We’ve Had Enough Playing For You

[lanzaroteowl]

7 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

"I'M BETTER THAN YOU. I AM. TELL HIM EVERYONE. I'M BETTER. THEY ALL KNOW IT. PLEASE SOMEONE TELL HIM. I AM. I CAN PROVE IT."

 

Firstly, you want to distill everything into a binary value and don't appreciate the nuances of many arguments being based on the attitudes of posters rather than some of the points they make. Secondly, of the 4 managers we've had since Megson, Jones' time had come and I apologise for not remembering every post from that time, history remains undecided on Gray, I was actually very critical regarding Carvalhal at the end of his tenure and the furore over Luhukay is largely on the back of just 4 games. 

 

Jones time came at least six months before he was removed. Gray was never going to be the one.  No use waiting until the ene of Carvahals tenure to express your concerns when he also should have gone six months earlier. We can't wait six months to come to the same conclusion on Jos. He needs to go now

[HIGHERSTATE]

Its really telling what tom lees said about a month ago in the interview on r sheff..he just said its going to take time for players to get used to passing about at the back and jos's ideas..

 

Well it looks like the players dont feel comfortable at all and his ideas are clearly not working

 

Whatever he did in germany its not transferring to one of the most competitive and toughest leagues in the world. 

[DJMortimer]

2 minutes ago, lanzaroteowl said:

Jones time came at least six months before he was removed. Gray was never going to be the one.  No use waiting until the ene of Carvahals tenure to express your concerns when he also should have gone six months earlier. We can't wait six months to come to the same conclusion on Jos. He needs to go now

 

Some people are addicted to change and usually get very angry when they don't get it quickly. There are plenty of examples of managers who were left in their post too long, and plenty where the opposite is true. Jones should have gone earlier, but I don't know about six months. Gray did a creditable job under the circumstances but we'll never know how he would have done with the silly money that came later. I was unhappy with Carvalhal for a while before he left. In fact I was livid at how we approached the play-off games against Huddersfield. But I was realistic that we would not sack someone who had come within a whisker of promotion in consecutive seasons.

 

As for Luhukay, he came into an extremely difficult situation and has done reasonably well on balance. The backlash is out of proportion with what he's done. But that is not to say he is beyond criticism. Whilst I applaud some of his principles, I'm not convinced we are getting the best possible results from them. We are making too many changes, too often. 

[sweetsheri]

2 hours ago, jonesy87shef said:

 

I’m not saying the players have stopped playing for Jos. I haven’t seen last 2 games.

 

However what has a previous run got to do with the current situation? If players actually appear to be giving up. Along with losing 4 on the trot. Conceding 12 in that period, it doesn’t bode well.

 

Myself and others weren’t confident in the squad prior to the international break. Those doubts are now showing on the pitch unfortunately. 

 

We need to get to 50 points asap 

Bang on

[stanningtonowl]

3 hours ago, DJMortimer said:

Oh good, the old reliable 'lost the dressing room' angle.

 

Genius.

 

Simple yes or no answer. Did you

enjoy that today?

[sweetsheri]

4 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Some people are addicted to change and usually get very angry when they don't get it quickly. There are plenty of examples of managers who were left in their post too long, and plenty where the opposite is true. Jones should have gone earlier, but I don't know about six months. Gray did a creditable job under the circumstances but we'll never know how he would have done with the silly money that came later. I was unhappy with Carvalhal for a while before he left. In fact I was livid at how we approached the play-off games against Huddersfield. But I was realistic that we would not sack someone who had come within a whisker of promotion in consecutive seasons.

 

As for Luhukay, he came into an extremely difficult situation and has done reasonably well on balance. The backlash is out of proportion with what he's done. But that is not to say he is beyond criticism. Whilst I applaud some of his principles, I'm not convinced we are getting the best possible results from them. We are making too many changes, too often. 

Does he need to lie to the fans? Treat us with such contempt?

 

Unless if course he does actually think Westwood is the 3rd best keeper at the club?

[DJMortimer]

1 minute ago, stanningtonowl said:

Simple yes or no answer. Did you

enjoy that today?

 

That's a very different matter to whether the players have quit on the manager. In the last fortnight of 1992 we were still mathematically in the title race. Not the second tier; the whole bloody country. Let that sink in for a moment. Then ask how a team that did that could also lose 1-6 and 1-7 in that same season.

 

It was a poor performance, no doubt about that. The alarming thing was the collapse in confidence after Norwich took the lead. Before that it was a fairly even (if quite dull) contest.

 

[stanningtonowl]

2 hours ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Even when we lost 1 in 9 and went up to 6th place? Or the excellent run at the end of last season?

 

If the situation is really that bad, then there would be no need to make stuff up would there?

 

Can I suggest that instead of sitting typing long boring diatribes at other people's opinions, you go to a match and actually see how bad it is. Might make you change your mind about Jos. 

[DJMortimer]

1 minute ago, sweetsheri said:

Does he need to lie to the fans? Treat us with such contempt?

 

Unless if course he does actually think Westwood is the 3rd best keeper at the club?

 

Contempt for the fans? Behave.

 

I don't want to be the one that tells you Santa Claus doesn't exist, but if you are listening to interviews in a football context for deep meaning and openness...

 

[sweetsheri]

Just now, DJMortimer said:

 

Contempt for the fans? Behave.

 

I don't want to be the one that tells you Santa Claus doesn't exist, but if you are listening to interviews in a football context for deep meaning and openness...

 

So you think he believes that then?

 

In which case we have got big problems.

 

 

[DJMortimer]

1 minute ago, stanningtonowl said:

Can I suggest that instead of sitting typing long boring diatribes at other people's opinions, you go to a match and actually see how bad it is. Might make you change your mind about Jos. 

 

Of course. I've never thought of going to a game before.

 

Can I suggest that instead of assuming primacy and making personal comments you respect the right to alternative opinions and stop being so angry?

 

[Musn't Grumble]

When Wednesdayites fall out, the gods weep.

[DJMortimer]

2 minutes ago, sweetsheri said:

So you think he believes that then?

 

In which case we have got big problems.

 

 

 

About Westwood? I don't know.

 

There are multiple rumours out there. Some of them he almost certainly would not confirm even if they were true. But it is not out of the question anyway. You're judging Westwood on how he was playing a season and a half ago. Last season he was nothing like his previous standard. Regardless, he is not part of the club's future plans whereas Dawson and Wildsmith are.

 

[stanningtonowl]

13 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

That's a very different matter to whether the players have quit on the manager. In the last fortnight of 1992 we were still mathematically in the title race. Not the second tier; the whole bloody country. Let that sink in for a moment. Then ask how a team that did that could also lose 1-6 and 1-7 in that same season.

 

It was a poor performance, no doubt about that. The alarming thing was the collapse in confidence after Norwich took the lead. Before that it was a fairly even (if quite dull) contest.

 

I didn't ask if the players had quit on the manager.

[stanningtonowl]

8 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Of course. I've never thought of going to a game before.

 

Can I suggest that instead of assuming primacy and making personal comments you respect the right to alternative opinions and stop being so angry?

 

Just brill. Im starting to actually enjoy some of your replies and wonder what turn of phrase you will use next in order to make yourself seem so much cleverer than everyone else because you

are the only one that can see what Jos is trying to do. How are the emporers new clothes? 

[DJMortimer]

3 minutes ago, stanningtonowl said:

I didn't ask if the players had quit on the manager.

 

That is the thread topic and the subject of my reply that you quoted.

[lanzaroteowl]

22 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Some people are addicted to change and usually get very angry when they don't get it quickly. There are plenty of examples of managers who were left in their post too long, and plenty where the opposite is true. Jones should have gone earlier, but I don't know about six months. Gray did a creditable job under the circumstances but we'll never know how he would have done with the silly money that came later. I was unhappy with Carvalhal for a while before he left. In fact I was livid at how we approached the play-off games against Huddersfield. But I was realistic that we would not sack someone who had come within a whisker of promotion in consecutive seasons.

 

As for Luhukay, he came into an extremely difficult situation and has done reasonably well on balance. The backlash is out of proportion with what he's done. But that is not to say he is beyond criticism. Whilst I applaud some of his principles, I'm not convinced we are getting the best possible results from them. We are making too many changes, too often. 

 

Some valid points but they all boil down to the fact we left it too long before we acted. Let's not make the same mistake over again. There can be no sentiment in this football business 

[stanningtonowl]

Just now, DJMortimer said:

 

That is the thread topic and the subject of my reply that you quoted.

But I simply asked if you enjoyed what you saw today. Yes or no?

[DJMortimer]

1 minute ago, stanningtonowl said:

Just brill. Im starting to actually enjoy some of your replies and wonder what turn of phrase you will use next in order to make yourself seem so much cleverer than everyone else because you

are the only one that can see what Jos is trying to do. How are the emporers new clothes? 

 

Still keeping it personal?

 

Well that clinches the debate doesn't it? Well played.

 

[stanningtonowl]

2 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Still keeping it personal?

 

Well that clinches the debate doesn't it? Well played.

 

You just keep following me around the boards giving me red arrows. Personal? Well played  

Edited November 3, 2018 by stanningtonowl