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@owlstalk

Some Sheffield Wednesday fans have forgotten how to enjoy wins

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9 minutes ago, @owlstalk said:

 

 

@zzmdu?

 

You've  set up an 'us' reacting to a win in one way (pleased) & set up a them/they others who aren't smiling after a win.

 

By definition ALL SWFC smile when we win.

 

Who are your defined 'others'? Which SWFC fans (they), do you think aren't happy with OUR win?

 

Your poor OP if full of exclusive terms.

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As they say. There's always room for improvement. Finding those areas is the key to us getting better.

 

I'm not saying people should be over the top saying things like well we have only beaten 3 poor teams and stuff like that. But suggesting not everything is perfect? Nowt wrong with that in imo 

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15 minutes ago, zzmdu said:

 

You've  set up an 'us' reacting to a win in one way (pleased) & set up a them/they others who aren't smiling after a win.

 

By definition ALL SWFC smile when we win.

 

Who are your defined 'others'? Which SWFC fans (they), do you think aren't happy with OUR win?

 

Your poor OP if full of exclusive terms.

I think that's the point. All SWFC dont smile when they win, as 'others' are too busy moaning as players they want to start aren't.

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2 hours ago, zzmdu said:

 

I don't like divisive posts like the OP.  Always turns me off when an OP claims early on that they're representing the majority. Shows lack of courage.

 

Full of 'others', 'theys' , 'us', 'them'

(I do get that Neil has a job to do)

 

 

Never been divisive. You also failed to debate the actual content. 

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I already know how to enjoy wins but I want learn how to enjoy them like Jos and the internet's favourite field mouse.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Quist said:

I think it is fair to point out weaknesses as long as you also acknowledges strengths in team and give balanced reflection. 

 

The OP is correct in some individuals just love to gripe and are stuck in a particular mindset and unfortunately nothing will change them. Something has upset them and they carry a burden on shoulder for ever more. It is like those still hanging on to previous manager when events have showed he did a lot of internal harm to club and can not bring themselves to admit he was not good for club. Others were tainted by a previous Chairman nad have been sceptical ever since and for ever expect the worse. 

 

If we keep performing above expectations I suspect they will slowly fade away only to return at first sign of grief.

As someone who is probably thought of as a “griper” I can relate to what you are saying. I am naturally a sceptic, a glass half full sort of guy, so I suppose that’s always gonna be my starting point. Don’t necessarily think I’ve been scarred by years of failure, well not knowingly anyway.

However, I hope I’m generally fair with my criticism, and am more than happy to admit it when I’ve been proven wrong. If something Wednesday related works out well, despite my misgivings, what’s not to be happy about. Where I come into conflict with some on here is, I don’t believe in the win at all costs mantra. Sure I want us to win, after all, the goal is promotion, but I also want to be entertained. Another area of conflict can be, player recruitment, or even rumoured player recruitment.

For example, in that first season under Carlos, I really didn’t have much to moan about. DC had promised entertaining football when he enlisted Carlos, and we didn’t disappoint. The signings too, were targeted, and in general, seemed to fit the way we wanted to play Even the Wembley defeat, though disappointing, didn’t deflate me for long. I was already looking forward to the following season, and with a couple of strategic signings, we’d be even better. 

However, that’s when it all started to go wrong for me. We embarked on a ludicrous recruitment drive, expensive signings that were, in my mind anyway, never going to work out. 

I did seem to have issues with most of the players we either signed, or were linked with, and was quite vociferous about it on here. Sure that would wind a few people up, someone being negative about each and every player we were linked with, but with every signing, we seemed to be going further away from the plan. It wasn’t  criticism for the sake of it, I genuinely believed we were going down the wrong path. I thought our recruitment in years two and three was a disaster, and the confused thinking led to us playing a brand of football that had no interest to me. So what do you do, a lot of posters still believed in the project, and my doom and gloom prophecies, only antagonised them. 

I made a decision then, that I would stop posting so often, and just wait and see how things unfolded. It gave people a break and probably helped with my own sanity. Likewise, because the football was so dull, despite the fact that we were still winning, I decided to pick and choose the games I would attend. As I mentioned before, winning isn’t everything to me, but it seemed churlish to be moaning on the forum, when we were winning games. Nevertheless, it still gets to you, and the final straw was the Jordan Rhodes signing. I was totally against spending that sort of money on a player like him, and really laid into the club when the idea was first mooted. In my mind, it was the ultimate folly, following on from two years of misguided recruitment.

The point I am making though, is that sometimes these things stick with you. Now that we seem to have come to terms that things went wrong, although still not admitted by the chairman, at least now we seem to be heading in the right direction Whether that is by design, or default, at least for now at least, everyone is pulling in the same direction. So now I am happy, and actually feel pretty positive about things For some though, the damage is done, and they will always view me as being negative about all things Wednesday. I’m not, and certainly wouldn’t have spent so much time and money devoted to following the club if I felt that way. It is difficult to escape from people’s preconceived ideas though. For example, you can attend a game, enjoy the performance, be full some in your praise of the team, but perhaps raise a valid point about an area where we might improve. Instantly, some posters will be on here, accusing you of always being negative, and not having anything good to say about the club. It doesn’t unduly bother me, as I believe, or at least hope that I generally have a balanced view of things. In truth, it’s probably the way of forums, and I don’t really believe that any fans are always negative. Why would they bother to support the club if they felt like that. It’s just the cut and thrust of debate, and I love it

 

Edited by gurujuan
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I'm shallow. I don't care how we play if we win. I've never seen us win a bad game of football. I celebrate every win with delight. I've never been a bit disappointed that we've won despite playing badly. I'd love to be the worst team to win promotion. I'd love it if England were the worst team to win the world cup. I'd happily be the new Stoke fir a few seasons-they found a way to win and it served them well. I go to football to celebrate goals and a win, not to appreciate how well we played in a 1 nil loss. Likewise if we lose I take no solace in the fact or opinion that we played well or tried hard. We lost. I'm gutted. We win. I'm delighted. 

 

Like I say, shallow. 

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9 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

As someone who is probably thought of as a “griper” I can relate to what you are saying. I am naturally a sceptic, a glass half full sort of guy, so I suppose that’s always gonna be my starting point. Don’t necessarily think I’ve been scarred by years of failure, well not knowingly anyway.

However, I hope I’m generally fair with my criticism, and am more than happy to admit it when I’ve been proven wrong. If something Wednesday related works out well, despite my misgivings, what’s not to be happy about. Where I come into conflict with some on here is, I don’t believe in the win at all costs mantra. Sure I want us to win, after all, the goal is promotion, but I also want to be entertained. Another area of conflict can be, player recruitment, or even rumoured player recruitment.

For example, in that first season under Carlos, I really didn’t have much to moan about. DC had promised entertaining football when he enlisted Carlos, and we didn’t disappoint. The signings too, were targeted, and in general, seemed to fit the way we wanted to play Even the Wembley defeat, though disappointing, didn’t deflate me for long. I was already looking forward to the following season, and with a couple of strategic signings, we’d be even better. 

However, that’s when it all started to go wrong for me. We embarked on a ludicrous recruitment drive, expensive signings that were, in my mind anyway, never going to work out. 

I did seem to have issues with most of the players we either signed, or were linked with, and was quite vociferous about it on here. Sure that would wind a few people up, someone being negative about each and every player we were linked with, but with every signing, we seemed to be going further away from the plan. It wasn’t  criticism for the sake of it, I genuinely believed we were going down the wrong path. I thought our recruitment in years two and three was a disaster, and the confused thinking led to us playing a brand of football that had no interest to me. So what do you do, a lot of posters still believed in the project, and my doom and gloom prophecies, only antagonised them. 

I made a decision then, that I would stop posting so often, and just wait and see how things unfolded. It gave people a break and probably helped with my own sanity. Likewise, because the football was so dull, despite the fact that we were still winning, I decided to pick and choose the games I would attend. As I mentioned before, winning isn’t everything to me, but it seemed churlish to be moaning on the forum, when we were winning games. Nevertheless, it still gets to you, and the final straw was the Jordan Rhodes signing. I was totally against spending that sort of money on a player like him, and really laid into the club when the idea was first mooted. In my mind, it was the ultimate folly, following on from two years of misguided recruitment.

The point I am making though, is that sometimes these things stick with you. Now that we seem to have come to terms that things went wrong, although still not admitted by the chairman, at least now we seem to be heading in the right direction Whether that is by design, or default, at least for now at least, everyone is pulling in the same direction. So now I am happy, and actually feel pretty positive about things For some though, the damage is done, and they will always view me as being negative about all things Wednesday. I’m not, and certainly wouldn’t have spent so much time and money devoted to following the club if I felt that way. It is difficult to escape from people’s preconceived ideas though. For example, you can attend a game, enjoy the performance, be full some in your praise of the team, but perhaps raise a valid point about an area where we might improve. Instantly, some posters will be on here, accusing you of always being negative, and not having anything good to say about the club. It doesn’t unduly bother me, as I believe, or at least hope that I generally have a balanced view of things. In truth, it’s probably the way of forums, and I don’t really believe that any fans are always negative. Why would they bother to support the club if they felt like that. It’s just the cut and thrust of debate, and I love it

 

Good post. I can relate and agree with everything you have said here. Although im not referring to your griping one way or the other as i hadnt really noticed amidst the noise.

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There is nothing wrong with having a different opinion to what everyone else is thinking. It doesn’t mean everyone is right or wrong, it’s just an opinion. Modern society, in all walks of life, are crossing the lines between facts and opinions. The worst people for this are Journalists. They are clever at making you think that what they are saying in regards to managers or team selections are facts, when actually it’s just their opinions. 

I saw someone on another thread say he thought Nuhui was poor yesterday, but because the commentators on iPlayer said he was brilliant (their opinion) he must be wrong. 

 

It is okay to disagree.

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29 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

As someone who is probably thought of as a “griper” I can relate to what you are saying. I am naturally a sceptic, a glass half full sort of guy, so I suppose that’s always gonna be my starting point. Don’t necessarily think I’ve been scarred by years of failure, well not knowingly anyway.

However, I hope I’m generally fair with my criticism, and am more than happy to admit it when I’ve been proven wrong. If something Wednesday related works out well, despite my misgivings, what’s not to be happy about. Where I come into conflict with some on here is, I don’t believe in the win at all costs mantra. Sure I want us to win, after all, the goal is promotion, but I also want to be entertained. Another area of conflict can be, player recruitment, or even rumoured player recruitment.

For example, in that first season under Carlos, I really didn’t have much to moan about. DC had promised entertaining football when he enlisted Carlos, and we didn’t disappoint. The signings too, were targeted, and in general, seemed to fit the way we wanted to play Even the Wembley defeat, though disappointing, didn’t deflate me for long. I was already looking forward to the following season, and with a couple of strategic signings, we’d be even better. 

However, that’s when it all started to go wrong for me. We embarked on a ludicrous recruitment drive, expensive signings that were, in my mind anyway, never going to work out. 

I did seem to have issues with most of the players we either signed, or were linked with, and was quite vociferous about it on here. Sure that would wind a few people up, someone being negative about each and every player we were linked with, but with every signing, we seemed to be going further away from the plan. It wasn’t  criticism for the sake of it, I genuinely believed we were going down the wrong path. I thought our recruitment in years two and three was a disaster, and the confused thinking led to us playing a brand of football that had no interest to me. So what do you do, a lot of posters still believed in the project, and my doom and gloom prophecies, only antagonised them. 

I made a decision then, that I would stop posting so often, and just wait and see how things unfolded. It gave people a break and probably helped with my own sanity. Likewise, because the football was so dull, despite the fact that we were still winning, I decided to pick and choose the games I would attend. As I mentioned before, winning isn’t everything to me, but it seemed churlish to be moaning on the forum, when we were winning games. Nevertheless, it still gets to you, and the final straw was the Jordan Rhodes signing. I was totally against spending that sort of money on a player like him, and really laid into the club when the idea was first mooted. In my mind, it was the ultimate folly, following on from two years of misguided recruitment.

The point I am making though, is that sometimes these things stick with you. Now that we seem to have come to terms that things went wrong, although still not admitted by the chairman, at least now we seem to be heading in the right direction Whether that is by design, or default, at least for now at least, everyone is pulling in the same direction. So now I am happy, and actually feel pretty positive about things For some though, the damage is done, and they will always view me as being negative about all things Wednesday. I’m not, and certainly wouldn’t have spent so much time and money devoted to following the club if I felt that way. It is difficult to escape from people’s preconceived ideas though. For example, you can attend a game, enjoy the performance, be full some in your praise of the team, but perhaps raise a valid point about an area where we might improve. Instantly, some posters will be on here, accusing you of always being negative, and not having anything good to say about the club. It doesn’t unduly bother me, as I believe, or at least hope that I generally have a balanced view of things. In truth, it’s probably the way of forums, and I don’t really believe that any fans are always negative. Why would they bother to support the club if they felt like that. It’s just the cut and thrust of debate, and I love it

 

When I wrote that did not have you in mind. But agree many reasons to have a gripe. Also accept that a good debate can be had but those who just pick on spelling or errors of grammar or some daft minor point ignoring overall direction of argument are the ones who need to get a life and move on. I usually end up ignoring them as believe they have another agenda. For example we had someone suggest we should extend Abdi's contract. This suggests they are his agent, his mother, or just and idiot or trying to wind everybody up. 

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14 minutes ago, Daavies; said:

There is nothing wrong with having a different opinion to what everyone else is thinking. It doesn’t mean everyone is right or wrong, it’s just an opinion. Modern society, in all walks of life, are crossing the lines between facts and opinions. The worst people for this are Journalists. They are clever at making you think that what they are saying in regards to managers or team selections are facts, when actually it’s just their opinions. 

I saw someone on another thread say he thought Nuhui was poor yesterday, but because the commentators on iPlayer said he was brilliant (their opinion) he must be wrong. 

 

It is okay to disagree.

 

I saw some old article on the BBC website this morning saying how constructive debate is beneficial. I wonder how many scientific discoveries or innovation were created by people peer reviewing other work, listening to other views and changing their mind as a result.

 

Football is a microcosm of society but we see it in all walks of life, politics in particular.

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11 hours ago, roaminowl said:

 

Thanks for the advise, I've had a lovely night. My friend Bill though, he didn't seem so happy...and he's cancelled his bike ride for tomorrow.

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6 hours ago, @owlstalk said:

 

 

So basically you agree with my OP but negged it?

 

lol

 

Sorry I thought I chuckled it, the emotion bar is so sensitive a little like we Owls fans lol I'll put it right if I can.

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20 hours ago, @owlstalk said:

Whilst the majority of us are simply walking with a smile tonight, happy that we've won, got another three points, won three on the bounce, and got off to the best start that Chansiri has had since coming here thanks to Jos, there are others who simply can't enjoy the win

They've forgotten how

They're now in a state of nitpicking no matter how good the win, how valuable the points, or how important the message sent out to those players currently out of the side.

I genuinely hope they can regain the ability to just enjoy a win after we overcome and opponent and climb the Championship league table.

The level of nitpicking is worrying. It's an epidemic all over the internet from twitter, facebook to some on here too.

Please... instead of rattling off your concerns tonight, grab a friend or a lover, give them a hug, buy them a beer, and make sweet love all night long. Have fun, smile, and be positive - WE WON TODAY!

As I’ve just mentioned on another thread - there were people yesterday once the team was announced saying Jos was clueless - I very much doubt they had taken the time to look at and digest the last 15 matches under Jos. We all know there’s a few things that could be improved but the team is doing far better than some of us imagined, I really don’t know why some fans bother following a football team if it makes them so down.

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6 minutes ago, Spookone said:

As I’ve just mentioned on another thread - there were people yesterday once the team was announced saying Jos was clueless - I very much doubt they had taken the time to look at and digest the last 15 matches under Jos. We all know there’s a few things that could be improved but the team is doing far better than some of us imagined, I really don’t know why some fans bother following a football team if it makes them so down.

 

Moaning is easy , doesn't take much effort and anyone can do it.

I think that's why it's so popular. 

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Sorry Neil but I refuse to believe that any true Wednesdayite is unhappy when we win, some may not go as ape$hit as others and still have reservations about certain things, but unhappy ?...…….nah I`m not having it.

 

I was very vocal after the first 3 games about Jos and the team as I was seriously worried, and a lot of what I said is still pertinent IMHO , but it is a huge joy and relief to win the next three, albeit against some of the leagues weaker outfits.

 

I will ALWAYS give credit where it`s due, but also will ALWAYS question / vent / debate when there is stuff happening that I don`t personally like.

I posted in another thread yesterday that I got home after being out all day, heard the result , punched the air with together with a "get the f*** in!!" and put on Owlstalk to join in the celebrations...………………….then, the first 3 threads I opened were all fans slagging fellow fans for...well, I don`t know what really...………...maybe for having the temerity to suggest 10 days ago that our form and JL,s selections pre Millwall were pretty appalling.

 

FFS get over yourselves its like being back in the playground….yes we won, do I still think Westwood, Forestieri and Fletcher should be in the starting 11?..yes I do but I think its wrong to label that as moaning, its just an opinion, and, to repeat, WE WON AGAIN and whilst I didn't agree with the line-up I am as happy as f***

Edited by sheriwozgod

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Before we played Milwall....'Milwall are a tough side, hard to beat..., well organised......happy with a point'

 

After beating Milwall

'We have only beaten 3 of the crappiest sides ever in the world, they will be relegated before xmas...all of em'

lol

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10 hours ago, gurujuan said:

As someone who is probably thought of as a “griper” I can relate to what you are saying. I am naturally a sceptic, a glass half full sort of guy, so I suppose that’s always gonna be my starting point. Don’t necessarily think I’ve been scarred by years of failure, well not knowingly anyway.

However, I hope I’m generally fair with my criticism, and am more than happy to admit it when I’ve been proven wrong. If something Wednesday related works out well, despite my misgivings, what’s not to be happy about. Where I come into conflict with some on here is, I don’t believe in the win at all costs mantra. Sure I want us to win, after all, the goal is promotion, but I also want to be entertained. Another area of conflict can be, player recruitment, or even rumoured player recruitment.

For example, in that first season under Carlos, I really didn’t have much to moan about. DC had promised entertaining football when he enlisted Carlos, and we didn’t disappoint. The signings too, were targeted, and in general, seemed to fit the way we wanted to play Even the Wembley defeat, though disappointing, didn’t deflate me for long. I was already looking forward to the following season, and with a couple of strategic signings, we’d be even better. 

However, that’s when it all started to go wrong for me. We embarked on a ludicrous recruitment drive, expensive signings that were, in my mind anyway, never going to work out. 

I did seem to have issues with most of the players we either signed, or were linked with, and was quite vociferous about it on here. Sure that would wind a few people up, someone being negative about each and every player we were linked with, but with every signing, we seemed to be going further away from the plan. It wasn’t  criticism for the sake of it, I genuinely believed we were going down the wrong path. I thought our recruitment in years two and three was a disaster, and the confused thinking led to us playing a brand of football that had no interest to me. So what do you do, a lot of posters still believed in the project, and my doom and gloom prophecies, only antagonised them. 

I made a decision then, that I would stop posting so often, and just wait and see how things unfolded. It gave people a break and probably helped with my own sanity. Likewise, because the football was so dull, despite the fact that we were still winning, I decided to pick and choose the games I would attend. As I mentioned before, winning isn’t everything to me, but it seemed churlish to be moaning on the forum, when we were winning games. Nevertheless, it still gets to you, and the final straw was the Jordan Rhodes signing. I was totally against spending that sort of money on a player like him, and really laid into the club when the idea was first mooted. In my mind, it was the ultimate folly, following on from two years of misguided recruitment.

The point I am making though, is that sometimes these things stick with you. Now that we seem to have come to terms that things went wrong, although still not admitted by the chairman, at least now we seem to be heading in the right direction Whether that is by design, or default, at least for now at least, everyone is pulling in the same direction. So now I am happy, and actually feel pretty positive about things For some though, the damage is done, and they will always view me as being negative about all things Wednesday. I’m not, and certainly wouldn’t have spent so much time and money devoted to following the club if I felt that way. It is difficult to escape from people’s preconceived ideas though. For example, you can attend a game, enjoy the performance, be full some in your praise of the team, but perhaps raise a valid point about an area where we might improve. Instantly, some posters will be on here, accusing you of always being negative, and not having anything good to say about the club. It doesn’t unduly bother me, as I believe, or at least hope that I generally have a balanced view of things. In truth, it’s probably the way of forums, and I don’t really believe that any fans are always negative. Why would they bother to support the club if they felt like that. It’s just the cut and thrust of debate, and I love it

 

For me you’re one of the best posters on here, and this is another great post 

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