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On 9/25/2017 at 12:08, basegreenowl said:

How come we get found out then if its a winning system? Suppose players have to fit the system. Some of them mentioned teams have better players than us it is fair to say. Newcastle had the likes of Shelvey and Hayden in that system. We haven't got that luxury. I sure know there are better systems than 4-4-2 for our group of players. Why is it we have looked powerless in in all the play-off games and the derby yesterday against teams playing different systems? Sheffield United are not Real Madrid. Man to man we should not be losing 2-4! How many systems as Carlos played often since his arrival?

 

My point is, no formation is automatically a winning system.

 

I, along with others, have said for longer than 18 months now, that 4-4-2 doesn't utilize the players we've got, nor does it bring out the best in them. Every single one of our midfielders is suited to a three man midfield. Only Kieran Lee is a complete enough midfielder to play in a 2 man midfield. Bannan, Hutchinson, Abdi & Butterfield are all specialist midfielders who perform more specific roles, which can only be real fully utilised in three man midfields (unless you play three at the back!).

 

The massive difference between Sheffield United and Sheffield Wednesday at present (not just on Sunday), is that one team plays a system where each player knows its role and performs it to bring the best out of their ability, and one team plays a system that is unbalanced and limits the players within each role. Simple as that. Wednesday didn't lose the game on Sunday because they weren't up for it, they lost it because the players within an already inefficient system, were ill-disciplined which exposed the already marked weaknesses even more.  

 

Since Carlos has arrived, he's predominantly played 4-4-2 or a variant of it (either lopsided or 4-4-1-1). When he first arrived, he tried to implement a 4-2-3-1, which quickly got shelved for a more traditional 4-4-2. Ironically, in our most impressive display under him (Arsenal at home), Carlos played a 4-3-3 (or 4-5-1). 

 

On 9/25/2017 at 12:32, Lord Snooty said:

 

This ^^^^^^^

 

 

Leicester were able to do it because in Drinkwater and Kante they had two absolute stamina monsters in the middle of the park. 

 

They also had full backs who were just that. Full backs. 

Simpson and Fuchs barely stepped over the half way line the season they won the title. It was a 'proper' defensive back four.

 

More than half their goals came on the counter with a direct ball over for a pacy striker. 

 

It can be done.

We just don't have two central midfield machines. Full backs who can defend for 90 Minutes or a striker with any pace.

 

Which does beg the question why we persevere with it.

 

What is staggering about it all, is the roles that we employ within our 4-4-2, are the roles that you'd see in systems with a three man midfield. 

 

In a 4-2-3-1, you'd see the full backs bomb forward, like we expect Hunt & Reach to do. Except in that system, you have two midfielder offering a shield in front of the exposed centre halves. On Sunday, we had no shield, the full backs bombing forward, and consistently a 2 vs. 2 involving Lees/Van Aken and Clarke/Brookes. 

 

We have Barry Bannan playing as a roaming playmaker (or when he plays in central two man midfield, a deeper playmaker)...which would be ideal in a 4-3-3, with a genuine holding midfielder behind him, and a box to box midfielder alongside him. 

 

We play Ross Wallace as a winger who likes to cut inside from the right wing, and take the both onto his stronger foot. Another role, ideally suited to a 4-2-3-1 or a 4-3-3 system. 

 

The ONLY reason I think Carlos perseveres with this inefficient and inherently weak system, is because of his plethora of strikers available to him. You can't fault Fletcher;s or Hooper's form, but for me, unless he changes the system, this same messy, uninspiring performances and results will continue to happen. 

 

He needs to start to look at what he's got, and utilise them to their full potential. 

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