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Embargo?


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7 minutes ago, matthefish2002 said:

 

If the club did have an Embargo how on earth would you keep it quiet.

Surely the FA, Football League would have to issue a statement regarding this.

 

This is not to say we might be close to an embargo soon. My guess is not but you get the impression Sheffield Wednesday is going to have to cut its cloth according next couple of seasons.

 

I would have thought so too but in recent weeks there has been a lot of talk about Birmingham being under an embargo. Their fans were discussing the merits of a new signing that to all intents and purposes was a done deal but has apparently been put on hold. This went on for days before anything official was said, if indeed it has been at all. 

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3 hours ago, Hillsborough Mole said:

I don't know how anybody can moan at £23 a game to be completely fair. Although that is the Kop price which is one of the most antiquated stands in football, awful toilets, poor refreshment facilities etc.

 

But I go for the football - which without a doubt has improved hugely under our Chairman.

 

Saying that i recently went to a match in the Alex ferguson stand and its as bad as Hillsborough. What they have done is used the surrounding land better outside/underneath of the ground 

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6 hours ago, Hillsborough Mole said:

I don't know how anybody can moan at £23 a game to be completely fair. Although that is the Kop price which is one of the most antiquated stands in football, awful toilets, poor refreshment facilities etc.

 

But I go for the football - which without a doubt has improved hugely under our Chairman.

I think the kop works out at less than 20 quid for season ticket holders , the £23 I paid was up in the grandstand …..I find it hard to quibble at those prices for championship football but there's no way i'd cough up the 36-46 quid that the POTG have to pay . 

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Guest Hillsborough Mole

Current phase season ticket matchday equivalent

 

Kop - £23.04

North/Grandstand - £28.04

South - £31.95

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4 hours ago, hirstyboywonder said:

 

I would have thought so too but in recent weeks there has been a lot of talk about Birmingham being under an embargo. Their fans were discussing the merits of a new signing that to all intents and purposes was a done deal but has apparently been put on hold. This went on for days before anything official was said, if indeed it has been at all. 

It's been known by some for months that Birmingham have been under a 'soft embargo'. As I have said here before, it is believed that 12 clubs have actually breached P&S limits but that EFL are taking a light approach at the moment.

 

Birmingham have done nothing to ease their problems having had a couple of fairly hefty bids for other players turned down before EFL stepped in and blocked the registration of a signing because they didn't feel Birmingham were playing ball.

 

It pretty much shows where we are though. Almost certainly under the same type of soft embargo, we can still do business but only where we are improving our financial situation.

 

For example, in these situations EFL like to see incoming players costing no more than 75% of the outgoing ones, meaning if we were to out Fletcher on a free at £35k a week, they wouldn't block us signing a replacement on a free at £25k a week.

 

Believe it or not, we also have a small squad which will give us a bit more leeway in doing deals. EFL are more flexible when you have less than 24 senior players (players who are over 21 and have made more than 5 starts), by my maths, we have exactly 24.

 

We are definitely working within a lot of restrictions but it looks like we are being pretty smart about it and should have scope to get some deals done later in the window.

 

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Guest Willow Owl
8 hours ago, Hillsborough Mole said:

 

Sorry mate - thats rounduns as well.

 

1 - we have far more than 600 corporate places - there are at least 300 just in exec boxes, then with all the other lounges, Dooleys, Sheridans, even North Stand.

2 - my figures related entirely to boxes. 

3 - Lets just say that your figure of 60% is correct for utilisation (it isnt). What is the percentage utilisation now? I'd make a calculated guess at less than 10%.

So if you are right, How can the boxes make 45% and still lose money. Are you taking into considerstion the costs involved, wages, food, staff etc. Sales minus costs divide sales gives you gross margin. Then you have hidden costs like wages, gas, electric. 

10% utilisation making money is better than 60% losing money. 

The numbers i quoted are directly from the Chairman, who stated how many places we have when full. 

Are you're saying is the chairman is lying and you know more than him. 

Absolute round uns

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16 minutes ago, Willow Owl said:

So if you are right, How can the boxes make 45% and still lose money. Are you taking into considerstion the costs involved, wages, food, staff etc. Sales minus costs divide sales gives you gross margin. Then you have hidden costs like wages, gas, electric. 

10% utilisation making money is better than 60% losing money. 

The numbers i quoted are directly from the Chairman, who stated how many places we have when full. 

Are you're saying is the chairman is lying and you know more than him. 

Absolute round uns

 

Whilst I have no reason to distrust the Chairman, if the corporate stuff was losing money when he took over, it must have been an absolute shambles.

 

GP on food in that kind of environment is pushing 80% and 65% or so on drinks.

 

Staff levels for event catering do need to be fairly high but even with an unlikely 1:3 ratio, if you can't make money at sensible prices, you are in the wrong business.

 

I could turn a profit at £35 a head (including VAT). Not one worth having but if we are talking about '600 corporate spaces', make it £79 a head including match ticket, 3 course meal and a glass of wine and I would come out of it very nicely thankyou.

 

What do the boxes hold? 10? £790 per box per game, £17k a season. How much are they?

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7 hours ago, Hillsborough Mole said:

 

If anything the refreshments are much worse than they were - still no hot water in the toilets - and the cold water literally trickles out making it pointless to wash your hands.

 

Jesus man it’s a football match not a bloody 5* hotel. Have a wee wee before you go to the ground if you’re that bothered about washing your hands. As for refreshments, eat before you go it’s only an hour and half I’m sure you can go without sustinance for that amount of time.

 

Nobody cares about any of those things you pay for the football and we have top quality Premier league quality players at our club.

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Guest Hillsborough Mole
9 hours ago, Hillsborough Mole said:

I don't know how anybody can moan at £23 a game to be completely fair. Although that is the Kop price which is one of the most antiquated stands in football, awful toilets, poor refreshment facilities etc.

 

But I go for the football - which without a doubt has improved hugely under our Chairman.

 

5 minutes ago, Rebowl Yell said:

 

Jesus man it’s a football match not a bloody 5* hotel. Have a wee wee before you go to the ground if you’re that bothered about washing your hands. As for refreshments, eat before you go it’s only an hour and half I’m sure you can go without sustinance for that amount of time.

 

Nobody cares about any of those things you pay for the football and we have top quality Premier league quality players at our club.

 

Any reason why you left out the 2nd line of my post? 

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Guest Hillsborough Mole
40 minutes ago, Willow Owl said:

So if you are right, How can the boxes make 45% and still lose money. Are you taking into considerstion the costs involved, wages, food, staff etc. Sales minus costs divide sales gives you gross margin. Then you have hidden costs like wages, gas, electric. 

10% utilisation making money is better than 60% losing money. 

The numbers i quoted are directly from the Chairman, who stated how many places we have when full. 

Are you're saying is the chairman is lying and you know more than him. 

Absolute round uns

 

Yes I was taking absolutely everything into account (even down to the cost per head of printing a sheet of A4 as a team sheet per match) - and yes they were making a profit at that price. 

 

I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to the rest of your post.

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1 hour ago, londonowl said:

It's been known by some for months that Birmingham have been under a 'soft embargo'. As I have said here before, it is believed that 12 clubs have actually breached P&S limits but that EFL are taking a light approach at the moment.

 

Birmingham have done nothing to ease their problems having had a couple of fairly hefty bids for other players turned down before EFL stepped in and blocked the registration of a signing because they didn't feel Birmingham were playing ball.

 

It pretty much shows where we are though. Almost certainly under the same type of soft embargo, we can still do business but only where we are improving our financial situation.

 

For example, in these situations EFL like to see incoming players costing no more than 75% of the outgoing ones, meaning if we were to out Fletcher on a free at £35k a week, they wouldn't block us signing a replacement on a free at £25k a week.

 

Believe it or not, we also have a small squad which will give us a bit more leeway in doing deals. EFL are more flexible when you have less than 24 senior players (players who are over 21 and have made more than 5 starts), by my maths, we have exactly 24.

 

We are definitely working within a lot of restrictions but it looks like we are being pretty smart about it and should have scope to get some deals done later in the window.

 

 

The paragraph in bold is a bit concerning should we receive big offers for FF & Bannan that would probably clear our FFP burden & we turn down the offers.

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Just now, mogbad said:

 

The paragraph in bold is a bit concerning should we receive big offers for FF & Bannan that would probably clear our FFP burden & we turn down the offers.

Wrong way round. Birmingham have been trying to buy players, not turning down bids for their players.

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1 minute ago, londonowl said:

Wrong way round. Birmingham have been trying to buy players, not turning down bids for their players.

 

Ah, my bad I misinterpreted the hefty bids turned down as bids from other clubs for their own players.

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just had a look to see which champ teams had signed players for fees. the following had not: villa, derby, sheff utd , sheff wed, leeds, Bolton, qpr, Rotherham.

Rotherham have just come up and I doubt whether they will be one of the 6 teams, sheff utd have probably not signed anyone because of the ownership dispute.

Bolton were under embargo which was lifted to allow loans so maybe still under embargo. To add to this Birmingham are rumoured to be one of the 6.

So that leaves us with : villa (who we know are in trouble), derby, Wednesday, leeds, Bolton, qpr and Birmingham - 7 teams and 6 are rumoured to be under a transfer embargo.

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Guest Hillsborough Mole
2 minutes ago, torres said:

 

I’d argue that’s too much by quite a way 

 

I think the Kop pricing - based on the last 3 seasons is fine

 

The others I wouldnt begin to consider.

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2 minutes ago, torres said:

 

I’d argue that’s too much by quite a way 

I think most would agree that football in general is too expensive but then again, it's £14 to go to the cinema, £95 to go watch The Lion King, £1000 for a new iPhone and £100 to fill your car up with fuel so it's all relative 

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2 minutes ago, waynecoyne14 said:

just had a look to see which champ teams had signed players for fees. the following had not: villa, derby, sheff utd , sheff wed, leeds, Bolton, qpr, Rotherham.

Rotherham have just come up and I doubt whether they will be one of the 6 teams, sheff utd have probably not signed anyone because of the ownership dispute.

Bolton were under embargo which was lifted to allow loans so maybe still under embargo. To add to this Birmingham are rumoured to be one of the 6.

So that leaves us with : villa (who we know are in trouble), derby, Wednesday, leeds, Bolton, qpr and Birmingham - 7 teams and 6 are rumoured to be under a transfer embargo.

 

I don't think anyone is under official embargo except Birmingham. More than 6 clubs are working with EFL to get losses and projected losses back within limits.

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Guest Willow Owl
13 minutes ago, Hillsborough Mole said:

 

Yes I was taking absolutely everything into account (even down to the cost per head of printing a sheet of A4 as a team sheet per match) - and yes they were making a profit at that price. 

 

I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to the rest of your post.

I still dont believe that DC would risk losing any income at 45% margin. Just doesnt make sense.

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Guest Hillsborough Mole
Just now, Willow Owl said:

I still dont believe that DC would risk losing any income at 45% margin. Just doesnt make sense.

 

Ok mate - thats absolutely your prerogative

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