Reach or FF tomorrow night?

[Mr Mercury]

1 hour ago, BRADDO said:

I'd stick with same starting 11. We have so many options now its unreal. If players aren't cutting it then subs can be made much earlier / half time for example. The later introduction of Reach, Abdi and Macca was a sight to behold the other night and Brum couldn't live with it. Also Sasso deserves to start even if Lees is fit

Yes, me too. Can change it again if/when needed. I liked the earlier formation put up by Rob but why not go with same 11 after a 3-0 win. 

[ramone]

7 minutes ago, owlZfan84 said:

 

100%.

 

Carlos obviously saw it too, hence the change. And he was at game, just in case you were wondering.

 

Every attack that came down our left Morgan Fox was being doubled up on. A prime example was when Nsue hit the bar/post in the first half - when that ball came all the way over to the back stick FF should have been there helping out, but he was mooching back from halfway watching on.

 

I cant really comment pal. Mainly because I never saw it as an issue while I was there. Usually i'm the first to pick up on someone being lazy (its the one thing I hate in a footballer, there's no excuse for it) but I genuinely didn't see a problem with it at the time. I've not watched the game back nor have I watched the highlights. I'm just taking things on face value as I saw them.

 

I'm not calling you a liar at all, I'm sure this happened. Its just in my opinion, you play your best player in every match. You never see Messi missing a game for Barca or Sharp missing a game for Utd (LOL)...

[oh_weds_we_love_you]

10 minutes ago, steveger said:

 

This^, what's FF supposedly done wrong this time ? Had an unaffected game ? It happens and as someone else mentioned was more down to Birmingham's defence keeping him quiet more than anything, maybe FF is just this weeks scapegoat

 

For me, Forestieri was off it. Didn't create anything, didn't have a chance of his own, didn't track back and help Fox out, and threw his toys out when he was subbed (granted, I don't want players who are happy to be subbed, but you deal with disappointment in a more professional and respectful manner).

 

Reach added balance, helps out Fox, used the ball well, ran at the back four, played a key part in the 2nd goal that killed the game off, and scored the 3rd himself.

 

If Forestieri was told by Carlos to be pretty anonymous, then I take it back and Forestieri should start as he carried out the instructions from his manager, but I highly doubt they were the instructions to him. It was an average day at the office for Forestieri (which happens) and had Reach not grabbed his opportunity with both hands and more, I'd start again with Forestieri. Now it's up to Forestieri to win the starting place back (or Reach to have a bad day at the office).

 

Convinced Carlos will start with Forestieri though, and who can blame him - he's still our talisman and a match-winner.

[owlZfan84]

1 minute ago, ramone said:

I cant really comment pal. Mainly because I never saw it as an issue while I was there. Usually i'm the first to pick up on someone being lazy (its the one thing I hate in a footballer, there's no excuse for it) but I genuinely didn't see a problem with it at the time. I've not watched the game back nor have I watched the highlights. I'm just taking things on face value as I saw them.

 

I'm not calling you a liar at all, I'm sure this happened. Its just in my opinion, you play your best player in every match. You never see Messi missing a game for Barca or Sharp missing a game for Utd (LOL)...

 

I agree with you mate. That's why I think FF will start tomorrow night. He's still our talisman and match winner. Very harsh on Reach though, as I thought he was superb when he came on. That's the player we paid all that cash for, and it's great to see him starting to hit some form.

 

Our squad strength is utter madness though. 

 

It's wasn't all that long ago our midfield consisted of - 

 

JOC ---Miller---Coke---Soares.

 

URRRGH.

[Ash77]

3 hours ago, domSWFC said:

Both.

 

Reach on the right.

 

Or maybe fessi right, reach left for.more width against defensive compact teams coming for a point.

 

Eventually can see it either being fessi n rhodes up front with reach n hopefully macca wide, or we may end up selling fessi cos he looked very average and negative on the left vs brum

 

[oh_weds_we_love_you]

Just now, owlZfan84 said:

JOC ---Miller---Coke---Soares.

 

 

JOC on the wing! I think that, and Potter's hat-trick of abysmal corners, are the two most depressing things I've seen at Hillsborough for a long time!

[Savo]

1 hour ago, robswfc said:

we play 352 for part of most games, with Hutch moving back to receive the ball and lees/loovens going wider allowing the full backs to push up. so Carlos definitely thinks about it.. Problem at home this season has been simply that teams have played very defensively against us. And we don't make it easy for ourselves by putting players in positions where they're not able to use their talents effectively. We should be looking at attacking from the off rather than worrying too much about their attacking wide players, when its likely Blackburn will come here and leave 10 men behind the ball. Playing Forestieri short and Rhodes long with Winnall also there to head in crosses or win knockdowns will give their packed defence a lot to think about, hopefully too much. Bannan and Abdi will keep it tidy in the middle, and the full backs to bomb up and down. What's not to like?

 

 

We found it pretty tough going for 70 out of 90 mins on Friday. Fernando on the left didn't work. Reach on the left hasn't worked that well either

 

When Hutch does drop back it Leaves Bannan on his own in midfield,  which is what was happening on friday when they over ran us in the second half.  We couldn't get out.  FF has had some of his best games for us from the left, Huddersfield at home last year for example.

 

If we play Rhodes and Winnall we need to get the ball out wide and get crosses in, with FF in the middle we will again be too tempted to cut inside and we will be easy to defend against, like we have all season.  we can't rely on our fullbacks to put good crosses in because apart from that cross on friday Hunt has barely put a decent cross in the whole time hes been here.  

 

The way we play depends on the quality of our full backs and for the majority of the season they have been awful.  We can't rely on them for our creativity.  With our squad 442 is the only option,  we just don't have enough centre halves to play it for a sustained period and our fullbacks aren't good enough.  

[sweetsheri]

Says how far our squad has come when I'm not fussed which one starts...

 

FF is a good player but i don;t think he's the god like performer some on here think.

 

If he's firing then yes he should start on the left. If he's slightly off then we have options.

[owlZfan84]

Just now, oh_weds_we_love_you said:

 

JOC on the wing! I think that, and Potter's hat-trick of abysmal corners, are the two most depressing things I've seen at Hillsborough for a long time!

 

Dark, dark days.

 

 

 

[Dagmeister]

29 minutes ago, Dan™ said:

If ever a thread summed up Owlstalk, this seems to be a pretty good bet. No more than about a week ago Reach was useless and a waste of money, now we're discussing him replacing someone who most would agree has been our best signing in 15+ years 

 

I like Reach, but the position is FF's while the team are doing well. I don't agree with some pointing out his lack of tracking back since I'm pretty sure it is under instruction from Carlos to stay forward as an option for a quick out-ball. We all know that he's willing to be one of the hardest workers in the team so criticising him in that regard is uncalled for I think.

Reach far from useless in many people's eyes. FF had a terrific season last term - probably his best ever - which he's not replicated this season. It may be temporary but it might be too that he over performed last season and now he is more on a par with the £3m player that we reportedly paid for him. Time alone will tell.

 

I'll put my head on the block tho' and predict that in a year or two's time Reach will be a significantly more prized asset..

 

I hope that FF finds consistent top form again but at the moment in a 442 system it would be Reach out left for me. I'd also give Winall and Rhodes another outing together.

[19owl08]

How fickle people are!!! 

 

Before Friday most wanted Reach out. He comes on for 10 minutes, with full energy against a tiring team & patched up defence & suddenly he should play instead of FF? 

 

People are too quick to start a witch hunt when it comes to Fessi. He didn't want to go off, is that really a bad thing? Our play in the first 20 mins was the best in a long while & he was a big part of that. 

 

Reach needs to prove he deserves the spot. He had lots of opportunities & didn't take them. One 10 minute game doesn't change that.

 

 

Edited February 13, 2017 by Stainless1983

[ramone]

1 minute ago, owlZfan84 said:

 

I agree with you mate. That's why I think FF will start tomorrow night. He's still our talisman and match winner. Very harsh on Reach though, as I thought he was superb when he came on. That's the player we paid all that cash for, and it's great to see him starting to hit some form.

 

Our squad strength is utter madness though. 

 

It's wasn't all that long ago our midfield consisted of - 

 

JOC ---Miller---Coke---Soares.

 

URRRGH.

Yeah, very harsh on Reach. He had an impact on the game thats for sure. Had a big hand in the second and obviously got the third. I was harsh on him after the game. I said that apart from that, he did naff all. But, on reflection, he doesn't really have to anything else. That's a fantastic contribution. It's the best i;ve ever seen him play for us and it would be unfair to leave him out. 

 

I guess i'm just not totally sold on him yet. That and given the fact he cost me money by scoring that goal, I think i'm just holding a grudge... 

 

And why did you have to put that midfield in here (see bold), I've spent 4 years trying to erase them from my memory!! 

[owlZfan84]

Just now, Stainless1983 said:

How fickle people are!!! 

 

Before Friday most wanted Reach out. He comes on for 10 minutes, with full energy against a tiring team & patched up defence & suddenly he should play instead of FF? 

 

People are too quick to start a witch hunt when it comes to Fessi. He didn't want to go off, is that really a bad thing? Our play in the first 20 mins was the best in a long while & he was a big part of that. 

 

Reach needs to prove he he deserves the spot. He had lots of opportunities & didn't take them. One 10 minute game doesn't change that.

 

 

 

Ahhh, fickle and witch hunt.

 

I did wonder how long it'd take.

[Holmowl]

2 minutes ago, owlZfan84 said:

 

Ahhh, fickle witch hunt.

 

 

 

Hunt is better at RB.

[19owl08]

1 minute ago, owlZfan84 said:

 

Ahhh, fickle and witch hunt.

 

I did wonder how long it'd take.

 

Ahh wondered how long it would be for someone to make a smart comment but not actually have anything productiveness to say.

[Dagmeister]

39 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said:

 

We have some incredibly fickle fans. 

 

Only a a few weeks back after the Huddersfield game, the mood was great. We'd found a great partnership in FF/Winnall, Mcmanaman was amazing and had to play ahead of Wallace, but Reach needed dropping. 

 

Couple of iffy away games and it's doom and gloom.

 

Now after beating a depleted Birmingham side, we're amazing and finally found the answer, FF is apparently a winger but should be dropped for Reach, and Wallace is a nailed on starter.

 

I can't keep up.

 

 

Depleted or not Birmingham look to be turning the corner and looked pretty decent to me on Friday. You could equally argue that we were depleted without Lee and Lees.We all know that FF is not an out and out winger but I think it would be wrong not to give Friday's pairing up front another start. Given that it'll likely be 442 tomorrow then that leaves FF vying with Reach for left midfield with Fox overlapping. I think that Reach is a better bet at the moment there but would be happy for FF to hit the straps again and make life difficult for Reach (and Carlos).

[owlZfan84]

2 minutes ago, Stainless1983 said:

 

Ahh wondered how long it would be for someone to make a smart comment but not actually have anything productiveness to say.

 

[areNOTwhatTHEYseem]

3 minutes ago, Stainless1983 said:

How fickle people are!!! 

 

Before Friday most wanted Reach out. He comes on for 10 minutes, with full energy against a tiring team & patched up defence & suddenly he should play instead of FF? 

 

People are too quick to start a witch hunt when it comes to Fessi. He didn't want to go off, is that really a bad thing? Our play in the first 20 mins was the best in a long while & he was a big part of that. 

 

Reach needs to prove he deserves the spot. He had lots of opportunities & didn't take them. One 10 minute game doesn't change that.

 

 

Reach has looked good when played on the left of midfield all season to me. He tracks back, covers the ground better than anyone else in our team, and has shown some quality on the ball. The thing that he's lacked more than anything is confidence by the look of things - the final ball or shot has often left a lot to be desired.

 

The debate in this thread is an interesting one, as Forestieri has been playing upfront most of the season, and looking more comfortable than he did on the left against Birmingham in most cases. For the most part, it's not been a question of Forestieri or Reach, but a question of Forestieri or Fletcher, Hooper, João or Nuhiu. Maybe neither Forestieri nor Reach deserve to be dropped, but the same could be said of Winnall and Rhodes after Friday's game. It's a good problem to have.

[nevthelodgemoorowl]

Nando is often nullified by the opposites doubling up on him and he may fail to shine. However, space opens up in other areas of the pitch for us to exploit.

[IstillhateSteveBould]

6 minutes ago, Dagmeister said:

Depleted or not Birmingham look to be turning the corner and looked pretty decent to me on Friday. You could equally argue that we were depleted without Lee and Lees.We all know that FF is not an out and out winger but I think it would be wrong not to give Friday's pairing up front another start. Given that it'll likely be 442 tomorrow then that leaves FF vying with Reach for left midfield with Fox overlapping. I think that Reach is a better bet at the moment there but would be happy for FF to hit the straps again and make life difficult for Reach (and Carlos).

 

I think we're in a great position with our forwards. Any 2 from 3 and I'd be confident going into most games. If it's Rhodes/Winnall again, great.

 

Put it this way, if FF is on the bench Tuesday, it will be the first time we can look at the teamsheet without thinking "oh ffs we're gonna struggle without him".