? For some it is This is a huge topic and I've aborted a couple of attempts to add to @Lord Snooty's "The reserves" thread because my posts just got too long Basically, everything changed when the PL pushed through their Elite Player Performance Plan (EPPP) as a way of ensuring the best young players would end up at the 'top clubs' As a result, most previous 'reserve' competitions were replaced by the Professional Development League (PDL) in all it's various guises It does get complicated, but the general opinion suggests any objections to the scheme from EFL clubs were squashed by the threat of a reduction in the amount of academy funding that gets handed down from the PL Rather than go into further detail I'd recommend anyone who's interested in this stuff google EPPP and/or PDL and draw your own conclusions Personally, I think the main problem - or one of 'em - is the amount of foreign 'talent' that restricts opportunities for our own youngsters at the higher level The scheme also (conveniently) enables those 'top clubs' to acquire talent from lesser academies for relative peanuts and then loan/rent them back out to FL clubs to gain experience I suppose the scheme is still in it's infancy and those clubs who are making it work might point to the youngsters who have come through the system and have already progressed to the international stage But to my mind it's just another drawbridge - or another opportunity for PL clubs to secure their own status at the top of the heap Meanwhile clubs like ours are always likely to struggle to keep hold of players destined for greater things while ever we're forced to operate at 3rd tier level and under strict financial guidelines ... and that's not to mention the role of agents in brokering loan deals left right and centre for personal gain I suppose it all comes down to money in the end. And greed 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minton Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 15 hours ago, Slogboy said: Think the club's quite capable of ensuring their own demise. Well done Chansiri , a potential 9 point deduction awaits us Bet you're an absolute joy at parties. We haven't been deducted anything, maybe wait to find out the outcome of anything before you fully wet your bed eh? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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