It’s too early to sack the manager. Our prombles run deeper than him

[DJMortimer]

2 hours ago, hawksmore said:

Played a bad hand? No, i don't think so.

 

Look at the players he's had at his disposal since he arrived. 

 

Westwood - one of the best keepers in the division

Tom Lees - easily one of the top 10 CB's in the division when he's given a role and played with a consistent partner

JVA - £2.5M+ signing that does show some signs of being a decent player at this level

Barry Bannan - top 5 midfielder in the division

Hutch - top quality CB/DM

Adam Reach - one of the most versatile players in the division that's actually reliable in all positions played

FF - one of the best players in the division

Joao - potential premier league player

Fletcher - experienced premier league player

Nuihu - hit form back end of last season

Jordan Rhodes - record speaks for itself - but fair enough we couldn't get him firing but Norwich seem to be able to

David Jones - reliable, consistent performer when played in his correct position

George Boyd - can play either wing and has premier league experience

Pudil - granted not great at LB, but still very solid at CB

 

On top of that, we've got Hooper, Lee, Matias and Winnall on their way back from injury. Plus all the promising youngsters too. The only real issues are players like Fox and Joey, the latter could be a very good player, he just doesn't know what his role is, like many of the players.

 

I'm sure there are plenty of managers in this division or currently out of a job who would be salivating at working with the likes of FF, Bannan et al.

 

Ridiculously biased interpretation that would do Fox News proud. 

 

Hutchinson, Lees, Bannan, Forestieri, Westwood, Matias and Fletcher have all been available for no more than a handful of games each, and it would appear that there is been interference from above in at least one of those examples preventing him from being picked now. 

 

Jones, Pudil, Boyd, van Aken and Nuhiu have all been written off by large swathes of our support as a waste of space. Rhodes has been woeful and it's a bit early to laud Norwich for rescuing him after scoring 2 goals.

 

Citing Winnall, Hooper and Lee is disingenuous as Luhukay has been unable to pick either of them yet. 

 

That's not to say there aren't problems, because that much is very clear, but your post is prejudiced beyond all reason.

 

[Hack-Abusi]

2 hours ago, hawksmore said:

Played a bad hand? No, i don't think so.

Look at the players he's had at his disposal since he arrived. 

Westwood - one of the best keepers in the division

Tom Lees - easily one of the top 10 CB's in the division when he's given a role and played with a consistent partner

JVA - £2.5M+ signing that does show some signs of being a decent player at this level

Barry Bannan - top 5 midfielder in the division

Hutch - top quality CB/DM

Adam Reach - one of the most versatile players in the division that's actually reliable in all positions played

FF - one of the best players in the division

Joao - potential premier league player

Fletcher - experienced premier league player

Nuihu - hit form back end of last season

Jordan Rhodes - record speaks for itself - but fair enough we couldn't get him firing but Norwich seem to be able to

David Jones - reliable, consistent performer when played in his correct position

George Boyd - can play either wing and has premier league experience

Pudil - granted not great at LB, but still very solid at CB

 

So he's had a chance to work with players that are injured or out of form ... ? Of course he's had a bad hand .. have you seen the rabble he has to select from in defence. Old, out of form, average players and saying players brought in that have been poor under carlos are miraculously going to turn good?!

 

.. pick and choose to suit the argument hey

[tarn owl]

Missed this thread amongst all the dreary reactionary we must sack managers every 10 games if they dare not win constantly threads. Thank you for some calm among a sea of people boarding the lifeboats because of a storm that may come or may not. Lets ride good boat Jos for a while before jumping off into the cold waters of Mick McCarthy. Long winded but in Jos we trust. WAWAW. Bring on Wednesday.

[gypsyowl]

Jos still has my full support still, Carlos should have left in the summer after Huddersfield farce, the OP is spot on. Norwich game was 3 League games ago, get a grip 

[gurujuan]

1 minute ago, gypsyowl said:

Jos still has my full support still, Carlos should have left in the summer after Huddersfield farce, the OP is spot on. Norwich game was 3 League games ago, get a grip 

He has my qualified support, for now, but he’s testing my patience a bit with this timid, turgid football

[FreshOwl]

Hazarding a guess here but I feel like the Jos/DC relationship may not be a fluid one. His pre match interview today he was alluding to things out of his control and it’s not the first time. You’d see DC with Carlos on quite a few occasions buddying it up, never with Jos. Again probs just pure speculation 

[FreshOwl]

Just now, FreshOwl said:

Hazarding a guess here but I feel like the Jos/DC relationship may not be a fluid one. His pre match interview today he was alluding to things out of his control and it’s not the first time. You’d see DC with Carlos on quite a few occasions buddying it up, never with Jos. Again probs just pure speculation 

I guess when you’re winning everyone’s mates 

[brando]

3 hours ago, Prince said:

This side needs more urgency,energy and aggression. I don't think any of those words can be used to describe Jos and his style of play from what i have seen.

 

If we leave it too late flogging a dead horse we are going to have a mountain to climb to stay in this league,I don't think the Chairman will act though as he puts personal pride before the good of the club.

if you had seen Jos at Brentford you would understand how clueless he was,no emotion whatsoever,think he was looking at the floor every time I looked over at him when he should have been giving advice etc,and changing stuff in a game we were completely overrun in,there is no urgency at all,he is no better than Carlos,how do we keep ending up with these clueless managers,yes Carlos did well for a time,but look at what finances he had available

[Mrmason69]

Absolutely correct. The probs run much deeper than the manager. 

He's just here for the easy money. He's getting more in a year than hell get in ten years in Europe. When we sack him he'll get paid off and go back to Europe a richer man. 

Who can blame him for taking the easy money. He's been deliberately prevented from playing his best team with the owner banning a multitude of players. He's has the owner rather than himself deciding he stays and who goes. Even sky said that that was very unprofessional and dubious. 

I dont feel sorry for jl as he's getting paid a serious amount of money. 

The problems at Wednesday go directly to one place. 

The owner 

[Athelwulf]

You're right.

 

We'll sack him after the Millwall game. 

[Guest The Horse]

Yes, the problems run much deeper but that will take a long time to sort out.

By which time we will more than likely be in League One.

If we are to stay up this season then unfortunately it is all about a short term solution.

I'd like to see what Jos could do with a proper budget and build 'his' team.

But at the moment, he's not going to get that luxury and his plan to fix things as evidenced so far is only going to take us down and fast.

We need a fire fighter of a manager because we have all the hallmarks of a relegation team at the minute.

[hawksmore]

1 hour ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Ridiculously biased interpretation that would do Fox News proud. 

 

Hutchinson, Lees, Bannan, Forestieri, Westwood, Matias and Fletcher have all been available for no more than a handful of games each, and it would appear that there is been interference from above in at least one of those examples preventing him from being picked now. 

 

Jones, Pudil, Boyd, van Aken and Nuhiu have all been written off by large swathes of our support as a waste of space. Rhodes has been woeful and it's a bit early to laud Norwich for rescuing him after scoring 2 goals.

 

Citing Winnall, Hooper and Lee is disingenuous as Luhukay has been unable to pick either of them yet. 

 

That's not to say there aren't problems, because that much is very clear, but your post is prejudiced beyond all reason.

 

 

Things aren't going too well, mate. The manager has got some great players who are playing some woeful football, being played out of position with no direction and under a different formation every week.

 

What he's got is not a bad hand, not compared to what some clubs have to make do with. Some of the blame does lie with him, whether you like that or not, it's just true. 

 

Also, as a final note, Jos will know exactly what the players who are injured are capable of simply because that's his job, he should be watching videos, speaking with them and the backroom staff, that's what managers do. 

[shireowl]

After clueless left I was hoping for someone to come in who knew this division and get us firing again ,

Jos just didn’t cut it with me from his very first squad selections he looked like he picked the names out of a brown bag yes the injuries didn’t help but still raised a few eyebrows,

 

The pigs match 0-0 down to 10 men the Carlisle cup win and the 2-0 win over derby in February got me onside and got me thinking wtf do I know ,

He needs to pick his best side now stop changing every week maybe 433 because at the moment he looks out of his depth we have two winnable home games and after that we have some nightmare games coming up on paper ....

[sherlyegg]

7 hours ago, shandypants said:

If Jos was a poker player,

 

He'd fold early with a pair of aces.

 

His style of football is boring and ultra negative

[nldowl]

It’s also worth considering whether that great run at the end of the season had anything to do with playing against teams with nothing to play for... 

[sherlyegg]

44 minutes ago, Mrmason69 said:

Who can blame him for taking the easy money.

Then why doesn't he play cavalier go for it football, after all he has nothing to lose

[sherlyegg]

46 minutes ago, Mrmason69 said:

He's been deliberately prevented from playing his best team with the owner banning a multitude of players.

Then why haven't they been sold, how come no player has broke ranks and spilled the beans?

 

How come Jos hasn't said FooookYou, he will not suffer fools...everybody said so when he came. Besides which, why would DC set him on knowing his reputation

 

 

 

[DJMortimer]

2 hours ago, nldowl said:

It’s also worth considering whether that great run at the end of the season had anything to do with playing against teams with nothing to play for... 

 

Another myth (or 'bullshit' if you prefer) that is establishing itself as 'fact' by the simple expedient of repetition.

 

We took 20 points from the last 10 games. It included contests against a big local rival, the champions still within reach of 100 points, the play-off winners, a team just outside the top 6 and three (or four if you include Hull who had a little bit more of a cushion) battling to avoid relegation.

[hawksmore]

38 minutes ago, DJMortimer said:

 

Another myth (or 'bullshit' if you prefer) that is establishing itself as 'fact' by the simple expedient of repetition.

 

We took 20 points from the last 10 games. It included contests against a big local rival, the champions still within reach of 100 points, the play-off winners, a team just outside the top 6 and three (or four if you include Hull who had a little bit more of a cushion) battling to avoid relegation.

 

Genuine question then; why do you think we are doing so badly so far this season? Especially if we're looking at/comparing those 10 games as all being fully competitive against teams who came to win.

 

 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, shandypants said:

If Jos was a poker player, his current situation was be the equivalent of having a small stack of chips after being dealt a bad hand. 

 

He took over a team beset with injuries and was only able to bring in one player yet still managed to steer us out of trouble. I think we got 22 points out of the last 10 games last season - that’s top 6 form and promotion form in some seasons. 

 

Hes not playing Westwood but is that his choice? We have a record of not allowing players to play for the first team - is this another case of the same? 

 

Would Jos have let Hunt go if he had the choice? I doubt it. Would Jos have brought in more players if the club wasn’t under embargo? Of course he would. A certain Portuguese player for a start. 

 

The football all is not great at the moment but is that more to do with the players available? My guess is it is. 

 

Jos has a decent record (albeit in Germany). 

 

I think we ought to to cut him some slack.  

No disrespect pal, but this line as been done to death. I agree with the fact JL inherited this crap, but we've heard it a thousand times now. Can't anyone come up with a bit more originality. Sack Jos, DC is incompetent, get big Mick in etc etc. I know its a forum but come on.