Owling Wolfe Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 Derby’s owner sold their ground to his own company to get round FFP and next thing they are posting profits of £14.5Million. If Chansiri can do that either himself or through his father then why wouldn’t you want that to happen. It would give Bruce a sizeable war chest for next year. People tend to forget that people from Thailand consider honour to be the most important thing especially between family and friends. As long as the ground is bought back when we eventually get to the prem then what is the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owling Wolfe Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 13 hours ago, Birley Owl 1867 said: I think derby might get a ohone call from the league about tryna beat the system. If we don't sell out stadium, I think we'll get away with it. What Derby have done is legal by all accounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanharper Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 Ironic that the Boro owner is bleating about us spending a lot - whilst they haven't technically broken FFP rules and in the two years since relegation have posted a £7m profit followed by a £6.4m loss, they've done this whilst receiving the PL money for a year followed by parachute payments of around £75m - so they've actually spent/lost way more than we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birley Owl 1867 Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 21 minutes ago, Owling Wolfe said: What Derby have done is legal by all accounts. Well yes. But they have still flaunted the rules by doing so, and they'll be punished accordingly and the loophole closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
striker Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, Birley Owl 1867 said: Well yes. But they have still flaunted the rules by doing so, and they'll be punished accordingly and the loophole closed. The loophole may well be closed, but if its currently within the rules, not sure why or how they would be punished. They've used their FFP 'get out of jail' card though, so really is promotion or bust for them now over the next couple of seasons. Sold a major asset to remain compliant, only time will tell if worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hirst1867 Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Owling Wolfe said: Derby’s owner sold their ground to his own company to get round FFP and next thing they are posting profits of £14.5Million. If Chansiri can do that either himself or through his father then why wouldn’t you want that to happen. It would give Bruce a sizeable war chest for next year. People tend to forget that people from Thailand consider honour to be the most important thing especially between family and friends. As long as the ground is bought back when we eventually get to the prem then what is the problem. Given the Chairman is consistently quoted as saying hes has plenty to invest but is prevented from doing so by FFP - it stands to reason that if loophole is available then its there to be used. Crack on Mr C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OxonOwl Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 It seems a strange loophole. I was under the impression that expenditure on infrastructure was not included in FFP/P&S so surely gains from selling infrastucture should be excluded too. What you could do is sell your ground then buy it back again. And the do it again and again... You could them spend as much as you wanted on players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earlsfieldowl Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 Middlesboro had parachute payments that have automatically given them a huge advantage vs the rest. ..so no sympathy whatsoever. He should concentrate on running the club properly instead of targeting others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChinaOwl Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 2 hours ago, Owling Wolfe said: Derby’s owner sold their ground to his own company to get round FFP and next thing they are posting profits of £14.5Million. If Chansiri can do that either himself or through his father then why wouldn’t you want that to happen. It would give Bruce a sizeable war chest for next year. People tend to forget that people from Thailand consider honour to be the most important thing especially between family and friends. As long as the ground is bought back when we eventually get to the prem then what is the problem. Why are people so convinced that Dejphon Chansiri's father and brother even give a rat's a r s e about Sheffield Wednesday? I suppose it's possible that they do and that they would be open to investment. But I have yet to see even one iota of evidence to suggest they are. They both regularly travel to Europe on official business but how often has either even bothered to show their faces at a match? They both have interests in multiple businesses outside Thai Union and a huge network of other business contacts in Thailand yet our owner has to use his own name or non trading companies to generate advertising revenue. Does that not seem a little odd? Also at Thai Union AGM's they are just plain dismissive of any conversation related to football in England simply just stating that it is a matter for DC and him alone. On the balance of probability, I would say that this project solely belongs to DC in the family and nobody else has an interest in being part of it. I guess it will all become clear in due course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie snerklebox Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 On 16/04/2019 at 07:36, The Captain said: Newcastle United are definitely an outliner though; a real exception to the norm. Not many clubs that regularly get 50,000 fans turning up every week end up in the Championship. Like you stated, in the summer transfer window straight after they went down, the club sold Sissoko, Wijnaldum, Townsend, Janmaat, Cabella and Papiss Cisse for circa €100 million (seriously, how the hell did McClaren get that team relegated!). They also released Cheik Tiote, Coloccini, and Steven Taylor (all Premier League regulars on big salaries at the time) on free transfers in the same window, so Benitez had to totally rebuild their team that summer, which isn’t easy post-relegation when the club is in total turmoil. So it’s not like Newcastle just ‘bought their way back up’ in 2016/17. They lost all of their high value assets that summer and had to rebuild. I think Newcastle might still be in the Championship now had it not been for Benitez’s exceptional transfer strategy and squad management. Not because of parachute payments. Rubbish. Newcastle's wage bill actually INCREASED to £112m the year that they bought their way back out of the Championship. Benitez "achievement" was about on a par with Celtic walking to the SPFL title every year. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
room0035 Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 1 hour ago, OxonOwl said: It seems a strange loophole. I was under the impression that expenditure on infrastructure was not included in FFP/P&S so surely gains from selling infrastucture should be excluded too. What you could do is sell your ground then buy it back again. And the do it again and again... You could them spend as much as you wanted on players. If you sell an asset at a profit that goes into the Profit and Loss account as profit on sales or an asset. The same way that if we bought a player and sold him at a profit that too would show in the Profit and Loss Account. Don't get me wrong the whole thing is completely wrong but until the loop hole is stopped teams will continue to do it. The same way Watford had 10 loan players from their parent club to get promoted. Or Man City's Chairman paying £400m to name the Etihad after his own company. I just think DC see the fans as a cash cow to milk and look no further for any investment or ways to work around the rules. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
room0035 Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 20 minutes ago, ChinaOwl said: Why are people so convinced that Dejphon Chansiri's father and brother even give a rat's a r s e about Sheffield Wednesday? I suppose it's possible that they do and that they would be open to investment. But I have yet to see even one iota of evidence to suggest they are. They both regularly travel to Europe on official business but how often has either even bothered to show their faces at a match? They both have interests in multiple businesses outside Thai Union and a huge network of other business contacts in Thailand yet our owner has to use his own name or non trading companies to generate advertising revenue. Does that not seem a little odd? Also at Thai Union AGM's they are just plain dismissive of any conversation related to football in England simply just stating that it is a matter for DC and him alone. On the balance of probability, I would say that this project solely belongs to DC in the family and nobody else has an interest in being part of it. I guess it will all become clear in due course. The Thai food group are related to two clubs in our league ourselves and Reading. Have a read of the below this seems to suggest that both clubs are owned by related business entities, the sons of major players at the Thai food group his brother is one of the senior players in the group and it suggest a love of English football in China which make the lack of any investment seem even stranger. As we could have the John West Hillsborough stadium and a few million quid into the club each season but not even a few advertising boards. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3203892/Two-Thai-brothers-fortunes-fish-sons-hooked-Sheffield-Wednesday-Reading.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quist Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 On 16/04/2019 at 03:44, Junk Smuggler said: Unfortunately he has a point. The FFP / P&S are a pain in the rectum but the rules must apply to all clubs in the league. You're going to get teams that gamble somewhat and fail (as only 3 teams can get promoted). Something has to be done about the parachute payments though - maybe a deferral to be paid at the end of the following season based on the annul wage budget. It can't be seen to be used to boost promotion hopes for a relegated club. When Newcastle last came down they made good money selling the likes of Sissoko etc then bought their way back up buying Gayle etc. The rules are not same for all in the league, parachute payments are a form of income like any other yet they are exempted which gives any team in receipt of them a huge advantage over the others. It is a stupid situation where you are trying to have a level playing field but effectively giving several teams equivalent of a points bonus before a ball is kicked. The current rules also favour those teams who are situated where extra revenue can easily be generated, which works against Wednesday and in favour of others whose grounds are far more commercial. There are only two options scrap parachute payments all together (perhaps except for original members of premier league who have never received them) or scrap the P&S as it stands as it is completely unworkable and has not been properly thought through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quist Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 Perhaps we should offer to send Jordan Rhodes back so that could pick up rest of his wages and balance of transfer fee. Pity he did not mention when we were buying Rhodes. By the way I will accept your money but I will now complain about you as I know this has messed up your P & S situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChinaOwl Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 3 minutes ago, room0035 said: The Thai food group are related to two clubs in our league ourselves and Reading. Have a read of the below this seems to suggest that both clubs are owned by related business entities, the sons of major players at the Thai food group his brother is one of the senior players in the group and it suggest a love of English football in China which make the lack of any investment seem even stranger. As we could have the John West Hillsborough stadium and a few million quid into the club each season but not even a few advertising boards. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3203892/Two-Thai-brothers-fortunes-fish-sons-hooked-Sheffield-Wednesday-Reading.html When I see something tangible to back it up I will believe it. Until then, it is a press report that I will treat will the same level of open scepticism I treat other reports in the press. Just because it is written in a national paper does not make it it factually true. Advertising hoardings and names flashed across big screens at the ground would be more convincing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birley Owl 1867 Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 4 hours ago, striker said: The loophole may well be closed, but if its currently within the rules, not sure why or how they would be punished. They've used their FFP 'get out of jail' card though, so really is promotion or bust for them now over the next couple of seasons. Sold a major asset to remain compliant, only time will tell if worth it. The Efl can shut the loophole whenever they want by declaring it against the regulations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballmeist Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 4 hours ago, Owling Wolfe said: Derby’s owner sold their ground to his own company to get round FFP and next thing they are posting profits of £14.5Million. If Chansiri can do that either himself or through his father then why wouldn’t you want that to happen. It would give Bruce a sizeable war chest for next year. People tend to forget that people from Thailand consider honour to be the most important thing especially between family and friends. As long as the ground is bought back when we eventually get to the prem then what is the problem. When we eventually get to the prem ... we might not ever get there. I don't understand why people are even talking about this. Norwich and/or Leeds/Sheff Utd are going up in the automatics this year without parachute payments and without having had to worry about selling their ground. You don't need to break P&S rules to get into the prem if you do a proper job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftpeg Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 He is having a good old whinge now. Give it 2 years when those sweet failure payouts from being relegated stop and he will sing from a very different hymn sheet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
striker Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 25 minutes ago, Birley Owl 1867 said: The Efl can shut the loophole whenever they want by declaring it against the regulations. Don't disagree, have they done that yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIG D Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 22 hours ago, SiJ said: Pretty sure we are set for a soft embargo this summer. Chansiri said as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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