Forestieri

[billyblack]

7 hours ago, onlyonedavidhirst said:

 

Fair enough mate, However, if our winning team is picked for the next 2 matches and collect zero points, does that still make it the right call, when it may have been the case that if we had swapped MM for FF (I'm not necessarily suggesting that) we would have won them both.  

 

I would start FF as much as possible, but not irrespective of results.  The other thing is, it seems last season FF at one point made it clear he wanted to play up top and didn't think he could contribute enough out wide.  The manager should be telling FF where he wants him to play, yet if I recall it rightly Carlos played him as a CF in the game after that.  For me, FF isn't consistently effective enough in a front 2, because he is more easily bullied with his back to goal.  

 

I'll tell you what though, after the first few games, I'm extremely glad we are were we are now as it gives us hope for the next few more difficult games.  The new signings look like they might add to the strength of the team and we have players on the subs bench and coming back from injury (Fingers crossed) that if we integrate back in to the team, makes us even stronger.  Add to that, I think today was the best the Back 4 have played this season as a unit, albeit we still need to reduce the number of shots teams are having against us.

I don't have an issue with him playing FF at all. I do have an issue with him playing FF irrespective of from, tactics, squad management or whatever. Jo's has the right to manage the squad the best way he see fit in order to try and win games. I also agree he shouldn't play in a front 2. Which begs a quuestion where should he play? In reaches place? I dont think so.

[billyblack]

4 hours ago, thebrap11 said:

With or without ff we would've won those 3 games. We would've won them much more comfortably had he started tho. 

Pure speculation. 

[Holmowl]

1 minute ago, billyblack said:

I don't have an issue with him playing FF at all. I do have an issue with him playing FF irrespective of from, tactics, squad management or whatever. Jo's has the right to manage the squad the best way he see fit in order to try and win games. I also agree he shouldn't play in a front 2. Which begs a quuestion where should he play? In reaches place? I dont think so.

 

I think Jos’s current system does lend itself to Fernando’s strengths. He is completely wasted in a two - frankly behind Hooper, Fletcher, Atdhe and Joao as a CF.

 

But as a wide player behind a targetman, in a three, a motivated FF is almost unplayable. His speed and turns and his ability to cross or shoot makes him a nightmare. It is no coincidence that when he plays wide the team score almost two per game, yet when he plays centrally we score less than a goal per game. He creates so much space for others when the defence is drawn wide and high up trying to cope with him.

 

So, the system is perfect for his reintroduction, and when his head is back in the right place I think we will all be happy with how Jos has managed this issue, from whichever side of the fence we currently sit.

 

As for Reach, he should and will play 46 games if fit. LM in the current system works well, though personally I much prefer him getting white paint on his left boot.

[billyblack]

19 minutes ago, Holmowl said:

 

I think Jos’s current system does lend itself to Fernando’s strengths. He is completely wasted in a two - frankly behind Hooper, Fletcher, Atdhe and Joao as a CF.

 

But as a wide player behind a targetman, in a three, a motivated FF is almost unplayable. His speed and turns and his ability to cross or shoot makes him a nightmare. It is no coincidence that when he plays wide the team score almost two per game, yet when he plays centrally we score less than a goal per game. He creates so much space for others when the defence is drawn wide and high up trying to cope with him.

 

So, the system is perfect for his reintroduction, and when his head is back in the right place I think we will all be happy with how Jos has managed this issue, from whichever side of the fence we currently sit.

 

As for Reach, he should and will play 46 games if fit. LM in the current system works well, though personally I much prefer him getting white paint on his left boot.

I agree. Aren't we playing 442 currently though? 

[Holmowl]

Just now, billyblack said:

I agree. Aren't we playing 442 currently though? 

 

Not in my opinion. 

 

Its not rigid but looks more of a central CF with Joao one side and Matias the other.

[billyblack]

13 minutes ago, Holmowl said:

 

Not in my opinion. 

 

Its not rigid but looks more of a central CF with Joao one side and Matias the other.

Ok. Well in that case yes then maybe. From history though with us, he was best on the LHS in a 442. 

[Bouncing Owl]

Yes, we’ve won 3 games in a row but Fernando should be in the team ahead of Matias.

 

I think he’s been dropped due to FF not making the right decisions in attacking areas. He can’t have been dropped for workrate as he always works his socks off. 

 

Lets face it, Matias has done next to nothing in 3 years and FF has been our main man. I don’t want to ruin our main man who is worth £15m when he’s sat on the bench.

 

Jos - You’ve made your point but he now needs to be back in the team. Bigger tests lie ahead in September.

Edited September 2, 2018 by Bouncing Owl

[Holmowl]

6 minutes ago, billyblack said:

Ok. Well in that case yes then maybe. From history though with us, he was best on the LHS in a 442. 

 

Yes. Completely agree.

 

But left of a three has been next best, and probably more suited in aways anyway. 

[billyblack]

19 minutes ago, Bouncing Owl said:

Yes, we’ve won 3 games in a row but Fernando should be in the team ahead of Matias.

 

I think he’s been dropped due to FF not making the right decisions in attacking areas. He can’t have been dropped for workrate as he always works his socks off. 

 

Lets face it, Matias has done next to nothing in 3 years and FF has been our main man. I don’t want to ruin our main man who is worth £15m when he’s sat on the bench.

 

Jos - You’ve made your point but he now needs to be back in the team. Bigger tests lie ahead in September.

So just drop Matias for what. Playing in a winning team?

[@owlstalk]

8 minutes ago, Bouncing Owl said:

Lets face it, Matias has done next to nothing in 3 years 

Matias been out for three years mostly
Comes in
Team winning

Win three on the bounce
Jos says to him 'sorry gonna drop you now because you've done next to nothing in 3 years'

 

Nahhhhhh

[striker]

Naturally FF would be in my team every day of the week, but to be fair matias has been playing well, been more industrious than I've seen previously tracking back and has some pace going the other way. 

 

Joao has come into the team and is scoring goals.

 

If we're moving away from favourites and players keeping their place on merit, neither deserves to lose their place.

  

 

 

[torryowl]

a manager as to have trust that the players selected will try and play to the system that he's using that day …..maybe he trusts matias more than FF . ….none of us doubt that FF is a far more skillful  player than matias but picking your best player doesn't necessarily mean your picking your best team . 

[Philb125]

Out of interest could someone tell me Fessi’s average minutes / games per season last 3-5 seasons? 

 

I get get that he’s a great player, he’ll most likely be challenging for our top scorer, but if he’s scoring against better teams and others are scoring / playing now, what’s the harm? 

 

 

[Gerinako]

We’ve won 3 on the trot without him

 

If we keep winning he can stay on the bench for all I care

[alanharper]

1 minute ago, Gerinako said:

We’ve won 3 on the trot without him

 

If we keep winning he can stay on the bench for all I care

 

We wouldn't have won against bottom of the league Ipswich if he'd stayed on the bench, we were clueless until he came on.  

 

Just a little fact that everybody saying we won 3 games without him choose to ignore. 

[TrickyTrev]

57 minutes ago, billyblack said:

So just drop Matias for what. Playing in a winning team?

I think it’s more a case of Forestieri working his way back into the team.

 

I didn’t go yesterday so can’t comment on that but when Forestieri came off the bench against Millwall and Ipswich he was class and did more in his short time on the pitch than Matias had done prior in both those matches.

[torryowl]

3 minutes ago, alanharper said:

 

We wouldn't have won against bottom of the league Ipswich if he'd stayed on the bench, we were clueless until he came on.  

 

Just a little fact that everybody saying we won 3 games without him choose to ignore. 

exactly he's a part of the squad and as a role to play …...just because he hasn't started for 3 games some are jumping on jos when results show that he's got the selection spot on . 

[torryowl]

5 minutes ago, TrickyTrev said:

I think it’s more a case of Forestieri working his way back into the team.

 

I didn’t go yesterday so can’t comment on that but when Forestieri came off the bench against Millwall and Ipswich he was class and did more in his short time on the pitch than Matias had done prior in both those matches.

jos said that he wants more from him …...he's far and away our most skillful forward and jos will know that so it as to be something he's not doing that's keeping him out the starting 11 . 

[markowl]

14 hours ago, TodwickOwl said:

A lot of people entirely missing the point in here

 

Yes we have won 3 games - but we’ve played 3 poor teams, look how we got ran ragged against Brentford

 

 

Didn't FF play against Brentford?

[bigrbuk]

Outrageous bit of skill to win a free kick in the dying minutes, anyone got a clip for me to re-watch? (Not read all 13 pages, sorry if already in)