A much needed three points..............but

[Salmonbones]

53 minutes ago, vulva said:

We are far too open for a promotion winning side. Flair will not get you promotion. We are getting away with it at the minute as we are playing bottom half teams.  

 

You got a neg for that and to be honest, I disagreed with you until I thought about it.   Actually you are right but not totally.

 

I think we've been very unlucky in at least 2 games so far - VERY unlucky   

 

I actually think the flair is being taken away from some players this season, lets say Wallace as a single example  - he's no where near what he was last season thus far.   Being honest, Bannan too.   I am wondering if expectation and the money spent in pre season is having some effect, because I expected better given far less upheaval than last season.

[Mick De Lyons]

41 minutes ago, salmonbones said:

 

You got a neg for that and to be honest, I disagreed with you until I thought about it.   Actually you are right but not totally.

 

I think we've been very unlucky in at least 2 games so far - VERY unlucky   

 

I actually think the flair is being taken away from some players this season, lets say Wallace as a single example  - he's no where near what he was last season thus far.   Being honest, Bannan too.   I am wondering if expectation and the money spent in pre season is having some effect, because I expected better given far less upheaval than last season.

I think that the main reason for Bannan is because of where he is playing this season, ie, in front of the back four or roving in front of the back four, instead of playing further upfield as he did last season. He is essentially doing a similar role to that of Hutchinson last season and it doesn't suit him as well.

[nevthelodgemoorowl]

I think a good few of our players are overdoing it with their efforts as they are conscious of the feeling that they owe the fans one.

 

It's all there but spasmodic, going behind creates tension which detracts from our performances, but think even with this burden of the times we have come from behind.

 

I'm sure Carlos is on top of the problem and our play will become less tense and we will start to roll and rock !  

[gurujuan]

Just watching Match of the Day and listening to them talking about Manchester United. How having a defensive player sat in front of their back four allows their creative players to do what they do best, create. It also allows their full backs to get forward and create the width. I can't help feeling, a similar approach would pay dividends for us, and release the shackles from our big game players. We are making life unneccesarilly difficult for ourselves.

[Mick De Lyons]

37 minutes ago, nevthelodgemoorowl said:

I think a good few of our players are overdoing it with their efforts as they are conscious of the feeling that they owe the fans one.

 

It's all there but spasmodic, going behind creates tension which detracts from our performances, but think even with this burden of the times we have come from behind.

 

I'm sure Carlos is on top of the problem and our play will become less tense and we will start to roll and rock !  

Definitely. The expectation has increased and as you say, the team think they owe the fans for Wembley. All that increases the pressures and that's where the mistakes or not playing with enough freedom and confidence comes in.

[IstillhateSteveBould]

4 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

Just watching Match of the Day and listening to them talking about Manchester United. How having a defensive player sat in front of their back four allows their creative players to do what they do best, create. It also allows their full backs to get forward and create the width. I can't help feeling, a similar approach would pay dividends for us, and release the shackles from our big game players. We are making life unneccesarilly difficult for ourselves.

 

Definitely. We had Hutch or Lopez playing that role last season, even though we were technically a 442. Bannan doesn't look as comfortable doing it. 

[gurujuan]

31 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said:

 

Definitely. We had Hutch or Lopez playing that role last season, even though we were technically a 442. Bannan doesn't look as comfortable doing it. 

 

Bannan doesn't have the defensive nous to play there, and quite frankly, it's a waste of his talents

[owler66]

2 hours ago, Mick De Lyons said:

And there's always a " but " isn't there !!

 

Overall, today was a much needed three points, especially after the disappointment of last weeks result. We were the better side and Forest looked quite average, apart from one or two periods in the game, notably just after they scored and towards the end. We never really looked in trouble or were overly pressured, but the performance at times was a bit stop start and not particularly fluid. We certainly didn't deserve to lose a game like that and if anyone deserved to win it, then it was us. However, through out the game, there where a fair few issues that i'd like to raise. I'm not saying that they are new issues, but one's that we seem to keep repeating and they don't seem to be getting addressed as quickly as they should be in my opinion.

 

We seem to set off too slowly in games. We appear to play at a slow tempo until we are forced into action. The tempo of the second half was noticeably quicker than in the first half. I don't think the 4-4-2 formation suits us when we don't have any natural wingers playing. The midfield is too easy to bypass at times because of this. We seem to pass for the sake of passing at times. There were quite a few opportunities to play the ball into a forward position today, but many times the safe option was preferred of passing the ball backwards. Now, i don't mind playing a ball backwards under pressure, but at times today, particularly in the first half, the ball was moving sideways and backwards, when there were opportunities to play it forward for an attack. It seems as if we are almost looking for the perfect pass and don't want to risk a forward pass in case we loose possession.

 

On quite a few occasions today, Wallace as an example got into a position to cross or take his man on or step inside and chose to play the ball back. When you add this kind of play style to the fact that at times we can look a pedestrian, it becomes quite predictable for the opposition to work out what we are doing. Also, at times the movement was a bit static and loose passes were given. All this improved in the second half. The tempo increased, the ball was moved a lot quicker, the movement was better and as the game wore on we were getting better service on the wings as Reach moved up a little further. Obviously, Forest like a of teams this season have set up a certain way to try and get a result. They sit back, flood the midfield and try to hit us on the counter attack. It was a good strike for their goal, but they didn't look particularly threatening and perhaps came for a point.

 

On the plus side, we showed great spirit to come back, particularly when we lost both Lees and Bannan. Adam Reach showed today that he will be a real force down that left hand side for us. He has pace, looks to go forward, can see a pass and delivers a good cross. He also has technical ability as well. Kieran Lee is an unsung player, who has a tremendous impact on the team and is one of the best finishers. He took his second goal superbly and always looks calm and assured on the ball. Today was a much needed three points, but i still think Carlos doesn't yet know his best eleven or the right formation to play. However, it certainly made up for the disappointment of the last injury time loss of last weekend, that's for sure :-)

 

Thoughts ?

 

It would take me a week to type that much 

[IstillhateSteveBould]

7 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

 

Bannan doesn't have the defensive nous to play there, and quite frankly, it's a waste of his talents

 

I agree.

[torryowl]

2 hours ago, gurujuan said:

 

I think the idea would have been to sign someone better

go on tell me who's better than hutch and lees who we could sign .......

[gurujuan]

32 minutes ago, torryowl said:

go on tell me who's better than hutch and lees who we could sign .......

 

Well after we missed out on Hanley, there wasn't anyone of the right quality available. That's why we decided to bring Sasso back, to give us a bit of cover. I suspect we might try again in January for someone.

[torryowl]

1 minute ago, gurujuan said:

 

Well after we missed out on Hanley, there wasn't anyone of the right quality available. That's why we decided to bring Sasso back, to give us a bit of cover. I suspect we might try again in January for someone.

do you really think hanley is better than hutch and lees ?

[gurujuan]

32 minutes ago, torryowl said:

do you really think hanley is better than hutch and lees ?

 

Yeah, Id say he's as good. The fact that he's better at some aspects, would make him the ideal partner for either

[torryowl]

6 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

 

Yeah, Id say he's as good. The fact that he's better at some aspects, would make him the ideal partner for either

what aspects ?.......i really havnt seen as  much of hanley as you have but if he's as good as our two he must be very good

Edited September 24, 2016 by torryowl

[gurujuan]

30 minutes ago, torryowl said:

what aspects ?.......i really havnt as  seen much of hanley as you have but if he's as good as our two he must be very good

 

For a start he's primarily left footed, so would be a natural fit with either Lees, or Hutchinson. Also, he's much better in the air than any of our current defenders, and is a good leader, very vocal, and that's something we lack. Most importantly though, I guess Carlos thought he was a good fit, or he wouldn't have been prepared to go to £4m to try and get him. That's a lot of money for us to consider paying for a defender. A shame we missed out, but once Newcastle decided they wanted him, we never really had a chance.

[Mick De Lyons]

39 minutes ago, owler66 said:

It would take me a week to type that much 

I'm a genius...what can i say ☺

[Mick De Lyons]

43 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

 

Bannan doesn't have the defensive nous to play there, and quite frankly, it's a waste of his talents

That's true. Bannan is always more affective when he plays further up the field.

[Mick De Lyons]

48 minutes ago, IstillhateSteveBould said:

 

Definitely. We had Hutch or Lopez playing that role last season, even though we were technically a 442. Bannan doesn't look as comfortable doing it. 

I agree.

[torryowl]

2 minutes ago, gurujuan said:

 

For a start he's primarily left footed, so would be a natural fit with either Lees, or Hutchinson. Also, he's much better in the air than any of our current defenders, and is a good leader, very vocal, and that's something we lack. Most importantly though, I guess Carlos thought he was a good fit, or he wouldn't have been prepared to go to £4m to try and get him. That's a lot of money for us to consider paying for a defender. A shame we missed out, but once Newcastle decided they wanted him, we never really had a chance.

what he cost isnt important we spent 4 million on abdi and he struggles to get a game .......i dont know how good he is in the air but i dont think lees or hutch are lacking in that department , if you think its worth spending 4 million on someone who's good at shouting very loudly then i think we differ on what ideas we have of good players .

[Mick De Lyons]

4 minutes ago, torryowl said:

what he cost isnt important we spent 4 million on abdi and he struggles to get a game .......i dont know how good he is in the air but i dont think lees or hutch are lacking in that department , if you think its worth spending 4 million on someone who's good at shouting very loudly then i think we differ on what ideas we have of good players .

He mentioned a lot more attributes than the ability to simply shout loudly.