IstillhateSteveBould Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 3 minutes ago, Holmowl said: By contrast, sadly Lucas has shown so far nothing to suggest he is a goalscorer. Six goals in 48 league matches says an awful lot. 7 in his first 20 appearances suggests he can score goals. Of course you'll choose to ignore that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmowl Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 2 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: 7 in his first 20 appearances suggests he can score goals. Of course you'll choose to ignore that. It did suggest he could. But one in 31 since cannot be ignored either. I am very happy to have him around. We did really well in the games he has played this season, so he is no liability. But equally he is a distance behind Hooper,Fletch and FF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1867 Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 15 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: He had 7 by this time last season. And the bolded bit also applies to Hooper. And he's scored once since? Are you genuinely watching Joao play and thinking he is a good player? Do you think Joao is a player good enough to be in a promotion chasing team? Id have been over the moon with him 5/6 years ago but not under the current circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manila_Owl Posted December 28, 2016 Author Share Posted December 28, 2016 Don't see how he can be defended. Seem to be clinging on to that faint hope that he will emulate the lucky purple patch he had last season. We owe the guy nothing, he's a football player and not a very good one at that. He has had 18 months and in that time FF, Fletcher and Hooper have shown themselves to be more than capable. If he was showing signs of improvement I could argue he be kept, but he is going backwards. The two 'shots' against Rotherham in front of Kop (the second brought some chuckles for fans around me) show a guy who is surplus to requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marconi Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 On 26/12/2016 at 23:49, aeroswfc said: He'll cone good. Working for Amey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asteener1867 Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 You can't wait forever for "Someone to come good", He hasn't performed this season, and sadly thats what it has to come down to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 42 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: He had 7 by this time last season. And the bolded bit also applies to Hooper. I'm struggling to understand your thinking on Hooper: he's scored a goal for every 172 minutes of Championship football he's played for our club, making him our most deadly striker by some distance. Why would him playing regularly mean we wouldn't go up? I for one am looking forward to Hooper's return now that our midfield shape has been addressed and we're starting to carve out decent chances on a more frequent basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 27 minutes ago, David1867 said: And he's scored once since? Are you genuinely watching Joao play and thinking he is a good player? Do you think Joao is a player good enough to be in a promotion chasing team? Id have been over the moon with him 5/6 years ago but not under the current circumstances. Believe me, I'm not watching Joao and thinking he's a world beater. He's an incredibly frustrating player at times and there are many areas of his game that need improvement. But I am watching us as a team with Joao in the side, and he helps the team in certain ways the likes of Hooper, Nuhiu and even Fletcher can't. Of course they have their attributes that help us in other ways. But my personal opinion is that Joao's attributes are generally more useful over the course of a game. People focus way too much on simple stats imo. Hooper averaging a goal every 140 odd minutes means absolutely jack bobbar if him being in the team hurts the dynamic and we struggle to get results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S36 OWL Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 He`s had a season and a half here now ,and to be honest i cant see him making it . I just think the British game is too much for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 28 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: I'm struggling to understand your thinking on Hooper: he's scored a goal for every 172 minutes of Championship football he's played for our club, making him our most deadly striker by some distance. Why would him playing regularly mean we wouldn't go up? I for one am looking forward to Hooper's return now that our midfield shape has been addressed and we're starting to carve out decent chances on a more frequent basis. Because I think he disrupts the balance of the team. Thats more important than 1 player's goal tally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debram Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 14 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: Believe me, I'm not watching Joao and thinking he's a world beater. He's an incredibly frustrating player at times and there are many areas of his game that need improvement. But I am watching us as a team with Joao in the side, and he helps the team in certain ways the likes of Hooper, Nuhiu and even Fletcher can't. Of course they have their attributes that help us in other ways. But my personal opinion is that Joao's attributes are generally more useful over the course of a game. People focus way too much on simple stats imo. Hooper averaging a goal every 140 odd minutes means absolutely jack bobbar if him being in the team hurts the dynamic and we struggle to get results. he is not good enough, would he have given any more to the team at newcastle had he played, no, is he the way forward at this critical stage of the campaign, no, is he making good progress as a player, no, will he be premiership standard, no, cash in now and put the money towards a quality full back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 3 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: Because I think he disrupts the balance of the team. Thats more important than 1 player's goal tally. Fair enough. We'll have to agree to disagree on that first point, though. For me, Hooper offers a lot more to our team than João, and I reckon Carlos will continue to choose Hooper ahead of João when they're both fit, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debram Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 7 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: Because I think he disrupts the balance of the team. Thats more important than 1 player's goal tally. most of us imagine hooper coming back will give us another dimension in the goal scoring department and link up play so optimism there, what do we imagine joao contributing, for me pure frustration, get rid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IstillhateSteveBould Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 1 minute ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: Fair enough. We'll have to agree to disagree on that first point, though. For me, Hooper offers a lot more to our team than João, and I reckon Carlos will continue to choose Hooper ahead of João when they're both fit, too. I honestly don't think Carlos sees any of Hooper, Fletcher and Joao ahead of each other. He'll play whoever he feels will help the team the most depending on the opposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darra Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 (edited) 3 hours ago, TheGodfather said: I think, if we can bring another striker in (which I think we need to), then sending Joao out to get some games in L1 would be a good idea. For me, there's nothing he brings to the table at the minute that we don't already get from another player in the squad...and they do it better. He needs confidence. He needs some good coaching. And he needs minutes on the pitch in a competitive environment. A loan until the end of the season makes sense. Think he'd get eaten alive in L1 it would be too physical for him he'd get bullied. Strange as it sounds I think he'd gain more in the Premiership. Edited December 28, 2016 by darra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David1867 Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 8 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: I honestly don't think Carlos sees any of Hooper, Fletcher and Joao ahead of each other. He'll play whoever he feels will help the team the most depending on the opposition. It will become clear over the next few weeks about who if any he prefers. If rumours are correct that we are after signing another striker, surely this will spell bad news for Joao. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Past Member Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 1 hour ago, David1867 said: And he's scored once since? Are you genuinely watching Joao play and thinking he is a good player? Do you think Joao is a player good enough to be in a promotion chasing team? Id have been over the moon with him 5/6 years ago but not under the current circumstances. With him starting we've gained 2 points per game, easily play off from, maybe autos. Without him starting, we've gained 1.6 per game, borderline play offs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
areNOTwhatTHEYseem Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 (edited) 14 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said: I honestly don't think Carlos sees any of Hooper, Fletcher and Joao ahead of each other. He'll play whoever he feels will help the team the most depending on the opposition. Yeah, you're right there. Maybe what I should have said is that I reckon Carlos will continue to choose Hooper as the best option to help the team beat our opponents more frequently than João. Edited December 28, 2016 by areNOTwhatTHEYseem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Past Member Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 3 minutes ago, areNOTwhatTHEYseem said: Yeah, you're right there. Maybe what I should have said is that I reckon Carlos will continue to choose Hooper as the best option to help the team beat our opponents more frequently than João. We've beat on the opposites, more frequently with Joao in the team, than with Hooper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
owlandished Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 (edited) We are currently on our best run - five wins in six games, nine goals, four clean sheets In those six games, Joao has on average played just over 70% of all minutes available, and Hooper has played zero Has Joao contributed despite not scoring? Obviously yes. Has Hooper? No, he's been unavailable, but he is our most natural goal scorer Will the manager keep both in the squad and will they play a part in the second half of the season, no one knows. But it would make sense to do so, if he can Edited December 28, 2016 by owlandished Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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