Sheffield Wednesday: Reach’s verdict on Forestieri’s fight for an Owls starting role

[james o connor]

Just now, Rogerwyldesmullet said:

 

TBF you have a point re Hutch - agreed. I think that Onomah can play that role and might be a bit quicker than Joey at recycling the ball. Jones reads things well but isn’t physical enough now.

onwards and upwards hopefully. 

Hopefully he can give us that extra bite going forward. Jones, no way . His best days are well behind him 

[I Love Sturrock]

When Forestieri plays on the left-wing or as a left-forward, he does work hard making forward runs, but he only works hard defensively when it suits him and it's guaranteed to get the crowd to clap him, like a lung-busting run to close down someone who's just tackled him. He doesn't do the defensive dirty work that nobody notices to help the full-back/wing-back behind him, like tracking a runner if the full-back gets sucked by somebody else on that side. Matias isn't perfect, but he does this dirty work for the man behind him much more.

 

This is even more important at the moment when the person playing on that side is Matt Penney, because the last thing a developing young lad needs is for Forestieri to hang him out to dry. Maybe Penney's looked so confident because Forestieri hasn't been playing in front of him.

 

The last three managers Forestieri's played under (Jokanovic, Carvalhal and Luhukay) haven't had a clue how to use him, because if you play him as a striker, he gets bullied and doesn't have space to run at people, but if you play him as left-winger or left-forward, he sulks (because he prefers playing as a striker) and doesn't do the defensive dirty work to help the full-back behind him.

 

Jokanovic put him on the bench a lot in Watford's promotion season (Deeney and Vydra were untouchable up-front and Forestieri couldn't play on the wing because of the reasons stated) and the club were happy to sell him to us in the end. Carvalhal tried playing Forestieri as a striker but he'd get bullied and go missing a lot as a result, but because of the refusal to track back on the wing, Carlos ended up putting him on the bench and only playing him on the left-wing when we were losing and going for broke anyway. Luhukay has clearly not been impressed with his attitude in the slightest so far, and prefers Matias on the wing instead because he'll do the dirty work.

 

Forestieri apologists who've been questioning Luhukay's sanity for leaving him out might want to consider that there's a common thread running though the last three managers he's had.

[Past Member]

8 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

People in 'having opposing views' shocker

 

'Kiss my Ass Nuhiu Haters'

[Lord Snooty]

He'll get am opportunity again. There is no panic. 

Carvalhal clearly wanted to test the water but gave up the ghost when he declared the player didn't like it. (Though he never said he refused despite how many slanted it - I don't think that was fair on either the player or the manager)

 

Carvalhal ditched the idea. 

Luhukay clearly sees the player playing a similar role but seems to have a little bit more or a steel spine about the situation and has been prepared to make a point. The team and team shape come first. 

 

I don't think anyone who had seen Fernandos last two substitute appearances would argue that the message isn't getting through. The player has done what has been asked...and to that end, I doubt it will be long until we see him back in the first XI and perhaps,  just perhaps we'll see the best from him that we have seen yet.

 

 

[Past Member]

1 minute ago, Lord Snooty said:

He'll get am opportunity again. There is no panic. 

Carvalhal clearly wanted to test the water but gave up the ghost when he declared the player didn't like it. (Though he never said he refused despite how many slanted it - I don't think that was fair on either the player or the manager)

 

Carvalhal ditched the idea. 

Luhukay clearly sees the player playing a similar role but seems to have a little bit more or a steel spine about the situation and has been prepared to make a point. The team and team shape come first. 

 

I don't think anyone who had seen Fernandos last two substitute appearances would argue that the message isn't getting through. The player has done what has been asked...and to that end, I doubt it will be long until we see him back in the first XI and perhaps,  just perhaps we'll see the best from him that we have seen yet.

 

 

 

 

Sorry, Snoots, but I dislike the patronizing, post towards FF.

 

He's not a naughty school boy sent to the corner.

 

Unfortunately JOS's comments (blatantly aimed at FF & maybe Hutch), have encouraged these types of posts.

[sheriwozgod]

7 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said:

He'll get am opportunity again. There is no panic. 

Carvalhal clearly wanted to test the water but gave up the ghost when he declared the player didn't like it. (Though he never said he refused despite how many slanted it - I don't think that was fair on either the player or the manager)

 

Carvalhal ditched the idea. 

Luhukay clearly sees the player playing a similar role but seems to have a little bit more or a steel spine about the situation and has been prepared to make a point. The team and team shape come first. 

 

I don't think anyone who had seen Fernandos last two substitute appearances would argue that the message isn't getting through. The player has done what has been asked...and to that end, I doubt it will be long until we see him back in the first XI and perhaps,  just perhaps we'll see the best from him that we have seen yet.

 

 

 

genuine question Snoots...had FF done what Athde did at Wigan do you think he would have got straight back in the team ?

 

[@owlstalk]

8 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

 

I don't think anyone who had seen Fernandos last two substitute appearances would argue that the message isn't getting through. The player has done what has been asked...and to that end, I doubt it will be long until we see him back in the first XI and perhaps,  just perhaps we'll see the best from him that we have seen yet.

 

 

 

Fully agree with all of this

[Lord Snooty]

4 minutes ago, zzmdu said:

 

 

Sorry, Snoots, but I dislike the patronizing, post towards FF.

 

He's not a naughty school boy sent to the corner.

 

Unfortunately JOS's comments (blatantly aimed at FF & maybe Hutch), have encouraged these types of posts.

 

Many feel the same about  patronizing and at times bile filled and factually incorrect posts about many of our other players.

 

Stripping away the fans thoughts though - which count for nothing in the big picture- the manager is dealing with the players in the way he thinks fit. And so far he seems to be getting a tune out of the majority. 

Long may that continue. 

[Daizan10]

1 hour ago, sheriwozgod said:

 

That is the point i am making , he has stood by Atdhe despite an idiotic sending off and ban v Wigan (just imagine the meltdown if FF had done that) , and him playing really badly against Ipswich and Brentford , where it has to be said he was much worse than FF who was then dropped.

 

Jos has stated that ALL players are treated the same , if that is the case why was FF dropped after one poor game yet he is "loyal" to Athde who,s form has been awful up till last Saturday ?.................while ever results go our way this will be overlooked but it smacks to me of some players having to prove themselves more than others , the starting line ups over the next few games will tell us more i guess.

Id imagine Atdhe shows an attitude in training that makes him more likely to be given another chance, something we don't see or know much about. 

[Lord Snooty]

9 minutes ago, sheriwozgod said:

 

genuine question Snoots...had FF done what Athde did at Wigan do you think he would have got straight back in the team ?

 

 

If he'd carried out all of the duties that had been asked from him then yes.

 

I don't for one reason think this manager who would wait for an opportunity to drop someone. Like a sending off for example. 

 

He strikes me as the type who if he wants to drop someone hell drop them without looking for an excuse.

 

[sheriwozgod]

1 minute ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

If he'd carried out all of the duties that had been asked from him then yes.

 

I don't for one reason think this manager who would wait for an opportunity to drop someone. Like a sending off for example. 

 

He strikes me as the type who if he wants to drop someone hell drop them without looking for an excuse.

 

 

We will agree to disagree on this one then snoots...........cause i dont think there is a chance in hell that he would have got straight back in.

[sheriwozgod]

6 minutes ago, Daizan10 said:

Id imagine Atdhe shows an attitude in training that makes him more likely to be given another chance, something we don't see or know much about. 

 

That`s an unknown as you say, but i stand by my point that he has had different treatment.............had FF performed against Ipswich like Athde did he would have been nowhere near the starting line up v Reading IMHO.

 

Its not an either or situation................having them both in the team at the peak of their powers is what we ideally want, but as i have stated they ARE being treated differently and hopefully the ends justify the means.

[Daizan10]

4 minutes ago, sheriwozgod said:

 

We will agree to disagree on this one then snoots...........cause i dont think there is a chance in hell that he would have got straight back in.

 

Sorry for butting inm, but it must have something to do with the general attitude in training and around the place that we dont see. Atdhe maybe came back contrite and worked double hard in training to improve and take on board Jos' criticism. Id imagine Nando is a little more fiery and prickly until he has a chance to calm down and maybe only starts to show improvements after a few days, which then gets him dropped for the next game (which we won so Jos keeps the squad the same). 

[Lord Snooty]

4 minutes ago, sheriwozgod said:

 

We will agree to disagree on this one then snoots...........cause i dont think there is a chance in hell that he would have got straight back in.

 

As I said. If Luhukay wants to drop someone I don't think he'd hide behind an excuse like a suspension.

 

And in fact. He hasn't. 

 

I certainly don't think however that he has it in for Fernando, in anyway. 

After all it'd in his benefit to get the best out of the player , like it is with the others. Perhaps he's just taking a different approach to previous managers

 

 

 

 

[Almat]

Would have been a bizarre thing to say not that long ago but FF is a brilliant player to bring on late(ish) in the game. You can imagine the tiring monoliths in the opposites' back four thinking they are in for a torrid time for the remainder of the match. And while results are going so well in FF's absence from the starting line-up why even consider changing the status quo? Jos really has got balls of steel. I remarked on that after the Sheffield Derby at the lane last year. Stood there looking cool and calm and got a performance out of youth players and Clueless' misfits that got me believing Chansiri really has uncovered a real manager here (whether by luck or skill I'll leave you to decide). 

Edited September 5, 2018 by Almat
sp.

[shezzas left peg]

34 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said:

He'll get am opportunity again. There is no panic. 

Carvalhal clearly wanted to test the water but gave up the ghost when he declared the player didn't like it. (Though he never said he refused despite how many slanted it - I don't think that was fair on either the player or the manager)

 

Carvalhal ditched the idea. 

Luhukay clearly sees the player playing a similar role but seems to have a little bit more or a steel spine about the situation and has been prepared to make a point. The team and team shape come first. 

 

I don't think anyone who had seen Fernandos last two substitute appearances would argue that the message isn't getting through. The player has done what has been asked...and to that end, I doubt it will be long until we see him back in the first XI and perhaps,  just perhaps we'll see the best from him that we have seen yet.

 

 

The thing with Carlos is he wouldn't play anything other than 4-4-2, too rigid and scared to go with what really suited us, surely a 4-3-3 would have been perfect for what was available at the time... 

 

                           Westwood

 

Hunt.          Lees.          Loovens.       Fox

 

              Lee.      Hutch.      Bannan

 

  Wallace.        Hooper.       Fernando. 

   

Just couldn't understand why he never tried it since very few opposing teams played 4-4-2 leaving our fullbacks exposed. 

[Past Member]

20 minutes ago, Lord Snooty said:

 

As I said. If Luhukay wants to drop someone I don't think he'd hide behind an excuse like a suspension.

 

And in fact. He hasn't. 

 

I certainly don't think however that he has it in for Fernando, in anyway. 

After all it'd in his benefit to get the best out of the player , like it is with the others. Perhaps he's just taking a different approach to previous managers

 

 

 

 

 

Just imagine if FF had got sent off in an opening fixture defeat. (wasn't the second yellow for petulantly throwing the ball)

 

FF would have been hung out to dry on here. And no doubt JOS would have felt the need to humiliate him in  public.

 

Nuhiu was instantly reinstated to the side. playing pretty poorly against Brentford.

 

No consistency, with regard to FF.

[Lord Snooty]

7 minutes ago, shezzas left peg said:

The thing with Carlos is he wouldn't play anything other than 4-4-2, too rigid and scared to go with what really suited us, surely a 4-3-3 would have been perfect for what was available at the time... 

 

                           Westwood

 

Hunt.          Lees.          Loovens.       Fox

 

              Lee.      Hutch.      Bannan

 

  Wallace.        Hooper.       Fernando. 

   

Just couldn't understand why he never tried it since very few opposing teams played 4-4-2 leaving our fullbacks exposed. 

 

Totally agree shezza,  totally agree. 

 

Made a long (probably quite boring) post about it the other year. 

Though I don't know why  most of  the pictures in it have vanished. 

 

Quote

 

It’s all over but the crying

 

 

 

I didn’t post the other night.  I try not to when the raw emotions are still sparking on the surface.  Not to mention the booze, which I had used to try and forget the terrible feelings in my body, the pangs of pain which overtake.

 

 

 

So now in the cold light of day I’ve thought back over the season, and in part last season, for contrast and to see what changes, subtle or otherwise, have been made and what impact they might have made.

 

 

 

To look at the players and manager and their performance through the season as a whole.

 

 

 

A Better season -  But was it?

 

This season-  as superbly demonstrated by Ryan’s excellent graphs -  (my favourite thread of the season! )was, overall a better season than last with a higher points total and a higher placing. 

 

Despite this many of us at various times came away from games with a sense of anguish and apprehension –even when we got results. In the end of course results are all. There was a clear change of playing policy. Effective, even though at times grim , but most fans will back a team when it is getting results. 

 

 



Clearly we had made a definite decision to slightly alter the playing style or tactics.  Wednesday were going, it became clear, be able to grind out results when the need arose.   Fans will largely accept that.

 

Where the difference in backing comes is when the two differing approaches start losing games.  When we lost a few last season, people were quite rational. “We can’t win them all”. This season when defeats came the outpourings were a lot harsher and style is -to my mind- the factor that made people quicker to turn and in greater frustrated numbers.

 

 Personally, though I do like free flowing football I find nothing wrong with the pragmatic approach to the game and the season which Carlos and his team have taken this season.  After all it worked well for Burnley last season and more than once it  was noted on the similarity . The signing of Jones in the summer was perhaps the signal of intent.

 

 

 

Did it work?  ……ultimately not to expectation 

 

We may have finished higher than last season but ended up falling short of making a proper challenge for the top spots and failing to make the play off final. 

 

Earlier in the season many, myself included –though not in as vociferous an explosion as some called for the players to be let off the leash and to go and express themselves as they did at times last season.  Not go mad, not go all-out attack, even tactical dinosaurs like me understand that with the modern trend for playing counter attack we didn’t want to go out and leave ourselves totally exposed to the sucker punch and getting picked off.  But  we seem to have swung from one extreme to the other. Last season more of a high paced pressing and attacking side, this season a soaking and grinding side.

 

 

 

I’m sure that most fans would accept  that as the great Bill Paisley once said, the best teams are neither one nor the other, but the ones that are a cohesive blend of both, which is surely  the ticket for the characters we have in this squad. 

 

The question now turns to how many of the squad will stay on though and indeed who will manage them.

 

 

 

 

 

Carlos out – Rumour/truth either way terrible timing

 

The timing this last week in the build up to the game about Carlos’ future couldn’t have been worse timed , creating a misdirection of interest and filling newspaper columns, comments sections and message boards with the sorts of rumours which ALWAYS find their way to the club and the dressing room.  

 

Does that really make a difference?  Of course it does. Yes, they are professionals, but they are also human beings.  Uncertainty over a manager’s position casts doubt on the future of all the players too.  Does this affect performance?  One would hope that once on the pitch that players to a certain extent can forget off the pitch issues.  But some won’t. Some will worry about their own future and feel lethargic with concern.  “If the new man doesn’t want me , we’ll be on the move again.  Looking for a new home. A new school for the kids”. We can all come on here and say that the nomadic life of a footballer would suit us because of the riches earnt.  But money doesn’t stop the way a mans mind works.  Worrier will always worry.  Some of the players I dare say might have gone the extra mile, wanting so desperately to get a result for a manager who has shown faith in them.  Indeed Iooked at Bannan last night, a player who has had an up and down season but always been back by his manager and I saw him playing like a man possessed.  Of course he wanted to win. To get to Wembley. To have a crack at the Premier league again.  That is a professional desire.  But personal desire must come into play too.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Carlos Carvalhal

 

Looking back at the season we have to look at the manager. How has Carlos done?

 

As I said in the opening overall he’ll be able to put a 4^th place finish on his CV.  An improvement on last years 6^th place finish. 

 

On paper, that is foundations being built on. A solid first season and then building bit by bit.  It could be argued and I’m sure will that the next stage of this sequence would surely be to challenge for the top two. 

 

Whether he will be here to do so remains to be seen.  But if he does, it’s my personal opinion that Carlos needs to go back to his true self. With his true football beliefs. 

 

 

 

We all remember I’m sure early into his reign when one of the local radio journalists asked him about clean sheets he laugh and said “In Portugal, we don’t have words for this!”  A funny moment, a quip, but at the time it raised smiles not just because of the cultural difference and his mock shock, but because under the radar it sent the subliminal message to fans.  Carlos’ teams will attack. 

 

There were teething problems last season, but they did try and attack, even if it didn’t always come off. 

 

 

 

 

 

Carlos is a 4-3-3 man…

 

When the unheard of Carlos first came to Wednesday this phrase was uttered more times than I can remember, printed more times than I can remember.  I kept being told this and decided , like many of us no doubt did to research the new manager a little.  And indeed he was the 4-3-3 man and from an interview I read a huge believer in the 4-1-2-3 version of the system which Mourinho employed in his first spell at Chelsea.

 

 

Carlos’ Wednesday of last season played a lop sided 4-3-3 into 4-4-2  and early on he even played a 4-2-3-1 with Hutchinson and Lopez as a fulcrum for McGuguan a few times. His nod perhaps to English football. 

 

Sometimes a case of playing on small pitches where the space was so compacted 4-4-2 seemed the reasonable way to open it up and the experiment seemed to be over.

 

 

 

 But we did see glimpses of the tactics which we had heard about before his arrival. .. Often Fernando would be cast out wide in games or when subs were made and the debate raged in the pubs and on the forums,…in fact some fans couldn’t even agree one what system we were playing at all!

 

 

 

But it was against  Arsenal (who despite their excuses still had a side with over 400 International caps on show)  Carlos played with that system for which he had been known in his career pre Wednesday. -A  4-1-4-1  moving into a 4-1-2-3 when in possession.  And it worked an absolute treat!! 

 

 

 

 

 

If this was what Carlos was all about, then I wanted to see more of it!

 

 

 

Hutchinson , Lee and Bannan revelled that night. Hutchinson prowling infront of the back four snapping into challenges and Lee and Bannan were freed from the shackles to move freely around midfield, Lee moving the ball quickly and sharply and Bannan driving on and supporting and getting his range of passing going.   Wallace too was superb in the more advanced position dipping in and out causing no end of problems and a fantastic night at Hillsborough.

 

 

 

I looked at that line up and thought “Here is a man with a plan!” . Looking at that team  I was excited. For it wasn’t too much to think that with Fernando in for Helan and giving a roaming role to find the space he likes to exploit weaving in an out , and that if we could get in the all round battering ram  forward but mobile forward to carry out the lone striker role in place of Joao  then we would start smashing teams (below)

 

 

I so thoroughly enjoyed that performance and the way things were shaping. We just needed that forward to play that role.

 

 

The final piece of the jigsaw striker?

 

A month after this game we signed Gary Hooper on loan with a move to a permanent deal.  I’d wanted Wickham or Wood, who I thought would be perfect  Young, strong mobile and with a goals record…. But I was happy that we got Hooper. A player with a good goalscoring record and who had made a name for himself.

 

 

 

Excitedly I phoned my friend Big Al, an East Anglian farmer (no jokes please) and season ticket holder at Carrow Road for 15 years. 

“Alan,” I said to him with fervent excitement “this boy Hooper. I think he’s the final piece in this chap Carlos’ jigsaw.” 

I went on to explain his history and how we had put Arsenal to the sword with this system. 

 

“I know, “ said he “I watched it. But you’re wrong if you think that Hooper is the answer”

 

Suspecting that he might just be upset that the chap Hooper  was leaving I said joshingly  “Now, now, don’t be a bad sport, he’s coming to a bigger club!”

 

“No, genuinely, Hoopers a fine player. But he can’t play the lone role. He hasn’t the lungs. Besides  , he likes to drop off into deeper pockets of space rather than lead the line. You’d have been better with Jerome for that role, despite his woeful goals record”.

 

 

 

I took it with a pinch of salt, suspecting that he had the hump . But it proved only too true. Hooper wasn’t the lone striker.  And more to the point - to play him at all meant that we couldn’t play the very system which I was convinced Carlos had designed to get the best out of our best three players - Hutchinson, Bannan and Lee!

 

 

 

Hooper needed a partner, my old friend Alan was right, and against Charlton we started with Hooper and Fernando up front.  They dropped into the same areas.  We had no focal point and worst of all, to accommodate our three best midfielders and ensure Hooper had a partner Bannan was shifted to the left wing and Wallace given a more defensive duty having to tuck in and help Hutchinson and Lee in midfield where we were outnumbered.

 

 

 

After a run of poor games in which Fernando and Joao were tried with the new-man, in the end - amazingly - it was the divisive Nuhiu who ended up being the player that brought the best from Hooper, whilst never being any form of goal threat himself.  A team is more than the sum of the parts. The big lump kept defenders busy in leading the line and being little more than a nuisance.  But it worked, Hooper enjoying his best spell since his arrival.  

 

From showing seeds at the beginning of the year we were now having to play a foil for the £3m pound striker that most fans accepted and expected wouldn’t be needed in this bright new dawn.

 

 

 

Come the play-offs against Brighton and Hull though and Carlos changed the side trying to engineer all the big names into the team, at, I think to the cost of the whole.  Hooper made little impact and was almost anonymous in the final against Hull . Lumpish centre halves Dawson and Davies had too easy a time against the diminutive Wednesday strike pair , meanwhile in midfield Hutchinson and Lee, though desperately trying were simply picked off by the triumvirate of Huddlestone, Livermore and the rangy Diame.

 

Nuhui is no world beater, at times I’m not sure what he is, and I have no doubt wouldn’t have scored a goal in that game.  But he might have given the two brutes at the back something to think about and created space for Hooper. 

Fernando would have had more space to exploit in the wide areas and Lee and Hutchinson, being run ragged by Hulls midfield trio could have benefitted from the extra body of Bannan who was wasted out wide in a role that ended up being little more than auxiliary full back.

 

 

 

I remain convinced that what cost is that day was two things.

 

• 1.       Shoehorning names.

   

• 2.       Carlos not being Carlos enough and not using his favoured 4-3-3 system.

   

 

 

This season

 

Many people thought major surgery was required. I wasn’t sure.  I believed that with the spirit in the camp, and the quality already in the camp that a simple back to basics round pegs in round holes would see us challenge again.   I thought we could do with a new centre half and some competition at full back, and Carlos alluded to as much but he and DC had apparently balked at the prices quoted for average central defensive players.

 

 

 

The arrival of Reach and Fletcher made me convinced that Carlos had learnt from the 4-4-2 overrun midfield debacle and would return to his midfield dominating roots.  Hooper, the man who likes to drop in the hole I thought would either play behind Fletcher in a 4-2-3-1 or be moved on and put down as an expensive gamble.   With speculation about Fernandos future all summer I thought Reach might be expecting to play wide of the attacking midfield.   The arrival of Abdi only strengthened my belief that Carlos was going to go back to a flooded and attack minded system.  Abdi I thought would come in and provide competition with Hooper in that area behind the targetman.

 

It might mean one of Hutchinson , Lee or Bannan being dropped, but so be it if that’s what he thought was best to get the most from Hooper and Fletcher.

 

As it is, Abdi has barely kicked a ball in anger and Fernando, despite the “strike” blip stayed.  

 

As it was, that decision over Hutch, Lee Bannan never had to be made early on as Loovens injury hangover from last season and our unwillingness (rightly) to spend well over the odds at centre half meant Hutchinson was dropped back there and the decision would be left for another day.

 

 

 

However as soon as the question was there to be asked the shoe horn came out, and it stuck out like a sore thumb.   We dug in still, and got some niggly results, but it was obvious that the names would be in. Square pegs, in this seasons round hole 4-4-2.

 

 

 

Best summed up by our starting eleven in the game against Huddersfield.  Ok, so Wallace barely kicked a ball…but nevertheless , apart from Fletcher for Hooper it was last years team in last years play off formation.

 

 

 

Opposition tactics

 

On top of the issues of the system and last year’s issues coming back to bite, there is  also the thinking of the opposition  who this season have shown us respect and waited on us to break them down.

 

I think the 4-3-3 would have been even more vital this season because of the fact that so many teams have now got a grasp on us. (or “they’ve worked us out” in OT speak)  The onus has been on us this year to break teams down.

You can do that by dominating midfield, or being direct and getting the ball into the box plenty.

 

We have played the poopydoo son of both of those tactics by playing with wide men in Reach and Wallace ….........but still trying pass through the middle!   

 

 

 

 

 

Do I ultimately think Carlos should stay? 

 

Well, to be honest I like the fellow , I wouldn’t mind him staying at all…but I’d  want him to be.. “a bit more Carlos” …  play the system he truly believes in…with the players in their best roles…..

 

that though is ever more unlikely  as with Winnall and Rhodes signing on….(at vast expense for the championship)  ….we have two more strikers  joining the ranks of our attacking department who cannot play the lone striking role.   

 

We now have 7 strikers…..all of whom work best at part of a partnership…. In that sense Carlos has backed himself into a corner…the scattergun approach to strikers has forced his hand….. and if he does leave, the hand of anyone who might take over…into playing a system with two up front… to get the best out of the resources up top.  You can’t buy a £10m striker and then play a system that doesn’t suit him. The Chairman won’t stand for it. 

 

 

 

Our transfer policy has created  a playing system which only suits the top end of the team … simply our signings have caged us into a way of playing which doesn’t get the best out of 33% of the team.

 

Will Chansiri let him spend more if he stays? …..perhaps not… given what he’s already given him.  Another season of these players in a 4-4-2 though will only end in a similar placed finish though unless we sign two box to box, tackling passing cruiserweights. But that would mean the end surely for some of the chaps who have done so much for us.

 

Our striker obsession could end up being the death knell for three of the best midfield players we’ve had down in S6 in the last 20 years. 

 

Can we keep Hutch, Lee, Bannan AND play two up front without them being compromised or shown the door?

 

 

 

The only way he could really do something different without Chansiri allowing him to tear the squad up and start again would be to play a 3-5-2 which would give us the strength in midfield which we so sadly lack with only two in there and play a striker partnership…which all of our strikers need to prosper. 

 

That would take time on the training ground though and would be a move away from the pivot back four which he so loves. 

 

 

 

In the most simple terms I think Carlos’ transfer signings and his favoured method have clashed badly and created an impasse. 

 

 

 

I think Carlos was two pieces from completing the jigsaw....and instead of looking for them....the club just spent £25m on some random pieces from another box.

 

 -----------------------------------------------------------

And that’s it for me.  I haven't said half of what I want to here!  Though I doubt anyone has read this far down.

 I may still be drunk but I simply can't type the rest.... or maybe it’s a migraine , my head is spinning now.

My heart is still not so much broken as lying tattered and trampled in the gutter,   So I won’t ever finish this thing here I have started writing….

 

 

 

….But I’ll be here next year.  Hoping we can do it.  Being a clapper from September to May and saving my grumbles for when it’s all over!

 

 

 That is the life of the Wednesday man.   Of the supporter.

 

 

 

Try and enjoy your summer fellow Owls.

 

We'l get there!

 

 

Chin chin

 

 

 

LS

 

[Past Member]

4 hours ago, Holmowl said:

 

Upto the Ipswich game Atdhe had scored 10 in his last 9 starts.

 

Jos’s loyalty to a player who has been a colossus for him was completely understandable, and vindicated by a fine away performance.

 

 

I think you've put this in a wrong thread HolmOwl. This is about FFs return to the side.

May be ask the MOD to move it for you.

 

Bizarre quoting Nuhiu's goal stats in an FF thread.

However since you have how many goals has Nuhiu scored in his 5 starts this season and how many assists*?.

 

* use the normal definition, not an  @OWLSTALK definition, where Nuhiu has a poor header from from a goal kick, the centre half fluffs a simple headed clearance to a SWFC player, 2 passes later Joao scores a worldy. 

[Lord Snooty]

4 minutes ago, zzmdu said:

 

I think you've put this in a wrong thread HolmOwl. This is about FFs return to the side.

May be ask the MOD to move it for you.

 

Bizarre quoting Nuhiu's goal stats in an FF thread.

However since you have how many goals has Nuhiu scored in his 5 starts this season and how many assists*?.

 

* use the normal definition, not an  @OWLSTALK definition, where Nuhiu has a poor header from from a goal kick, the centre half fluffs a simple headed clearance to a SWFC player, 2 passes later Joao scores a worldy. 

 

Play the game Zedders,  you've been mentioning Nuhiu a for most of the debate!

 

 

11 minutes ago, zzmdu said:

 

Just imagine if FF had got sent off in an opening fixture defeat. (wasn't the second yellow for petulantly throwing the ball)

 

FF would have been hung out to dry on here. And no doubt JOS would have felt the need to humiliate him in  public.

 

Nuhiu was instantly reinstated to the side. playing pretty poorly against Brentford.

 

No consistency, with regard to FF.

 

The second yellow was for a kick I thought.

 

He might have been hung out to dry. Nuhiu certainly was...

 

I think Jos has been very consistent with regard to Forestieri.

 

As I said. I'm sure he'll be in the side sooner rather than later.