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Perspective - This is a Major Rebuild & Jos Needs Time

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22 minutes ago, The only way is S6 said:

 

Despite DC saying at the fans forum, the terms of an embargo would be that we could trade on the basis of one out, one in? Or do we carry on with a squad of 14 in your opinion?

No your can't the embargo means you cannot sign anyone, the P&S rules state you have to have a minimum squad of 24 players which we will have so if we break the rule we get no one it simple.

 

DC trust me when I say this does not have a clue about running a football team what makes you think he has checked anything - his financial plan for this season is promotion or bust.

 

From the EFL rule book

 

6.1          A Championship Club which fails to fulfil the Fair Play Requirement in accordance with these Rules (or is in default of any obligation to provide information in accordance with these Rules) shall be subject to a registration embargo (the “Embargo”) such that The League shall refuse any application by that Championship Club to register any Player with that Championship Club save where the Championship Club:

 

Exceptions are for trainees, if the club has less than 24 players but any incoming players annual cost has to be less than £600,000 a year pro rata, this included all salary costs to the club so basically no players on more than about £10,000 a week 

 

6.2          A Championship Club subject to an Embargo shall not be permitted to:

6.2.1       pay or commit to pay any Transfer Fee, Compensation Fee, Loan Fee or any other form of payment including without limitation sell on and/or contingent payments, in respect of the registration of Players permitted by Rule 6.1; or

 

So no transfer fees for new players so free agents only

 

And also will not be allowed to pay any fees to agents.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, room0035 said:

No your can't the embargo means you cannot sign anyone, the P&S rules state you have to have a minimum squad of 24 players which we will have so if we break the rule we get no one it simple.

 

DC trust me when I say this does not have a clue about running a football team what makes you think he has checked anything - his financial plan for this season is promotion or bust.

 

From the EFL rule book

 

6.1          A Championship Club which fails to fulfil the Fair Play Requirement in accordance with these Rules (or is in default of any obligation to provide information in accordance with these Rules) shall be subject to a registration embargo (the “Embargo”) such that The League shall refuse any application by that Championship Club to register any Player with that Championship Club save where the Championship Club:

 

Exceptions are for trainees, if the club has less than 24 players but any incoming players annual cost has to be less than £600,000 a year pro rata, this included all salary costs to the club so basically no players on more than about £10,000 a week 

 

6.2          A Championship Club subject to an Embargo shall not be permitted to:

6.2.1       pay or commit to pay any Transfer Fee, Compensation Fee, Loan Fee or any other form of payment including without limitation sell on and/or contingent payments, in respect of the registration of Players permitted by Rule 6.1; or

 

So no transfer fees for new players so free agents only

 

And also will not be allowed to pay any fees to agents.

 

 

Looks like we're utterly fecked. Cheers DC 

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1 minute ago, BRADDO said:

Looks like we're utterly fecked. Cheers DC 

January we have one option sell players. 

 

Or come April 2019 we will once again be under an embargo.

 

I can't believe i am saying this but sell Bannan,Reach and Fessi get in £25-30m to clear the financial issues get a few loan replacements in, then come the summer start again and building the team from scratch. 

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4 minutes ago, room0035 said:

January we have one option sell players. 

 

Or come April 2019 we will once again be under an embargo.

 

I can't believe i am saying this but sell Bannan,Reach and Fessi get in £25-30m to clear the financial issues get a few loan replacements in, then come the summer start again and building the team from scratch. 

If we sell them we'll be relegated. If we don't sell them we'll be under the embargo and unable to refresh our poor squad. We'll be relegated. It's a right royal mess and a disgrace. 

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Just now, BRADDO said:

If we sell them we'll be relegated. If we don't sell them we'll be under the embargo and unable to refresh our poor squad. We'll be relegated. It's a right royal mess and a disgrace. 

But if we get the money in we can reinvest some of it to bring in a few players,

 

We need a solid centre back, a midfield general maybe two new full backs.

 

Reach goes and Fessi or matias covers his role (until matias leaves in the summer)

Bannan is currently not being used as an attacking midfielder we may as well get the £8m from Villa and buy a defensive midfielder.

Fessi has from 17 games this season played 4 or 5 games last season he managed 10 games if we sold him got £8-10m for him would he be that much of a loss considering he has missed over 75% of the games over the last season and this. COuld sort our issues. 

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Major rebuild yes. JL at the helm, no. Seen enough already.

 

Goodnight.

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15 hours ago, oldishowl said:

With regard to giving goals away.

It was no coincidence that we got our first clean sheet in a game where we stopped trying to play it out from the back .

 

I found it ironic that Jos says on the OS that the clean sheet was because the defenders didn’t make mistakes.  Surely even he will realise that is because they were not trying to play football on the edge of our own box 

 

The reason we have not been creating chances is because we play too deep. You don’t create many chances passing it around in your own half 

 

Can't fault you mate, summed up perfectly.

 

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Just now, Halifax Owls said:

 

Can't fault you mate, summed up perfectly.

 

 

He is clueless. JL that is, not oldishowl. Oldishowl for manager.

 

 

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14 minutes ago, theowlsman said:

Major rebuild yes. JL at the helm, no. Seen enough already.

 

Goodnight.

It would seem we are proper under the bus. The myth that clear out the dead wood (not my view of things) means we are ok to spend next season and recruit new players has been well and truly burst. It would seem likely we will have to sell off the crown jewels of FF AR and BB just to be able to recruit the odd journeyman and freebie. I would have to agree with Joses lack of knowledge of the english game he is not the man to take us through what is likely to be 2 seasons of fighting for survival in the championship. 

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1 hour ago, room0035 said:

No your can't the embargo means you cannot sign anyone, the P&S rules state you have to have a minimum squad of 24 players which we will have so if we break the rule we get no one it simple.

 

DC trust me when I say this does not have a clue about running a football team what makes you think he has checked anything - his financial plan for this season is promotion or bust.

 

From the EFL rule book

 

6.1          A Championship Club which fails to fulfil the Fair Play Requirement in accordance with these Rules (or is in default of any obligation to provide information in accordance with these Rules) shall be subject to a registration embargo (the “Embargo”) such that The League shall refuse any application by that Championship Club to register any Player with that Championship Club save where the Championship Club:

 

Exceptions are for trainees, if the club has less than 24 players but any incoming players annual cost has to be less than £600,000 a year pro rata, this included all salary costs to the club so basically no players on more than about £10,000 a week 

 

6.2          A Championship Club subject to an Embargo shall not be permitted to:

6.2.1       pay or commit to pay any Transfer Fee, Compensation Fee, Loan Fee or any other form of payment including without limitation sell on and/or contingent payments, in respect of the registration of Players permitted by Rule 6.1; or

 

So no transfer fees for new players so free agents only

 

And also will not be allowed to pay any fees to agents.

 

 

 

But don't those two points clearly state we can bring players in? Your first paragraph 'any incoming players'. And the next to last sentence, 'free agents only'

 

Unless I'm going daft, aren't they 2 options for bringing players in? Yes or no.

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I think we all understand Jos has not had the financial backing because of FFP. That aside I have stiil not seen anything to suggest if he were given the money he would improve the team. He's signed 3 players:-

Joey who at times is like a headless chicken, he works hard but has little quality or creativity for a midfield player. Onomah who plays in fits and starts but has no consistency.

Hector who is proving a very good loan signing.

So one success out of three.

 

On top of that the tactics are all over the place and far too defensive and we're not even good at that.

No settled team (by his choice) so a total lack of understanding throughout the team, not just in defence.

He never makes substitutions until around 65 minutes unless of injury irrelevant on how the the match is progressing or individuals are playing. For crying out loud WHY?

Where's the leadership from the bench during the match when things are going wrong. You can't sit on your backside and expect things to turn round without identifying what's going wrong and doing something about it.

 

So to summarise, no he shouldn't be given more time as he is not doing enough to show he can get the best out of the squad he has at his disposal.

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The only way we'll progress, is by taking a backwards step. That doesn't mean relegation, it just means reigning in our expectations.

 

Instead of turning upto Hillsborough, having had 10 pints and booing these kids

 

Lets turn up having had 2 pints and lets cheer them, actual support they deserve to feel. Some of these kids will have been at the club longer than the likes of Abdi, Boyd and Jones put together - so they're worth getting behind, not to mention they've achieved some decent things as youngsters.

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Just now, bigash_swfc said:

The only way we'll progress, is by taking a backwards step. That doesn't mean relegation, it just means reigning in our expectations.

 

Instead of turning upto Hillsborough, having had 10 pints and booing these kids

 

Lets turn up having had 2 pints and lets cheer them, actual support they deserve to feel. Some of these kids will have been at the club longer than the likes of Abdi, Boyd and Jones put together - so they're worth getting behind, not to mention they've achieved some decent things as youngsters.

 

I dont disagree but the club can not ask the fans to lower expectations while charging highest ticket prices in the league.

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2 minutes ago, bigash_swfc said:

The only way we'll progress, is by taking a backwards step. That doesn't mean relegation, it just means reigning in our expectations.

 

Instead of turning upto Hillsborough, having had 10 pints and booing these kids

 

Lets turn up having had 2 pints and lets cheer them, actual support they deserve to feel. Some of these kids will have been at the club longer than the likes of Abdi, Boyd and Jones put together - so they're worth getting behind, not to mention they've achieved some decent things as youngsters.

 

Telling people how much to drink is only going to end in tears.

 

At the moment, I’d advise them to stay in the pub and get rat-arsed.

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1 hour ago, room0035 said:

No your can't the embargo means you cannot sign anyone, the P&S rules state you have to have a minimum squad of 24 players which we will have so if we break the rule we get no one it simple.

 

DC trust me when I say this does not have a clue about running a football team what makes you think he has checked anything - his financial plan for this season is promotion or bust.

 

From the EFL rule book

 

6.1          A Championship Club which fails to fulfil the Fair Play Requirement in accordance with these Rules (or is in default of any obligation to provide information in accordance with these Rules) shall be subject to a registration embargo (the “Embargo”) such that The League shall refuse any application by that Championship Club to register any Player with that Championship Club save where the Championship Club:

 

Exceptions are for trainees, if the club has less than 24 players but any incoming players annual cost has to be less than £600,000 a year pro rata, this included all salary costs to the club so basically no players on more than about £10,000 a week 

 

6.2          A Championship Club subject to an Embargo shall not be permitted to:

6.2.1       pay or commit to pay any Transfer Fee, Compensation Fee, Loan Fee or any other form of payment including without limitation sell on and/or contingent payments, in respect of the registration of Players permitted by Rule 6.1; or

 

So no transfer fees for new players so free agents only

 

And also will not be allowed to pay any fees to agents.

 

 

 

But will the embargo be lifted when all the players on big wages leave? Hooper, Lee, Abdi, Jones, Westwood will all be off in the summer. Somebody might come in for Rhodes too. Reach may go.

 

Surely the EFL will see this? 

 

Clutching at straws maybe. 

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11 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said:

 

But will the embargo be lifted when all the players on big wages leave? Hooper, Lee, Abdi, Jones, Westwood will all be off in the summer. Somebody might come in for Rhodes too. Reach may go.

 

Surely the EFL will see this? 

 

Clutching at straws maybe. 

 

Believe the things quoted in this thread are for guidance only, and the EFL deals with things on a case by case basis. It appears we have had our embargo lifted because of our actions and planned actions regarding the financial situation - offloading Rhodes last summer, bringing in youth players, and of course next summer allowing all the out of contract high earners to leave. I don't believe, if we carry out the clear out in the summer, that we'll be under embargo. We've had our hands slapped, we've taken/are taking steps to rectify the situation (which takes a number of transfer windows), so unless we try another Rhodes-esq signing in the summer, then we'll be fine to freshen the squad next year.

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1 minute ago, oh_weds_we_love_you said:

 

Believe the things quoted in this thread are for guidance only, and the EFL deals with things on a case by case basis. It appears we have had our embargo lifted because of our actions and planned actions regarding the financial situation - offloading Rhodes last summer, bringing in youth players, and of course next summer allowing all the out of contract high earners to leave. I don't believe, if we carry out the clear out in the summer, that we'll be under embargo. We've had our hands slapped, we've taken/are taking steps to rectify the situation (which takes a number of transfer windows), so unless we try another Rhodes-esq signing in the summer, then we'll be fine to freshen the squad next year.

 

You’d like to think they do it on a case by case basis. Surely the EFL will and can see that the money we’ve spent has been largely wasted and it hasn’t given us an advantage at all. Half the players we’ve signed on big wages don’t play or are out injured! 

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31 minutes ago, The only way is S6 said:

 

But don't those two points clearly state we can bring players in? Your first paragraph 'any incoming players'. And the next to last sentence, 'free agents only'

 

Unless I'm going daft, aren't they 2 options for bringing players in? Yes or no.

how many free agents have we signed in the last 4 years that have had no agents fees? 

 

I can think of none. So under an embargo you cannot pay agents fees.

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20 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said:

 

But will the embargo be lifted when all the players on big wages leave? Hooper, Lee, Abdi, Jones, Westwood will all be off in the summer. Somebody might come in for Rhodes too. Reach may go.

 

Surely the EFL will see this? 

 

Clutching at straws maybe. 

Nope the rules are based on this season and the last two.

 

We broke them this season so what ever the losses last year we know the losses broke the rules.

 

This year we have the last two set of accounts and this season 2015/16 accounts where we lost £11m are replaced by this season, so in basic terms we need to have less than £11m loss this season to have an hope of not being under an embargo. 

 

If we wait until the summer we will have spunk another £20-25m on wages so will once again break the P&S laws, 

 

I think based on the players that left in the summer, the fee for Hunt, loan fee for Rhodes and the saving in their wages we still need to find at least £5m to avoid breaching the P&S laws so we will have to sell players or achieve DC goal of promotion this season. I know which route I would take.

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12 minutes ago, SallyCinnamon said:

 

You’d like to think they do it on a case by case basis. Surely the EFL will and can see that the money we’ve spent has been largely wasted and it hasn’t given us an advantage at all. Half the players we’ve signed on big wages don’t play or are out injured! 

 

Exactly, it wouldn't surprise me if our argument had been that we, at one point, had a whole first team out injured, and still have a serious injury list and that's why we recruited a big squad to try and cope with that - especially in the absence of the old loan system.

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