Tempo

[Ballmeist]

One of my main frustrations watching Wednesday over the last 3 seasons is that we never set the tempo of a game regardless of who we’re playing, or whether we’re home or away. 

 

We we always seem to try and feel our way into a game to see how the other team want to play. Against lesser opposition this only serves to build their confidence which is part of the reason why we get such poor results, and possibly an explanation as to why we don’t compete in  the opening 45.

 

thoughts? 

[Holmowl]

My thoughts are that you are bang on.

 

Carlos seems to over-think, as if it's chess rather than footie. 

 

Those in here who spouted that the first leg v Udders was a tactical masterpiece couldn't have been more wrong. It was ultra-caution bordering on fear.

 

We take on MKD, Charlton, Wigan, QPR, Ipswich, Brentford, Burton, Bolton, Rotherham etc etc etc etc and go way beyond showing respect. We should be looking to kill these teams off in the first 45. 

 

We have scored 3 or more goals in a match 5 times in our last 64 matches. That's not good enough for a team boasting Forestieri, Hooper, Fletcher and Rhodes. We start far too cautiously and sit back if we go ahead. We will continue to under-achieve while this is allowed to go on.

 

 

[Kevan]

Both these opening two posts are absolutely bang on the money!

 

We have a squad (and indeed a first choice eleven), that could murder most teams in this division, if we went out with a positive approach from the first whistle.  It's unbelievable that in most games we just sit back and wait for it to happen.  Only a new head coach will resolve this problem.

[TrickyTrev]

27 minutes ago, Ballmeist said:

One of my main frustrations watching Wednesday over the last 3 seasons is that we never set the tempo of a game regardless of who we’re playing, or whether we’re home or away. 

 

We we always seem to try and feel our way into a game to see how the other team want to play. Against lesser opposition this only serves to build their confidence which is part of the reason why we get such poor results, and possibly an explanation as to why we don’t compete in  the opening 45.

 

thoughts? 

Bang on pal, these constant slow starts are really starting to p**s me off.

 

Pretty much every single week we start our matches in the same way and I find myself complaining about it after almost every match, why must we give every side we play a free shot!?

 

It’s like a boxer going into the ring and not throwing any punches for the first few rounds!!

[Avon barksdale]

Push the tempo

push the tempo

push the tempo 

push the tempo UP 

[Owling Wolfe]

Its so frustrating when the same 11 that played Leeds off the park then play so badly two weeks later at the rock bottom team. Friustration is probably not strong enough a word. I do wonder how much is down to the manager and how much is dowm to individual performances. Honestly the only players that deserve any credit are Bannan, Hooper and Lee. The rest, although showing flashes of brilliance occasionally, have been poor by their own standards.

[TheSlicer]

25 minutes ago, Holmowl said:

My thoughts are that you are bang on.

 

Carlos seems to over-think, as if it's chess rather than footie. 

 

Those in here who spouted that the first leg v Udders was a tactical masterpiece couldn't have been more wrong. It was ultra-caution bordering on fear.

 

We take on MKD, Charlton, Wigan, QPR, Ipswich, Brentford, Burton, Bolton, Rotherham etc etc etc etc and go way beyond showing respect. We should be looking to kill these teams off in the first 45. 

 

We have scored 3 or more goals in a match 5 times in our last 64 matches. That's not good enough for a team boasting Forestieri, Hooper, Fletcher and Rhodes. We start far too cautiously and sit back if we go ahead. We will continue to under-achieve while this is allowed to go on.

 

 

Staggering fact that mate. 

 

and I hundred percent agree. With the fire power at our disposal it’s criminal. 

[dumboldowl]

We're all pretty much in agreement here. The only ones who don't seem to be able to grasp the problem are the ones who allow the problem to continue match after match.

[Guest Wonder Spaniel]

There seems to have been a common theme of slow starts throughout th Carvalhal reign. Very frustrating, when you consider that we could be dominating teams and setting the psychological dominance from the off. Instead, it appears that all too often we appear to allow teams to feel their way into the game and almost expect that our superior technical game will overcome them in time. As much as I agree with much of how Carlos has us playing in terms of style, I can't help wonder if it's just a bit too 'Portuguese' sometimes? Maybe we just need a bit of front foot urgency earlier in the game and let our game do the talking.

[Derick Mills]

Absolutely agree with all the post BUT we don't look fit enough to play at a high tempo for 90 mins imo

[torryowl]

1 hour ago, Ballmeist said:

One of my main frustrations watching Wednesday over the last 3 seasons is that we never set the tempo of a game regardless of who we’re playing, or whether we’re home or away. 

 

We we always seem to try and feel our way into a game to see how the other team want to play. Against lesser opposition this only serves to build their confidence which is part of the reason why we get such poor results, and possibly an explanation as to why we don’t compete in  the opening 45.

 

thoughts? 

if your frustrated and think  we get such poor results over the last 3 years I cant imagine what you thought of the 3 years previous to carlos arriving .......... .very few sides have more of the possession so you'd think we'd dictate what the tempo of the game is , carlos just seems to prefer the slower tempo style of playing 

[Holmowl]

Just took a look at this. 

 

We scored 3 or more goals only 3 times in our 48 games last season - Norwich, Birmingham, Bristol City.

 

Here are the recently promoted teams:-

 

Newcastle 11 times 

Brighton 10 times

Huddersfield 4 times 

 

Burnley 10 times

Boro 10 times 

Hull 7 times

 

Bournmouth 13 times

Watford 14 times

Norwich 15 times

 

We start oh so slowly. And when we get ahead we stick rather than twist.

 

The teams that get the auto spots attack and crush. We dont.

 

[Indoor Owl]

2 hours ago, Ballmeist said:

 is that we never set the tempo of a game regardless of who we’re playing, or whether we’re home or away. 

 

We we always seem to try and feel our way into a game to see how the other team want to play. Against lesser opposition this only serves to build their confidence which is part of the reason why we get such poor results, and possibly an explanation as to why we don’t compete in  the opening 45.

 

thoughts? 

 

I'd disagree with this:

 

We set out to control the tempo of the game, and often we do dicate the tempo of the game - it's just that it's not the tempo many fans prefer to be seeing.

 

We absolutely setup games to control the tempo, play patient, try to be better on the ball, then swing the ball in; and that's what we do.  As long as we're scoring the chances when they come, we're winning games, just that it's not the end-to-end fast paced football people prefer.

 

It's a controlled tempo game, just like most of the continental game.

 

Our problem has been some lacklustre goalkeeping this campaign, and an astounding number of blown offensive chances.  We've only really been outplayed in two games.

 

It's definitely not the most exciting football to watch, but people better get used to it - especially when we win promotion this year:  It's the only way we're going to be able to stay in the PL and build a warchest.

I'm used to it from watching the Portuguese national team, they tend to behave in the same way.

 

In any case, we're trying to win promotion, not 'most exciting 9th place finisher in the Championship'.  Stick with what has got us into the playoffs twice in a row, rather than try and re-invent the side into a style of play that we're not at all built for in terms of personnel.

 

Edited October 20, 2017 by Indoor Owl

[Big Ron's Sovereign]

1 hour ago, Derick Mills said:

Absolutely agree with all the post BUT we don't look fit enough to play at a high tempo for 90 mins imo

 

If we played how we know we can with the players, who have got it in their locker, we don't need to worry about fitness over the full 90 as we could be 5-0 up by then   

[s6 owl]

3 hours ago, Derick Mills said:

Absolutely agree with all the post BUT we don't look fit enough to play at a high tempo for 90 mins imo

This.

Our fitness has been appalling this season the squad has looked shattered quite often

Edited October 20, 2017 by s6 owl

[Orlando_Trustful]

It is a major issue. Staton asked some good questions in his press conference about how we start games and our approach in the first half. CC brushed it off as if it wasn't a big problem and there was nothing in it.

 

Newcastle and Norwich are probably the only two home games I can remember in the last year or so where we really went at a team from the start. 

[meggoisgod]

The players must take some blame for this also. Bannan often dictates our game plan but for me consistently sits far too deep. Good footballer but he is not athletic enough to get up and down and when he plays wide he just cuts in as he has no pace. I'd consider dropping him now Hutch is fit. Or go 3 5 2

Lees also needs to be more vocal and demand more effort. Seriously lacking in leadership

Without loovens I would be making Hooper captain

[Orlando_Trustful]

38 minutes ago, meggoisgod said:

 

Lees also needs to be more vocal and demand more effort. Seriously lacking in leadership

 

That is a very good point. 

[OWLS about that?]

9 hours ago, Kevan said:

Both these opening two posts are absolutely bang on the money!

 

We have a squad (and indeed a first choice eleven), that could murder most teams in this division, if we went out with a positive approach from the first whistle.  It's unbelievable that in most games we just sit back and wait for it to happen.  Only a new head coach will resolve this problem.

This. Most managers would kill to have a squad like ours at their disposal but Carlos constantly gets it wrong and when he gets it right it's only once in a blue moon. The first season we went straight at teams and reaped the rewards, now he just sets them up not to concede, which we are on a regular basis. I sincerely hope he can turn it around but the signs aren't looking great.

[doubleo]

7 hours ago, Indoor Owl said:

 

I'd disagree with this:

 

We set out to control the tempo of the game, and often we do dicate the tempo of the game - it's just that it's not the tempo many fans prefer to be seeing.

 

We absolutely setup games to control the tempo, play patient, try to be better on the ball, then swing the ball in; and that's what we do.  As long as we're scoring the chances when they come, we're winning games, just that it's not the end-to-end fast paced football people prefer.

 

It's a controlled tempo game, just like most of the continental game.

 

Our problem has been some lacklustre goalkeeping this campaign, and an astounding number of blown offensive chances.  We've only really been outplayed in two games.

 

It's definitely not the most exciting football to watch, but people better get used to it - especially when we win promotion this year:  It's the only way we're going to be able to stay in the PL and build a warchest.

I'm used to it from watching the Portuguese national team, they tend to behave in the same way.

 

In any case, we're trying to win promotion, not 'most exciting 9th place finisher in the Championship'.  Stick with what has got us into the playoffs twice in a row, rather than try and re-invent the side into a style of play that we're not at all built for in terms of personnel.

 

That's fair enough if we were playing Man City or Chelsea, but, against Bolton, Preston, Burton ?