Having slept on it

[0114]

If he stays the money spending has to be addressed, spent too much money on squad players. If he goes he will go with the best wishes of everyone. Right now we are in such a fantastic position, it won't be the end of the world if he stays or goes. 

[OwlLuke]

I guess another quick thing to mention is we were quite unlucky with injuries this season.

 

Missed out on Lee, Lees, Hooper, Forestieri, Hutchinson, and others at various points in the season.

 

With a bit more luck I think we would have had better performances and probably more points on the board.

[0114]

22 minutes ago, OwlLuke said:

Going to go against the grain here and say I'd like Carlos to be given another year.

 

He has the second best win ratio of any Wednesday manager in history, that record is going to be pretty tough to be matched by almost anyone. Therefore, if we do lose him, I think it is more likely at this stage we'd go backwards rather than forwards.

 

Despite play off heartbreak, we've improved under Carlos, from 12th to 6th to 4th. With more experience under our belt and a few new additions, I don't see why we can't be in for a shout of top 2 next season.

 

The way I see it Brighton have stayed faithful to their manager and it has paid off. Derby have sacked at every turn and got nowhere. 

 

As long as we're continuing to progress, then promotion will be getting closer with every season. And, we will probably be more 'Premier League' ready with every season, and not drop straight back down. I hope he stays. UTO

Hughton in his first full season matched the points of 2nd place and then this season came 2nd. Not the same as us and Derby not challenging for the top 2 which Brighton have done in both Hughtons season. 

[OwlLuke]

18 minutes ago, 1993swfc said:

Hughton in his first full season matched the points of 2nd place and then this season came 2nd. Not the same as us and Derby not challenging for the top 2 which Brighton have done in both Hughtons season. 

 

Brighton have however been pushing for promotion for 5 or so years now, so it took a while to get to that stage of pushing for autos. I think last season was their 3rd attempt at the playoffs in 4 years or something?

 

If we can push for autos in our 3rd 'serious attempt' at promotion then we would have done better than most. And personally, obviously not everyone would agree with me, but I think the best chance of autos is to keep Carlos and most of our players and build.

Edited May 18, 2017 by OwlLuke

[0114]

1 hour ago, OwlLuke said:

 

Brighton have however been pushing for promotion for 5 or so years now, so it took a while to get to that stage of pushing for autos. I think last season was their 3rd attempt at the playoffs in 4 years or something?

 

If we can push for autos in our 3rd 'serious attempt' at promotion then we would have done better than most. And personally, obviously not everyone would agree with me, but I think the best chance of autos is to keep Carlos and most of our players and build.

Brighton got in the play offs under poyet, lost to palace and got rid of him, replaced him with Hyppia and then almost went down before getting hughton! They took a step back to go forwards. So they didn't challenge under the same manager. 

[runningaround]

Continuity seems to count for a lot in this league. I would say a lot of our rivals are starting with new managers who want new players etc. We could steal a march and attempt to go up in the top 2 with a few key signings. For that reason I hope he stays. 

[RUMBELOWS91]

He's earned the right to try again (if he wants it) imo, but if things aren't going well by November time we should look to make the change- that would give any new man plenty of time.

 

We can be sure that Carlos will prepare the team well physically for the season- there's no harm in letting him have first crack at it.

 

 

[Ballmeist]

Since Christmas I've been saying that Carlos is the Championship version of Wenger. He has the ability to produce very attractive football, but when push comes to shove his teams will always fall short because he doesn't produce a team of winners. He's a nearly man.

[FreshOwl]

17 minutes ago, Ballmeist said:

Since Christmas I've been saying that Carlos is the Championship version of Wenger. He has the ability to produce very attractive football, but when push comes to shove his teams will always fall short because he doesn't produce a team of winners. He's a nearly man.

he's the championship version of mourinho more like

 

ultra defensive and parks the bus 

[Rhubarb n Custard]

12 hours ago, oh_weds_we_love_you said:

 

The ideal scenario is Carlos stays, find the right balance between season one and season two, and makes the necessary minor changes to the squad.

 

I'm not sure next season will be harder. The teams coming down have a big re-building job (and two are still up for sale) and may well all get new managers over the summer. None of them have the finance of Newcastle either! Villa, Norwich, Derby and Wolves should be fighting for promotion, but I don't think Huddersfield/Reading (whoever failed to go up) will have as good a season. Same goes for Leeds. We've also lost Brighton who are an excellent team. The teams coming up are probably of the quality of the teams going down, though we'll have the unpredictability of a Sheffield derby thrown in to the mix.

 

Assuming all goes as expected, I see the realistic challengers for the top 6 as follows;

 

Wednesday

Villa

Norwich

Derby

Wolves

Middlesbrough

Fulham

 

Unless I've missed something glaringly obvious I don't think that is any more difficult than this season.

Wolves?

No Hull or Sunderland ?

[dc88]

12 hours ago, DesWalker said:

We've gone from 13th to 6th then 4th under CC.

 

Bring a new man in and we start all over again.

 

The squad needs a bit of re-organisation and 2 or 3 key signings that's it.

 

He does however need to find a balance between his 2 seasons here though.  The attacking, free flowing football from his first season and the efficient, hard to beat style from this year.

 

literally nothing else needs to be said. may as well close owlstalk until 01 july.

[BC1867]

6 minutes ago, dc88 said:

 

literally nothing else needs to be said. may as well close owlstalk until 01 july.

 

Needs to address the weaknesses in the squad he has refused admit exist.

 

Needs to play to our players strengths rather than sledgehammer them into a system.

 

Rather a lot to be done and franklyou,  from what I have seen, not sure CC is up to it. 

 

Can't name a manager who could clearly do better so ...status quo

[Gingernuts]

5 hours ago, Holmes said:

 

I haven't been rude, mocking at worse.

 

I to was at Wembley, back in the 90's. I agree with people having opinions but just because they have them doesn't give them any credence.

 

My fear is that we will go into another spiral of sacking managers even before they have got their feet under the table, I don't consider two seasons is ample time to build a  decent squad.  For me, CC has proved that he has the ability to produce such a squad.

 

We can either take the Derby route and sack managers after the first set back or the Brighton route of being patient and building a squad, for me the answer a no brainer and we let CC go again.  As I have said before, I believe that CC will walk and that is because of the instant success demanded by the impatient fans (Talking about CC tenure).

 

My opinion has no more credence than anyone else's on here.

Holmes.  I have always enjoyed reading your posts. You talk sense in my opinion, and I very much respect your views.  I personally hate the "sack the Manager" culture and would love to have some long term stability at Sheffield 6.  What worries me is CC's track record.  Prior to joining us, he had been at 15 Clubs in 15 years, never been longer than 18 months at any of them, never achieved anything other than a short term boost in results, and then he endured a three year period on unemployment. Lovely bloke, but should we really entrust the next few years to someone with this background?  I really can't understand why we have spent so much money getting good forwards into the squad, and then play with such caution and negativity. We played 220 minutes of football against Huddersfield in the two legs, and managed to produce 13 attempts on goal - 3  on target. I could weep.    

[slinger208b]

12 hours ago, robowl4life said:

 

We needed that after Wembley though and arguably he failed to do that. He didn't sort our defence out which was glaringly obvious he needed to do for this season. He signed a few more centre midfielders to shoehorn in with Lee, Bazza and Hutch. This season he signed two wide men on loan with quality, pace and experience that should've been starting week in week out in Macca and Buckley but decides not to and continues (as of last night) to squeeze 3 centre mids into a 4 man midfield. Don't get me started on the rest of his transfers.

 

You don't know who was involved in aquiring the signings.

 

He was looking for and tried to get defenders but couldn't sign the players he wanted "within the parameters".

 

It seems pretty evident that the full picture is not there for all to see, maybe those times in interviews when he refused to talk about potential signings it was because he wasn't always privvy to all of the details...

 

[robowl4life]

11 minutes ago, slinger208b said:

 

You don't know who was involved in aquiring the signings.

 

He was looking for and tried to get defenders but couldn't sign the players he wanted "within the parameters".

 

It seems pretty evident that the full picture is not there for all to see, maybe those times in interviews when he refused to talk about potential signings it was because he wasn't always privvy to all of the details...

 

 

Neither do you... All if's and maybes so my point still stands, he failed to sort our defence out, as in another centre back and full backs plain and simple.

 

However, IF that is the case it would explain his stubbornness not to play all of these players that have been brought in never to be seen. 

[slinger208b]

7 hours ago, robowl4life said:

 

Neither do you... All if's and maybes so my point still stands, he failed to sort our defence out, as in another centre back and full backs plain and simple.

 

However, IF that is the case it would explain his stubbornness not to play all of these players that have been brought in never to be seen. 

 

I'm not claiming to, just making sharing my outlook and belief that signing a defender wasn't  something he ignored but something he couldn't achieve.

 

If he'd signed a defender that wasn't up to the task there'd be plenty of moans about that...

Edited May 19, 2017 by slinger208b

[Lincs Owl]

Don't agree with op at all.  Bringing Rhodes in was an expensive mistake, as was Reach I think.  All clubs make those errors. 

We were wetting ourselves when they signed. 

Had we won the penalty lottery, the wrist slitters would still have found something to moan about.  

[Bluey9]

21 hours ago, ScrappyOwl said:

As much as I like Carlos the man I can't help but feel his tenure should be over.

He has had a budget and a squad that most championship managers could only dream of, but, has failed to mould a cohesive team with the ability to use pace,width,physicalityand 

skill in equal measure.

Many on this forum have been critical of Rhodes but can we honestly say that Carlos has played to his strengths,has he been given good service?Rhodes is a predatory 'fox in the box'

player, we should know this given the number of times he has scored against us in the past!Given the proper service he would have fired us into the premier league no doubt, instead he has been fed scraps for 4 months.Sadly him not wanting to take a penalty last night tells you everything about want has happened to him since his arrival.

I, for one, want our next manager to build a team around him, give him the service and then sit back and watch the net bulge.

Undoubtedly Carlos has suffered injury problems but for us to pin our hopes on having Hoops back in time for the play-offs was clutching at straws given his horrendous injury record.

Therefore where was plan B or C or D-well I'm afraid their wasn't, what we got was 3 centre midfielders shoehorned into the team, no width, no service to the front men and subsequently we were given the run around by a well organised athletic team but not a team of our quality.

Many comments have been made of our nervous crowd last night, well I suspect that the way we have played most of the season would explain that .I think if most of us were being honest we knew what was likely to happen.

In a nutshell, with the squad we have I really believe that any of Benitez,Houghton,Staam and Wagner would have got us promoted this season.

So for me it has to be goodbye to the lovely, charismatic Carlos-good luck my friend and thank you for all your efforts.  

 

 

That's probably the best and most thought out post I've ever read on here ! 

[oh_weds_we_love_you]

10 hours ago, billabongbilly said:

Wolves?

No Hull or Sunderland ?

 

Wolves were taken over last summer and have mega-money. They got their sh*t together the second half of the season, so a summer of heavy spending and I can see them up there.

 

Previously mentioned Hull and Sunderland (sorry if I'm repeating myself - I'll keep it brief!) - both are up for sale, both owners refused to invest last season due to being up for sale, so I suspect neither will invest this season whilst still both up for sale. Sunderland have a massive debt too - in excess of £120m.

[longreach]

23 hours ago, oh_weds_we_love_you said:

Agreed in that Carlos didn't utilise his squad properly - that squad should have been playing last seasons football.

 

However, I wonder if Carlos decided to try something different given last seasons exciting football ended in failure and he believed this more conservative style would win the day?

 

Love Carlos, but think he got the style wrong this season. I believe he'll step down and move back to his family in Portugal - and I wish him every success, happiness and say a massive thanks. A great man and an unbelievable character.

 

If he stays, he'll get my full support and I fully expect he'll change his football philosophy back to what we saw in the first season.

Then there's no reason for him to go then is there.