newbster Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Rhubarb n Custard said: Whilst I get the basics of FFP I can't say I really understand. Could someone give a simplified version? I get there are limits and we've spent beyond what we should, which begs the question how come we can afford these loanees ? (Pleased as I am to see them) When will any embargo start and end ? Check owlsaboutstat on twitter then can explain a few things especially @ploehmann Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handworth52 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 the figures what the league are interested in are out at the end of the month,as soon as there sent to the football league we are under what chansiri called a soft embargo , then its a full embargo if we cant convince the football league that we are getting our house in order off the pitch. we are 10 million plus over according to chansiri ,with all the players leaving this summer and a lot on big money the league might be more lenient with us, I think we will only be allowed to sign free transfers and loans ,I think they allowed Birmingham 3 loans but they aint allowed to sign anyone for a fee. that might be the reason for getting 3 in now ,hopefully we will be allowed to sign hector on a free too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Markowski77 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 1 hour ago, asteener1867 said: What makes you think that Mark? I hope you are right, but Ive seen nowt to intimate it will be changing, that it needs changing is hardly the question.... It simply has to, otherwise the EFL will have 12/14 clubs every transfer window not been able to sign anyone, meaning viewing figures will drop, interest in the league will go down and overall faith in the EFL will take a nosedive. Less money for them etc etc The new rules came into force in 16/17 season, since then we have championship clubs regularly spending 10million + on players , and the average wage of a championship player is now is probably well in excess of 15k a week. The current system can't last for too much longer, surely? This is just my opinion but I'm hoping it is Going to change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asteener1867 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 16 minutes ago, Markowski77 said: It simply has to, otherwise the EFL will have 12/14 clubs every transfer window not been able to sign anyone, meaning viewing figures will drop, interest in the league will go down and overall faith in the EFL will take a nosedive. Less money for them etc etc The new rules came into force in 16/17 season, since then we have championship clubs regularly spending 10million + on players , and the average wage of a championship player is now is probably well in excess of 15k a week. The current system can't last for too much longer, surely? This is just my opinion but I'm hoping it is Going to change Hope you are right mate................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sham67 Posted February 1, 2019 Share Posted February 1, 2019 13 minutes ago, Markowski77 said: It simply has to, otherwise the EFL will have 12/14 clubs every transfer window not been able to sign anyone, meaning viewing figures will drop, interest in the league will go down and overall faith in the EFL will take a nosedive. Less money for them etc etc The new rules came into force in 16/17 season, since then we have championship clubs regularly spending 10million + on players , and the average wage of a championship player is now is probably well in excess of 15k a week. The current system can't last for too much longer, surely? This is just my opinion but I'm hoping it is Going to change The clubs collectively make the rules. If enough don't like them, they'll be changed. I would imagine several Championship Chairmen are lobbying intensively for this. Their other option is to leave the EFL and set up their own competition, aka PL2. Things cannot and will not stay the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhubarb n Custard Posted February 1, 2019 Author Share Posted February 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Sham67 said: The clubs collectively make the rules. If enough don't like them, they'll be changed. I would imagine several Championship Chairmen are lobbying intensively for this. Their other option is to leave the EFL and set up their own competition, aka PL2. Things cannot and will not stay the same. Hope you're right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semedo's ferret Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 We'll drop into another soft embargo around April time, but will be able to prove that are working towards a more 'sustainable' model in time for the summer rebuild job. Not renewing several Contracts and maybe some other sales, will be replaced by loanees and cheaper permanent deals on less than who's left. Bruce has a rebuilding job to do and we need to let him do it without expecting a top 6 place. Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brommers Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 17 hours ago, Sonny said: No problem mate as we both agree this is the best and clearest explanation. https://www.mikethornton.xyz/new-ffp-tests/ Only read a bit of that before identifying a simple cunning plan to get out of the whole FFP P&S mess. It states quite clearly that expenses for running a woman's team are deducted. So, and here's the clever bit, why don't we just transfer wasters and long term injured players like Abdi, Jones, Hooper and Lee to our women's team? Must be about £10M a year in wages and medical bills (and food for Hooper). Sorted. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
room0035 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 50 minutes ago, Semedo's ferret said: We'll drop into another soft embargo around April time, but will be able to prove that are working towards a more 'sustainable' model in time for the summer rebuild job. Not renewing several Contracts and maybe some other sales, will be replaced by loanees and cheaper permanent deals on less than who's left. Bruce has a rebuilding job to do and we need to let him do it without expecting a top 6 place. Lol. That's all very well but the fans are currently paying top 2 prices with the chairman contributing nothing because the rules don't allow him too apparently according to DC, we could have got our house in order in one transfer window by selling a few players instead we will be under embargo again and the fans still paying £40 a ticket. If the EFL look at us this way will they lift any sanction or instead impose more we will find out soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helmut_rooster Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 17 hours ago, Markowski77 said: I can see P&S rules changing very shortly, the EFL has to do something. As it will soon be half the championship in an embargo unable to sign anyone. Since P&S was reinvented, wages & transfers in the championship has jumped 10 fold. it needs change and a complete overhaul as it is currently a joke. They can say it's gone up with inflation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnyowl Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 Allowed losses of £39million over three year cycle. Lost £29million in the last two I believe. So can only lose £10million this year. Think we lost £20million last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plonk Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 15 hours ago, Markowski77 said: It simply has to, otherwise the EFL will have 12/14 clubs every transfer window not been able to sign anyone, meaning viewing figures will drop, interest in the league will go down and overall faith in the EFL will take a nosedive. Less money for them etc etc The new rules came into force in 16/17 season, since then we have championship clubs regularly spending 10million + on players , and the average wage of a championship player is now is probably well in excess of 15k a week. The current system can't last for too much longer, surely? This is just my opinion but I'm hoping it is Going to change Maybe that’s the EFLs cunning plan. If you’ve been in the prem you will be helped to get back, the rest of you have no decking chance despite how much money you want to chuck at it. Typical Wednesday really, firs5 time ever we have an owner with a bit of dosh and this happens. They will only change the rules once we are poor again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Willow Owl Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 16 hours ago, Sham67 said: The clubs collectively make the rules. If enough don't like them, they'll be changed. I would imagine several Championship Chairmen are lobbying intensively for this. Their other option is to leave the EFL and set up their own competition, aka PL2. Things cannot and will not stay the same. 16 hours ago, Markowski77 said: It simply has to, otherwise the EFL will have 12/14 clubs every transfer window not been able to sign anyone, meaning viewing figures will drop, interest in the league will go down and overall faith in the EFL will take a nosedive. Less money for them etc etc The new rules came into force in 16/17 season, since then we have championship clubs regularly spending 10million + on players , and the average wage of a championship player is now is probably well in excess of 15k a week. The current system can't last for too much longer, surely? This is just my opinion but I'm hoping it is Going to change I agree, Has to change. Just as an example of how unfair it currently is. Stoke have spent over 50 million this season since relegation, 35 million they are allowed after relegation in the first year plus the 39 million over 3 years EFL rule. Absolute stupidity at it's finest from the EFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theowlsman Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 (edited) Bent, corrupt, nonsense preventing wealthy owners from having an advantage, to stop owners spending their way to the Premiership, a restriction of trade. Influenced by elite Premier League clubs who like to keep potential threats to their position in check. Is one rumour I heard on the internet, not my opinion. Sold as preventing clubs spending beyond their means, and getting into financial difficulties. Sees football authorities interfering with the operations of privately owned businesses. Have powers to deal with breaches as they feel fit, inconsistently, with no real great understanding in advance of what the absolute consequences of breaching rules means. Consequences can depend upon which club is breaking rules, and how much their owner(s) might be worth. Go figure. None of the above are stated as fact, just rumours picked up off the internet. Not intended to suggest there is any truth whatsoever in the above. Just to stimulate debate. Edited February 2, 2019 by theowlsman 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poite Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 Erm...are you saying that you still don't fully understand it following the answers chansiri gave during the Steve Bruce press conference? He explained it beautifully Ya big thicko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semedo's ferret Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 2 hours ago, room0035 said: That's all very well but the fans are currently paying top 2 prices with the chairman contributing nothing because the rules don't allow him too apparently according to DC, we could have got our house in order in one transfer window by selling a few players instead we will be under embargo again and the fans still paying £40 a ticket. If the EFL look at us this way will they lift any sanction or instead impose more we will find out soon. Reliably informed that DC would have sold at the right price. But his valuation and that of potential buyers were miles apart. And isn't any doubt about it. DC can't put more in. Not sure why after all the talk on this subject you would doubt this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonofbert2 Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 DC's simple definition is the easiest to follow - FFP = Forty or Fifty Players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhubarb n Custard Posted February 2, 2019 Author Share Posted February 2, 2019 @theowlsman There's logic to both. Regards the latter, if an owner has personal wealth I don't see why he shouldn't be able to spend it how he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theowlsman Posted February 2, 2019 Share Posted February 2, 2019 1 minute ago, Rhubarb n Custard said: @theowlsman There's logic to both. Regards the latter, if an owner has personal wealth I don't see why he shouldn't be able to spend it how he wants. I couldn’t possibly comment. It all seems a bit bizarre to me. In as much that for the first time in like forever, we find a Sugar Daddy wanting to spend his way to the top, after buying his own business, which he ought to be able to do what he likes with, and the football authorities put barriers in the way, with a potential for hefty fines etc. Making it look like we have money problems, which we don’t as long as Mr C is happy to keep chucking his money at us. The only financial concern is a longer term one. Ideally, Mr C would wish to bring in additional, external revenues, or have other investors alongside, to share the burden. You’d imagine we’ll get there eventually, though seemingly, nothing imminent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhubarb n Custard Posted February 2, 2019 Author Share Posted February 2, 2019 4 minutes ago, theowlsman said: I couldn’t possibly comment. It all seems a bit bizarre to me. In as much that for the first time in like forever, we find a Sugar Daddy wanting to spend his way to the top, after buying his own business, which he ought to be able to do what he likes with, and the football authorities put barriers in the way, with a potential for hefty fines etc. Making it look like we have money problems, which we don’t as long as Mr C is happy to keep chucking his money at us. The only financial concern is a longer term one. Ideally, Mr C would wish to bring in additional, external revenues, or have other investors alongside, to share the burden. You’d imagine we’ll get there eventually, though seemingly, nothing imminent. On the plus side having a chairman with funds is no bad thing in the long term. We also now have a manager with connections and plenty of experience in this division. He will have to trade his way out of the situation and I believe he's quite capable of doing so. The inevitable cull will straighten the books and we can rebuild from there. If we don't make top 6 next term we should be there or there abouts the season after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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