Yet another question about young Hirsty, re: compensation

[MalagaOwl]

If I am way off the mark here, feel free to let me know. 

 

My question is, if young Hirsty doesn't sign a contract and walks, we would get compensation decided by the PFCC.

Surely we are more likely to get more money if he is a player who is actually playing first team football somewhere? If he went on loan for the last year of his contract and banged in 30 goals in a lower league, or stayed as a squad player and got a few goals from the bench, both of these would mean we get more money? 

 

Yeah we have loads of strikers, but surely he is a better shout for the bench than Joao? 

 

 

[Dagmeister]

28 minutes ago, MalagaOwl said:

If I am way off the mark here, feel free to let me know. 

 

My question is, if young Hirsty doesn't sign a contract and walks, we would get compensation decided by the PFCC.

Surely we are more likely to get more money if he is a player who is actually playing first team football somewhere? If he went on loan for the last year of his contract and banged in 30 goals in a lower league, or stayed as a squad player and got a few goals from the bench, both of these would mean we get more money? 

 

Yeah we have loads of strikers, but surely he is a better shout for the bench than Joao? 

 

 

No he's not.

 

Probably go out on loan in January

Edited September 15, 2017 by Dagmeister

[adelphi1867]

This is getting boring now.

[MalagaOwl]

Sorry, just wasnt sure the compensation issue had been addressed, at least not where i saw it.

 

Really glad this was my first ever post on here. thanks for the welcome

[Dagmeister]

Just now, MalagaOwl said:

Sorry, just wasnt sure the compensation issue had been addressed, at least not where i saw it.

 

Really glad this was my first ever post on here. thanks for the welcome

Course it is sausage.

[Lord Snooty]

29 minutes ago, MalagaOwl said:

Yeah we have loads of strikers, but surely he is a better shout for the bench than Joao?

 

But is he?

 

 

[MalagaOwl]

Just now, Dagmeister said:

Course it is sausage.

Oh ok, glad you know something i dont

[Guest RocketOwl]

39 minutes ago, MalagaOwl said:

If I am way off the mark here, feel free to let me know. 

 

My question is, if young Hirsty doesn't sign a contract and walks, we would get compensation decided by the PFCC.

Surely we are more likely to get more money if he is a player who is actually playing first team football somewhere? If he went on loan for the last year of his contract and banged in 30 goals in a lower league, or stayed as a squad player and got a few goals from the bench, both of these would mean we get more money? 

 

Yeah we have loads of strikers, but surely he is a better shout for the bench than Joao? 

 

 

Joao whose played for the full Portugal national team and whose scored goals in the championship and whose taken the wee wee when he's played U23 football - but Hirst is a better option? Interesting.

[Sultan_Pepper]

I would expect compensation to be at least the same as any offer we have declined for the player

[F. Spiksley]

41 minutes ago, MalagaOwl said:

If I am way off the mark here, feel free to let me know. 

 

 

 

 

 

[steelcityowlsfan]

1 hour ago, MalagaOwl said:

If I am way off the mark here, feel free to let me know. 

 

My question is, if young Hirsty doesn't sign a contract and walks, we would get compensation decided by the PFCC.

Surely we are more likely to get more money if he is a player who is actually playing first team football somewhere? If he went on loan for the last year of his contract and banged in 30 goals in a lower league, or stayed as a squad player and got a few goals from the bench, both of these would mean we get more money? 

 

Yeah we have loads of strikers, but surely he is a better shout for the bench than Joao? 

 

 

Not sure if performance is taken into account. You'd assume it would be. 

 

It seems to have hit a bit of an impasse at the moment. I'm not confident we'll get a good price of it goes to a tribunal. 

[pazowl55]

We will find out soon enough. As the club will want it sorted one way or another before the transfer window re opens.

Expect him to sign a new contract anyway then go out on loan in January.

Edited September 15, 2017 by pazowl55

[Leaping Lannys Perm]

1 hour ago, MalagaOwl said:

If I am way off the mark here, feel free to let me know. 

 

My question is, if young Hirsty doesn't sign a contract and walks, we would get compensation decided by the PFCC.

Surely we are more likely to get more money if he is a player who is actually playing first team football somewhere? If he went on loan for the last year of his contract and banged in 30 goals in a lower league, or stayed as a squad player and got a few goals from the bench, both of these would mean we get more money? 

 

Yeah we have loads of strikers, but surely he is a better shout for the bench than Joao? 

 

 

First of all, welcome to Owlstalk.

Second of all, what is your evidence for him being a better option off the bench than Joao? 

[just visiting]

"Once assembled, the PFCC has a set list of factors to consider, mostly involving costs. First of all the status of the two clubs (transferor and transferee) is taken into account, then the age of the player. The terms on which the player was engaged by the transferor are examined, as is the amount of any fee paid upon registration, and the length of time the player was at the club.

The terms of the new contracts offered to the player by each club are considered, then the player’s playing record is looked at, in terms of first-team appearances and international call-ups. Finally, interest shown by any other clubs is taken into account."

 

An example would be Charlie Taylor, he'd been with Leeds United since he was 9 years old, He'd made over 100 first team appearances for the club and represented England at U19 level. His final contract offer was between £15-18k per week by Cellino, he turned it down. WBA had enquired about a £6m transfer last January, Cellino turned it down (turned out the wrong decision). Burnley signed him on a free transfer and were told to pay £5m + performance related add ons and a sell on fee as compensation by the PFCC.

 

You can probably make an educated guess at the level of compensation which you would receive by comparing the two players playing records and contract offers. I would say around £1.5m with plenty of add ons.

[StudentOwl]

1 minute ago, just visiting said:

"Once assembled, the PFCC has a set list of factors to consider, mostly involving costs. First of all the status of the two clubs (transferor and transferee) is taken into account, then the age of the player. The terms on which the player was engaged by the transferor are examined, as is the amount of any fee paid upon registration, and the length of time the player was at the club.

The terms of the new contracts offered to the player by each club are considered, then the player’s playing record is looked at, in terms of first-team appearances and international call-ups. Finally, interest shown by any other clubs is taken into account."

 

An example would be Charlie Taylor, he'd been with Leeds United since he was 9 years old, He'd made over 100 first team appearances for the club and represented England at U19 level. His final contract offer was between £15-18k per week by Cellino, he turned it down. WBA had enquired about a £6m transfer last January, Cellino turned it down (turned out the wrong decision). Burnley signed him on a free transfer and were told to pay £5m + performance related add ons and a sell on fee as compensation by the PFCC.

 

You can probably make an educated guess at the level of compensation which you would receive by comparing the two players playing records and contract offers. I would say around £1.5m with plenty of add ons.

My god I'm about to plus a JV post... I feel almost physically sick

 

Looking at past players of a similar caliber and reputation, £2m+ add-ons seems a more likely outcome... if I had to guess £2m - £3m would be about the figure we could expect currently, with anything closer to the £3m indicating we did very, very well for ourselves. 

Certainly the OP is right if we were to chuck him out on loan for first team games we'd increase the compo amount by a few hundred thousand, but he's definitely wrong that he would be a better option than Joao

[just visiting]

1 minute ago, StudentOwl said:

My god I'm about to plus a JV post... I feel almost physically sick

 

Looking at past players of a similar caliber and reputation, £2m+ add-ons seems a more likely outcome... if I had to guess £2m - £3m would be about the figure we could expect currently, with anything closer to the £3m indicating we did very, very well for ourselves. 

Certainly the OP is right if we were to chuck him out on loan for first team games we'd increase the compo amount by a few hundred thousand, but he's definitely wrong that he would be a better option than Joao

I doubt you'll gamble on a tribunal decision, they can go either way depending on which factor they value the most, if they go by his age, potential and lack of first team appearances, it could be less than £1m but loaded with add ons, which is a favourite of theirs.

 

Another one of ours,  Luke Garbutt, he was the same age as GH and with a similar playing record.

"The tribunal held yesterday came to the decision on compensation for the England Youth international, who joined Everton earlier in the summer.

Both clubs agreed that a figure would be set by a tribunal of the Professional Football Negotiating and Consultative Committee (PFCC), which is made up of representatives from the Football League, Premier League, PFA and Football Association.

The hearing, which took place at the Premier League's offices in London on Monday, declared that Everton should pay an initial £600,000, which could rise to over £1.5m due to various add-ons including appearances, honours and international caps."

 

LCFC have already express an interest at £2m, I would have an educated guess and say the club will sell in January for £2m ish.

[ruusowl]

Surely the compensation should also take into account the stupidly inflated transfer fees this window.

[StudentOwl]

18 minutes ago, ruusowl said:

Surely the compensation should also take into account the stupidly inflated transfer fees this window.

Why, it isn't a transfer? 

It's a player finishing his contract with us and signing for another club, a transfer involves the early termination of a contract. I'd imagine they will stick to the system they've been using for the last few years and not add a multiplier to youth fees just because the top clubs in the country are paying daft fees, as frustrating as that is

[Etchesketch]

Cant go on loan to an EFL club now until January

[Lawrie Madden]

2 hours ago, pazowl55 said:

We will find out soon enough. As the club will want it sorted one way or another before the transfer window re opens.

Expect him to sign a new contract anyway then go out on loan in January.

What are your expectations he'll sign based on ?

Not having a pop just interested as everything i've read re Hirst leads me to think that he'll leave but its just based on stuff i've read no insight other than that