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This press conference has got me very angry


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12 hours ago, Wakefield owl said:

 

Ok be pedantic if you want.

 

My initial point about players fitness still stands though, the manager does not decide.

 

I don't quite get this fitness thing, if it does exists, is all about the manager. What about the players? Why do we not see that the motivation and desire of the players is not there any longer? The players are a far bigger issue than our manager (past or present). We need a big change of personnel in the summer.

 

It's nothing about being pedantic, you quoted me as saying something that I didn't.

And yes It is down to the Club how fitness overall is managed, thats why I said we are well behind the likes of Manchester Utd.

But our Chairman who said himself, that he did not know an awful lot about managing a football team was some what blindsided by Carlos and his team, who's

philosophy was, and I "quote","Tactical periodisation that has a conceptual matrix".

A concept of hunting and ball retention, fitness not an overriding factor in the great scheme of things, and this is where Carlos came unstuck, the Championship is a lot more faster and brutal for his tactics to show fruition, first Season all went well as the players in my view were already at a fitness level brought about by previous Managers/Teams, second Season saw us struggle and in Carlos's own words, "we had to play differently because teams knew how we played", we had a late run to get into the play offs, and if Leeds wouldn't have imploded I dont think we would have made it.Then the play offs we were blowing out of our arses come second half, as for the third Season, Pfft.

So Club or Carlos at fault, For me both, but any other experienced Chairman would have seen and intervened, but because he trusted Carlos (his first Manager) he didn't do anything about it, still believing right up till the end that Carlos was doing the right thing.

Now we have a different Manager in, and if it's not plain to see that he is unhappy about fitness levels I cant help you.

Edited by daleblue
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13 minutes ago, daleblue said:

 

 

It's nothing about being pedantic, you quoted me as saying something that I didn't.

And yes It is down to the Club how fitness overall is managed, thats why I said we are well behind the likes of Manchester Utd.

But our Chairman who said himself, that he did not know an awful lot about managing a football team was some what blindsided by Carlos and his team, who's

philosophy was, and I "quote","Tactical periodisation that has a conceptual matrix".

A concept of hunting and ball retention, fitness not an overriding factor in the great scheme of things, and this is where Carlos came unstuck, the Championship is a lot more faster and brutal for his tactics to show fruition, first Season all went well as the players in my view were already at a fitness level brought about by previous Managers/Teams, second Season saw us struggle and in Carlos's own words, "we had to play differently because teams knew how we played", we had a late run to get into the play offs, and if Leeds wouldn't have imploded I dont think we would have made it.Then the play offs we were blowing out of our arses come second half, as for the third Season, Pfft.

So Club or Carlos at fault, For me both, but any other experienced Chairman would have seen and intervened, but because he trusted Carlos (his first Manager) he didn't do anything about it, still believing right up till the end that Carlos was doing the right thing.

Now we have a different Manager in, and if it's not plain to see that he is unhappy about fitness levels I cant help you.

Actually, I do think there was some truth in that There were plenty of signs in season two, that it was becoming increasingly difficult to implement the plan However, bolstered by a 4th placed finish, Carlos, and the Chairman probably thought it might be worth going again, especially as there was little money to change the set up, as we were commuted to the signing of Jordan Rhodes

The only fly in the ointment for me, with this scenario, is our signings If that’s the way Carlos wanted to play, and I think you’re right, then some of the recruitment didn’t add up Virtually none of those players signed in seasons 2 and 3, could be described as being able to hunt down, and only one or two lent themselves to the passing game If your theory is correct, then, as I’ve long suspected, the recruitment was done by someone else

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12 hours ago, Wakefield owl said:

 

It does make me smile when a nobody can call someone managing in the PL a clown!

if you don't think that man and his antics over a period of time were bordering or beyond silly and wasteful, then it speaks volumes of the benchmark you set for our managers.

it's hard to set carlos as a wednesday manager against others as no one has spent a quarter of what he has had at his disposal over his time here. 

the end result being the man in after him having to frantically scramble to put fires out by adding young and untried players (WHO WEREN'T GOOD ENOUGH FOR CONSIDERATION) to a squad critically depleted by injury and lack of fitness (to levels so bad that none of us can remember in the history of football another club effected so badly) in the hope of keeping us out of the third division again.

CARLOS HAD A DREAM...

and we were  ON OUR WAY BACK alright.

crackpot ideas, good at spending money on players we didn't need whilst gaping flaws weren't addressed, good at keeping many of the previous managers players in his side despite spending the clubs fortune on his own, good at talking, yet strangely enough no good at explanations

 

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12 hours ago, CF83OWL said:

This lack of fitness/missing players smells rather fishy to me. 

 

Jos sounds like he is being extra cautious with players but they seem to be getting injured anyway (Mathias and Rhodes for example). 

 

Who knows whats going on. 

unfit players will get injured more when up against fellow professionals who are fit.

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12 hours ago, Wakefield owl said:

 

Ok be pedantic if you want.

 

My initial point about players fitness still stands though, the manager does not decide.

 

I don't quite get this fitness thing, if it does exists, is all about the manager. What about the players? Why do we not see that the motivation and desire of the players is not there any longer? The players are a far bigger issue than our manager (past or present). We need a big change of personnel in the summer.

because they could see what many of us could see over time, that you still can't now.

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13 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

Actually, I do think there was some truth in that There were plenty of signs in season two, that it was becoming increasingly difficult to implement the plan However, bolstered by a 4th placed finish, Carlos, and the Chairman probably thought it might be worth going again, especially as there was little money to change the set up, as we were commuted to the signing of Jordan Rhodes

The only fly in the ointment for me, with this scenario, is our signings If that’s the way Carlos wanted to play, and I think you’re right, then some of the recruitment didn’t add up Virtually none of those players signed in seasons 2 and 3, could be described as being able to hunt down, and only one or two lent themselves to the passing game If your theory is correct, then, as I’ve long suspected, the recruitment was done by someone else

 

Could not agree more on the recruitment, but when interviewed about the signings Carlos did say he had the final say, the signing of players he really wanted or having to take second/third/fourth choice is debatable, But i am convinced it was the way he played and trained considering the players he had at his disposal which was wrong.

Edited by daleblue
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4 minutes ago, daleblue said:

 

Could not agree more on the recruitment, but when interviewed about the signings Carlos did say he had the final say, the signing of players he really wanted or having 

to take second/third/fourth choice is debatable, But i am convinced it was the way he played and trained considering the players he had at his disposal which was wrong.

I really wouldn’t take much notice of what Carlos and the Chairman said on recruitment, they were probably just appearing to be singing from the same hymn sheet

its a fact that with that recruitment policy, a coach will often have to accept third and fourth choices However, most of the players were not even the right type of players to make the system work

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7 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

I really wouldn’t take much notice of what Carlos and the Chairman said on recruitment, they were probably just appearing to be singing from the same hymn sheet

its a fact that with that recruitment policy, a coach will often have to accept third and fourth choices However, most of the players were not even the right type of players to make the system work

It would be truly bizarre for Carlos to consistently 'lie' to the media if he was having players foisted on him that didn't fit the way he wanted to play. 

Seems far more logical to believe that Carlos was telling the truth when insisting that he had the final say in selecting recruitment options.

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2 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

I really wouldn’t take much notice of what Carlos and the Chairman said on recruitment, they were probably just appearing to be singing from the same hymn sheet

its a fact that with that recruitment policy, a coach will often have to accept third and fourth choices However, most of the players were not even the right type of players to make the system work

Agree with all of that, but (theres always a but :rolleyes:), the players he did have would have fared better if fitter.

An awful lot of talk of Doyen in regards to players, but even if they only played a small part in this, our recruitment was a mess, the signing of Rhodes and the way we 

played showed a haphazard approach, all of which needs to be sorted, these adviser's that the Chairman kept mentioning need to be culled. Leave it to the Manager,

at least then we know who to blame :ph34r:.

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2 minutes ago, Xxxxxxxxcxcc said:

It would be truly bizarre for Carlos to consistently 'lie' to the media if he was having players foisted on him that didn't fit the way he wanted to play. 

Seems far more logical to believe that Carlos was telling the truth when insisting that he had the final say in selecting recruitment options.

But even more bizarre if he brought in those players who were incapable of playing the way he seemingly wanted to play

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2 minutes ago, Xxxxxxxxcxcc said:

It would be truly bizarre for Carlos to consistently 'lie' to the media if he was having players foisted on him that didn't fit the way he wanted to play. 

Seems far more logical to believe that Carlos was telling the truth when insisting that he had the final say in selecting recruitment options.

what puzzles me about the carlosites is they believe him to be correct in everything he did, EXCEPT he wasn't telling to truth when he stated he was having the 'final say' on our eccentric recruitment. 

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1 minute ago, daleblue said:

Agree with all of that, but (theres always a but :rolleyes:), the players he did have would have fared better if fitter.

An awful lot of talk of Doyen in regards to players, but even if they only played a small part in this, our recruitment was a mess, the signing of Rhodes and the way we 

played showed a haphazard approach, all of which needs to be sorted, these adviser's that the Chairman kept mentioning need to be culled. Leave it to the Manager,

at least then we know who to blame :ph34r:.

Yes, that has to happen, or I fear Jos will end up walking away There is much work to be done behind the scenes We simply cannot go again with this group of players, however fit they are

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Just now, dnhc said:

what puzzles me about the carlosites is they believe him to be correct in everything he did, EXCEPT he wasn't telling to truth when he stated he was having the 'final say' on our eccentric recruitment. 

 

All sounds a bit odd, conspiracy maybe, or just the plain facts, that whilst in charge our recruitment was shiiite.

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3 minutes ago, dnhc said:

what puzzles me about the carlosites is they believe him to be correct in everything he did, EXCEPT he wasn't telling to truth when he stated he was having the 'final say' on our eccentric recruitment. 

I don’t think anyone who watched us, would claim that Carlos was correct in everything he did

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13 hours ago, CF83OWL said:

This lack of fitness/missing players smells rather fishy to me. 

 

Jos sounds like he is being extra cautious with players but they seem to be getting injured anyway (Mathias and Rhodes for example). 

 

Who knows whats going on. 

Rhodes ran himself into the ground against Derby and then caught this virus which speaks volumes about his level of fitness.

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26 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

But even more bizarre if he brought in those players who were incapable of playing the way he seemingly wanted to play

He made mistakes. Imagining that he was consistently lying to the media in a way that indicted himself when in fact he wasnt responsible makes zero sense. Fantasy really. No reason at all to think Carlos was consistently lying.

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Just now, Xxxxxxxxcxcc said:

He made mistakes. Imagining that he was consistently lying to the media in a way that indicted himself when in fact he wasnt responsible makes zero sense. Fantasy really. No reason at all to think Carlos was consistently lying.

Hardly lying, just towing the party line You’ve been around long enough to know that most of what comes out of football clubs is pure waffle

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2 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

Hardly lying, just towing the party line You’ve been around long enough to know that most of what comes out of football clubs is pure waffle

Polite spin for lying. It might suit a conspiracy theory but there is zero evidence of him lying quite apart from making no sense.

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