So Jos has now nailed his colours to the mast.

[Philb125]

4 minutes ago, Ronio said:

It's all about balancing the short against the long term.  I don't have a problem clearing out the dead wood, but that should really take place next summer when player contracts expire.  

 

Sure we can take an approach that favours the long term, but if that  is detrimental to short term results, then I don't agree with it. And the reason why is, as DC has stated previously.  If we don't go up this season, we will be facing big financial problems.  

 

Also, if results don't improve in the short to medium term, then the long term strategy really won't get off the ground. 

 

But you only really get to view that in hindsight yea? I mean prior to this season many thought Boyd was a better option than Penney. Now Penney has established himself no one ever says bring Boyd back. 

 

Dawsons stats this season are decent. I don’t think Westwood be doing any better or worse, not noticeably anyhow. But if we were playing him, no doubt we have to get rid of one of Wildsmith or Dawson. Then next season buy another Kean? 

 

While I agree our current approach is extreme, I can at least see reasons why. That said I could also see short term benefits to playing some of the others, but also cons of playing players on past reputation rather than current ability and form. Hutch looked beyond awful at the beginning of season, Westwood looked much worse last season even with settled back four in front of him. Boyd, well I don’t think I need to justify his exclusion. 

 

One im a little curious about is Jones as he looked decent and consistent prior to this season. But I trust manager in that he’s getting on and maybe not how I once remembered him. 

[Philb125]

1 minute ago, Mishowl said:

You actually said “playing the likes of Westwood and co” but don’t let facts get in the way. 

 

Are you saying that anyone that played in the Hillsborough debacle shouldn’t play or just Westwood? 

 

So I asked how Westwood and co got on last term vs blades, you responded with the result Westwood never played in. Yep, don’t let facts get on the way with your narrative. 

 

If I asked how Westwood and co got on vs Brentford would you quote this seasons score? Or is that ludicrous?? 

[Bouncing Owl]

Why it has taken until 2nd November to confirm this is anyone’s guess!

 

I wonder what the chairman thinks of this given that he’s paying around £120k PW on 5 players that his manager won’t play?

 

In my opinion Westwood and Hutchison should be involved with the senior team. They are clearly better players than Dawson and Joey. I understand they have had injury problems but so has everyone else in our injury ravaged squad.

[jonnyowl]

26 minutes ago, Philb125 said:

 

Did you see Westwood last season at all? Did you see hutch at the beginning of this season? 

 

I mean if we’re going back past their most recent ability / showings to judge current potential and value why stop there? 

 

Lets call upon Pressman, Walker, Palmer and Hirst. Admittedly they may not be great now but absolute world beaters in their day. 

Yeah because Dawson and Pelupessy have been fantastic this season!

 

 

[OxonOwl]

The players get paid regardless of whether they play or not. In some cases they may get paid more if they play. The bottom line is that the amount someone earns shouldn't be a factor in whether they are in the match day squad or not. That should be based on other criteria.

[ashley8]

So reputation  for being hard task master shows he is a tin God who picks kids not because  they are better (which he's been lucky that they have done  well) but because  they will not challenge. His own ego is helping  his demise 

[Philb125]

1 minute ago, Mishowl said:

The result at tue lane was 0-0 last season ant that’s where the game is on Friday. 

 

Keep banging on about Westwood if it makes you feel better. Who are the “co” you keep referring to and should they not play again? 

The co are the ten players that started alongside Westwood. The only named person in a post you responded to. With a score line he didn’t play in, to make a point that suited your narrative. 

 

However i I think the fact that much of the ‘& co’ when starting away from home, without Westwood did a damn site better, that despite a player being sent off.

 

Ironic that you stating a false fact to make a point actually makes just the opposite. 

 

 

[owler66]

2 hours ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

Do people really want to get a new manager in just so they'll pick the old guard till the end of the season even though they then have to let them go anyway in the summer and put all the kids in for next season?

Wouldn't that just set back 6 months what we're trying to do?

 

 

Don't think there's such a thing as long term in modern football any manager who looses 6 games on the trot is definitely walking on very thin ice and Jos is halfway there with 2 very tough matches looming. 

Yes think about the long term but not at the expense of the short term because you won't be here for it. 

[OxonOwl]

The reason people spend lots of money on season tickets will vary vastly from fan to fan but I bet very few, if any, spend their money to see the 11 top earners play, regardless of form or injury or fitness.

[poite]

8 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

1. For 5 months before they're released and the kids go back in again?
2. Surely putting the "best players" in should see an upturn in fortunes not a down turn?  And how is it in the interests of the long term to put in players who are leaving in the summer back in the team at the expense of players who are going to be here in the long term? 

 

You've misunderstood.

 

I'm saying we need a different manager who will play our best players. 

 

If it means a few more losses (to convince chansiri to get shut of Jos) then it would be a short term acceptance so we can get someone else who can do better for our long term future. 

 

I don't disagree with playing our younger players rather than the older players. Long term yes that might be better.

 

But for me it all comes back to the basic 'this season is up or bust' statement we received from the chairman. If that's the case then this season our long term future is absolutely dependant on the outcome of this season. So therefore we need our best players on that pitch now regardless whether they are in or out at the end of it

[poite]

1 minute ago, OxonOwl said:

The reason people spend lots of money on season tickets will vary vastly from fan to fan but I bet very few, if any, spend their money to see the 11 top earners play, regardless of form or injury or fitness.

No. They pay to watch the best players a club has regardless of wages

[Philb125]

1 minute ago, owler66 said:

Don't think there's such a thing as long term in modern football any manager who looses 6 games on the trot is definitely walking on very thin ice and Jos is halfway there with 2 very tough matches looming. 

Yes think about the long term but not at the expense of the short term because you won't be here for it. 

 

We just had a manager who only thought about short term. It bread cliques in the squad, favourites, it led to a star player potentially having his career ended, it led to 14 first teamers getting injured in a crisis I’ve not seen at any other club in 35 years of supporting football, it led to demotivating second string and potentially causing star prospects to leave through not seeing and opportunity to progress. 

 

Oh how I long for the better days of short sighted managers. 

[Philb125]

2 minutes ago, OxonOwl said:

The reason people spend lots of money on season tickets will vary vastly from fan to fan but I bet very few, if any, spend their money to see the 11 top earners play, regardless of form or injury or fitness.

 

I thought it said in small print if my favourites don’t play, I don’t pay!?! 

[Markowski77]

Very high risk strategy Jos is playing, yes we do need to blood in youngster but not completely alienate the experienced pros while doing so. 

[OxonOwl]

2 minutes ago, poite said:

You've misunderstood.

 

I'm saying we need a different manager who will play our best players. 

 

If it means a few more losses (to convince chansiri to get shut of Jos) then it would be a short term acceptance so we can get someone else who can do better for our long term future. 

 

I don't disagree with playing our younger players rather than the older players. Long term yes that might be better.

 

But for me it all comes back to the basic 'this season is up or bust' statement we received from the chairman. If that's the case then this season our long term future is absolutely dependant on the outcome of this season. So therefore we need our best players on that pitch now regardless whether they are in or out at the end of it

 

I feel you or other are saying they want a manager who plays your (or their) idea of who the best players are.

[poite]

Chairman: "I'll be honest. This season we need to get promoted otherwise we are screwed"

 

Manager: "well this season I thought I'd use the younger players from the academy instead of the older players. We won't have a chance of promotion but it will be good for the team"

 

Chairman: "oh ok then. Scrap what I said about us being screwed then. Sure it will be reyt"

[Philb125]

Just now, Markowski77 said:

Very high risk strategy Jos is playing, yes we do need to blood in youngster but not completely alienate the experienced pros while doing so. 

 

Did you watch / listen to the pre match presser? 

 

I only ask as Jos mentioned repeatedly how we have experience throughout the team and in the group he plays. Just those experienced players are capable of training, of playing week in week out and are up to physical exuberance of the championship. 

 

The experienced players who are not, don’t play at the expense of others but may play if they are needed due to what you cannot see in future. 

[poite]

2 minutes ago, OxonOwl said:

 

I feel you or other are saying they want a manager who plays your (or their) idea of who the best players are.

You feel correctly.

 

I bet you that if Mick McCarthy came in the team would instantly change. 

[nevthelodgemoorowl]

2 hours ago, jack whitham said:

Been a supporter and season ticket holder since 1965 and the way this club is being run at the moment is a complete joke.

So what was it between 69 & 77 then ?

[Lord Snooty]

2 minutes ago, jonnyowl said:

Yeah because Dawson and Pelupessy have been fantastic this season!

 

 

I think we'll see Dawson shine more when some of the contracts run out in the summer and there isn't a shadow cast and something for him to be beaten with every game.

 

I think Hutchinson is a better player than Pelupessy overall.  I love his style. Drive. Passion.

 

But I can see why the manager picks Joey though ....

 

Hutchinson  2014-18                        Pelupessy  Jan- Nov 18

Apps    Yellow     Red                       Apps       Yellow       Red

  92        41            5                            30            4              0

 

Always fit and available.