Bigaltheowl Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, @owlstalk said: I'm so exhausted by it all I can't even be bothered to go into it again. All the things coming out from the players since Carlos left points to the same thing. It's clear. It's obvious. And it's coming from the players not someone making it up on the internet. Anyway - let's keep things positive eh? No point doing this to death again fair enough lets move on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethel The Tree Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 32 minutes ago, HOSTAGE IN PYONGYANG said: Injured his tongue? Dirty bl88der. Stands to reason, dun't it? His groin has been out of commission so he's had to improvise 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
York_Owl Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Bigaltheowl said: and most were putting the blame on carlos And quite rightly, he's the manager. His job is to manage the players including their fitness, injuries etc. Most players would probably say they are OK to play even if they are carrying an injury (as with Tom Lees). A good manager should know when to play and when not to play one of their players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Batman Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Good to see him giving credit to the Physios, working 12 hour shifts alongside him. Maybe they're not the incompetent baffoons some make them out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramone Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Puts to bed the myth that Carlos forced the players to play through injury... Tom says he insisted on playing. I appreciate the sentiment but it explains why he was absolutely gash in the weeks prior to him being on the sidelines. And the decision hindered the team. I'm pleased there is an explanation to his poor form though. It eases my concerns about him. Cant wait to have him back fully fit. Excellent CB and on his day he is one of the best outside the PL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzzy logics Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 It's positive that we now have a team in place that is focusing on players being able to sustain fitness when they are ready to return rather than being brought straight back and yo-yo'ing in and out of the 1st team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoop Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 hours ago, @owlstalk said: Yeah says a lot that sentence Yep another example of how Coco has ballsed up our season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackSWFC Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 32 minutes ago, ramone said: Puts to bed the myth that Carlos forced the players to play through injury... Tom says he insisted on playing. That's what you want from a player. What you want from a manager is them to then say "That's very brave of you Tom, but you need to get yourself fit, so I'm afraid you'll have to sit this one out." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramone Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Just now, JackSWFC said: That's what you want from a player. What you want from a manager is them to then say "That's very brave of you Tom, but you need to get yourself fit, so I'm afraid you'll have to sit this one out." Hmmmm not quite sure I can agree with you. Did you watch Newcastle v Man Utd the other day? Cant remember exactly which ex pro they had commentating but he said the same as me... Pogba was injured during the warm up and during the first half was continually asked by Mourinho if he was fit to carry on and Pogba kept putting his thumb up saying yes he was fine. The commentator said he should just tell Jose that he was injured as, by staying on injured, he was cheating his team mates. All the manager can do in that situation is ask the player and trust them. If you think Carlos shoudl have diagnosed his injury or not trusted him then you're way off understanding what happens at a football club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owl 44 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 hours ago, owls about that said: “I tried to do everything I could to stay on the pitch but it probably got to the point where it was a little bit stupid of me, to be honest, to carry on playing. If anything, I made it worse. “Maybe if I had swallowed my pride a bit earlier I might have been out a couple of weeks rather than a couple of months Why did the management allow this to happen, playing a player when he is clearly injured. It seems to happen a lot at Wednesday. Last season Bannan played most games with an injury, Kieran Lee certainly did, Hoops came back too soon and got injured again, Fletcher has been managing his knee injury for over a year, probably playing when he shouldn't have, Ross Wallace broke down in first 5 minutes of play off semi and this season Jack Hunt and Sam Hutchinson came back far too quickly leading to worse injury problems. Don't even get me started on Fessi who should have had the operation nearly a year ago but the club inexplicably waited until the season had already started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackSWFC Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 39 minutes ago, ramone said: Hmmmm not quite sure I can agree with you. Did you watch Newcastle v Man Utd the other day? Cant remember exactly which ex pro they had commentating but he said the same as me... Pogba was injured during the warm up and during the first half was continually asked by Mourinho if he was fit to carry on and Pogba kept putting his thumb up saying yes he was fine. The commentator said he should just tell Jose that he was injured as, by staying on injured, he was cheating his team mates. All the manager can do in that situation is ask the player and trust them. If you think Carlos shoudl have diagnosed his injury or not trusted him then you're way off understanding what happens at a football club. But it wasn’t over the course of one match, but several. Would you say that Lees had been playing to the standards that you’d expect him to be? I don’t think he was, and that’s when you could expect Carlos to think that maybe the injury he’s carrying is effecting his performances and perhaps he should allow him to recover fully instead of letting him carry on playing games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nldowl Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 It’s down to the medical team and player when they return from injury... not a coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@owlstalk Posted February 16, 2018 Author Share Posted February 16, 2018 8 minutes ago, nldowl said: It’s down to the medical team and player when they return from injury... not a coach That's not always the case at all Owlstalk Shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A E Neuman NYowl Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 Crikey didn't know he had also had a tongue injury, this once happend to me at Hillsborough. Was on the kop and burnt my tongue on a hot bovril, disaster I couldn't chant for the rest of the match. I got substituted and put in the west stand lower to prevent further injury. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthefish2002 Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 hours ago, ramone said: Puts to bed the myth that Carlos forced the players to play through injury... Tom says he insisted on playing. I always thought that while CC is not blameless for playing people while not fully fit its a bit harsh all the blame laid at his door. Ultimately its up to the player weather he plays or not when returning for injury. Sure CC tried to use his oily charm on Lee and Hutchinson to play in the play offs but if they said no due to still being injured then that's that. CC said he couldn't get Rhodes to take a pen because he didn't want to v Huddersfield so doubt he put a gun to the head of any player. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramone Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 40 minutes ago, JackSWFC said: But it wasn’t over the course of one match, but several. Would you say that Lees had been playing to the standards that you’d expect him to be? I don’t think he was, and that’s when you could expect Carlos to think that maybe the injury he’s carrying is effecting his performances and perhaps he should allow him to recover fully instead of letting him carry on playing games. He's our best centre half who was playing poorly for about 4 weeks prior to his injury lay off. I don't think he was playing anywhere his best. But if Tom Lees is declaring himself fit, when we have injured Centre Halves, what are you to do? If, at the time, Carlos brought Thorniley in for Tom Lees and he'd have had a stinker, what would everyones reaction been? I know, I suspect you know as well. Carlos was under pressure to get results. It was a totally different kettle of fish to what Jos has. Im pleased Cos has introduced him, he's been great. But I don't think it was a risk Carlos could have taken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldishowl Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 2 hours ago, ramone said: Puts to bed the myth that Carlos forced the players to play through injury... Tom says he insisted on playing. I appreciate the sentiment but it explains why he was absolutely gash in the weeks prior to him being on the sidelines. And the decision hindered the team. I'm pleased there is an explanation to his poor form though. It eases my concerns about him. Cant wait to have him back fully fit. Excellent CB and on his day he is one of the best outside the PL The decision of who plays is down to the manager. How the eck can a player insist he plays. If a manager lets a player he knows is injured play then the fault for his poor performances and the worsening of the injury is clearly with the manager. And both happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hillsborough Mole Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 5 hours ago, Bigaltheowl said: and most were putting the blame on carlos 2 hours ago, ramone said: Puts to bed the myth that Carlos forced the players to play through injury... Tom says he insisted on playing It is a bit different in terms of coming back into the team after an injury now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramone Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 hours ago, oldishowl said: The decision of who plays is down to the manager. How the eck can a player insist he plays. If a manager lets a player he knows is injured play then the fault for his poor performances and the worsening of the injury is clearly with the manager. And both happened. So you've never heard of the term 'the player declared himself fit to play' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramone Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 3 hours ago, Hillsborough Mole said: It is a bit different in terms of coming back into the team after an injury now. You've interpreted a very blasé statement to meet your argument. It could mean a number of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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