GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) reply to guru.. but you cant second guess how good a manager is gonna be in a future season.. impossible. they will decide how good he is based on how good hes doing when hes got the squad he wants, your basically saying lets find out about the manager before next season by borrowing players that wont be here next season! we could finish 7th with your new forwards you wanted, - ace it means we got the right manager!! but what about next season when were 15th in oct? trust him cos of this years 7th place finish? sorry but you can change your manager ANYTIME during the season, even wait till a really good one becomes available! but only 2 windows for players each year. Edited February 18, 2015 by GY-owl.4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wilyfox Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 they will decide how good he is based on how good hes doing when hes got the squad he wants I doubt that. He'll likely be judged on how well he's done with what he's got. Managers never have the squad they want - they always want better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 reply to guru.. but you cant second guess how good a manager is gonna be in a future season.. impossible. they will decide how good he is based on how good hes doing when hes got the squad he wants, your basically saying lets find out about the manager before next season by borrowing players that wont be here next season! we could finish 7th with your new forwards you wanted, - ace it means we got the right manager!! but what about next season when were 15th in oct? trust him cos of this years 7th place finish? sorry but you can change your manager ANYTIME during the season, even wait till a really good one becomes available! but only 2 windows for players each year. But you see my point, Gray needs to give himself the best opportunity to make the case for him to take us forward At the moment, there are as many questions as answers. Sure it's not ideal when he hasn't had the resources, but he has had the opportunity to bring in six new players, which you assume would have covered the departments in which we were lacking. Maybe he feels he's done that, and here I am second guessing, but the squad still looks very unbalanced to me. At the end of the day, it's his job that will be on the line, but as one of those who've admired what he's done with the defensive side of our game, I'm concerned that he might not get the chance to finish the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I doubt that. He'll likely be judged on how well he's done with what he's got. Managers never have the squad they want - they always want better. not if you have anything to do with it, your on 'borrow all the best players available mode' but your right, based on what hes got... and weve been skint for ages hence hes never got what he wanted.. and he may always want a better squad, he gonna get that chance in the summer, i guess thats when the real judgement will start. not now, and not propped up by other teams players when there is nowt to play for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 But you see my point, Gray needs to give himself the best opportunity to make the case for him to take us forward At the moment, there are as many questions as answers. Sure it's not ideal when he hasn't had the resources, but he has had the opportunity to bring in six new players, which you assume would have covered the departments in which we were lacking. Maybe he feels he's done that, and here I am second guessing, but the squad still looks very unbalanced to me. At the end of the day, it's his job that will be on the line, but as one of those who've admired what he's done with the defensive side of our game, I'm concerned that he might not get the chance to finish the job. as all i know is that these owners WANNA GET to the PL, and even they will think its not gonna happen this year. yeah they could protect him and make him look good by propping up his squad with quality loans. as you say, lets see how good he is..... but with what hes got, cos that has the double bonus of seeing how good the players are at the same time. they may be minted but do they wanna waste good money now for the sake of 4 or 5 league positions? doubtful. save it for a real assault next yr... use this season to learn categorically one way or t'other, about the strikers we have... thread after thread after thread saying hes poo, hes ace, hes poo, hes ace, i dont wanna go through this next season, lets sort it now so next season we know whos poo (an been sold) and we know WHAT WE NEED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wilyfox Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 not if you have anything to do with it, your on 'borrow all the best players available mode' You are defending a manager that would happily contradict you, given the opportunity. If Gray was offered Wood and Paterson tomorrow, I bet he'd grab them with both hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagmeister Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) Judging by the four permanent signings made recently it looks like we're looking to the longer term rather than short term fixes. I doubt that this has been done without tacit approval at least from the new owners. If the spectre relegation started to become a real issue I've no doubt that significant funds would be made available for emergency loans to remedy the slide; reluctantly probably too. Barring emergencies I'd expect that one wide player is all we're looking for but I doubt that we're looking to blow too much even on this. Edited February 18, 2015 by Dagmeister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 You are defending a manager that would happily contradict you, given the opportunity. If Gray was offered Wood and Paterson tomorrow, I bet he'd grab them with both hands. but i havent once said SG doesnt wanna make signings!!! ive got my swfc/owners hat on, i want whats best for this club and this team next season, not whats best for SG or stevie May or Lavery or Nuhiu or Bus, or fans that cant see past the here & now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wilyfox Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 but i havent once said SG doesnt wanna make signings!!! ive got my swfc/owners hat on, i want whats best for this club and this team next season, not whats best for SG or stevie May or Lavery or Nuhiu or Bus, or fans that cant see past the here & now. You've said that we should go with what we've got and be judged accordingly - but Gray wants better, and knows he'll be judged on results and performances, regardless; so he's quite right to want the best he can get in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest totemowl Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 as all i know is that these owners WANNA GET to the PL, and even they will think its not gonna happen this year. yeah they could protect him and make him look good by propping up his squad with quality loans. as you say, lets see how good he is..... but with what hes got, cos that has the double bonus of seeing how good the players are at the same time. they may be minted but do they wanna waste good money now for the sake of 4 or 5 league positions? doubtful. save it for a real assault next yr... use this season to learn categorically one way or t'other, about the strikers we have... thread after thread after thread saying hes poo, hes ace, hes poo, hes ace, i dont wanna go through this next season, lets sort it now so next season we know whos poo (an been sold) and we know WHAT WE NEED. There's a difference between thinking it won't happen and trying to make it happen. There's a difference between coasting to the end of the season and trying to achieve the best possible finish. That difference is a winning mentality and if we can develop that and take it into and then through the next season we'll be in a much stronger position. It also helps put bums on seats and sell season tickets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurujuan Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 as all i know is that these owners WANNA GET to the PL, and even they will think its not gonna happen this year. yeah they could protect him and make him look good by propping up his squad with quality loans. as you say, lets see how good he is..... but with what hes got, cos that has the double bonus of seeing how good the players are at the same time. they may be minted but do they wanna waste good money now for the sake of 4 or 5 league positions? doubtful. save it for a real assault next yr... use this season to learn categorically one way or t'other, about the strikers we have... thread after thread after thread saying hes poo, hes ace, hes poo, hes ace, i dont wanna go through this next season, lets sort it now so next season we know whos poo (an been sold) and we know WHAT WE NEED. The problem is, if we carry on like this, and we do finish 16th or lower, then I simply couldn't see the new owners entrusting Stu with next season's campaign. Having seen what he's done so far, I like most of us, would like to see what he could achieve with decent backing. However, even I have my doubts, mainly because of the attacking side of our game is so dire. That is me, a lifelong supporter, and one who's been used to seeing cr@p for years. What will someone who's just come in from Thailand, and who's taken on the club as a business venture think? I suspect that they will be a lot more ruthless, and if they don't see signs that Gray is getting the attacking side of our game right, I think he'll be axed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 You've said that we should go with what we've got and be judged accordingly - but Gray wants better, and knows he'll be judged on results and performances, regardless; so he's quite right to want the best he can get in. judged accordingly means taking into account he has never spent proper money on his team, so sights might not be set too high for this yr remaining. slide down and it may cause alarm but finish 10th 14th with what he has while continuing to impress defensively may be enough for the new owner.. im sure SG is correct from his own point of view to want better in to help himself in his job... but that doesnt mean its right for our club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 There's a difference between thinking it won't happen and trying to make it happen. There's a difference between coasting to the end of the season and trying to achieve the best possible finish. That difference is a winning mentality and if we can develop that and take it into and then through the next season we'll be in a much stronger position. It also helps put bums on seats and sell season tickets. who said owt about coasting? who said not trying to achieve the best available finish? this team has had us in the top 10 for 9/10ths of the season and thats with the strikers misfiring.. i want us to go hell for leather with 4 young strikers chomping at the bit to show that they are the one to stay next year, alongside a top signing or on the bench cos we buy 2, young lads playing for their future is better than a depressed star thats left his prem dream to come to finish our dead end season with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 There's far too many people been far too casual about our league position, if we was bang in mid table security i would totally understand people saying why waste money for the sake of a few league positions but we are not safe by a long shot, if we can't pick our league form up we could be in genuine trouble in 3 games time I think SG has been stubborn, for me I suspect he's held out for an unavailable Chris Wood on loan for the majority of the season and I've always said Jamie Paterson is the winger he wants despite denying it initially he admitted to enquiring before the last window shut but again wasnt available, the only other winger he chased was Matty phillips which i always thought was very unrealistic All 3 very good players, as is Lewis McGugan who eventually signed but do we think there would have been a plan B if it had fell through ? Question im asking really is how long should we hold out for these players before considering suitable alternatives , which theres been more than a few of Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Never understood the term 2nd guess. Why not just say guess. sorry i meant to plus you.... chuckled me did that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 occasionally, even a blind squirrel will find an acorn...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest totemowl Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 who said owt about coasting? who said not trying to achieve the best available finish? this team has had us in the top 10 for 9/10ths of the season and thats with the strikers misfiring.. i want us to go hell for leather with 4 young strikers chomping at the bit to show that they are the one to stay next year, alongside a top signing or on the bench cos we buy 2, young lads playing for their future is better than a depressed star thats left his prem dream to come to finish our dead end season with us. Seems to me we're coasting if not worse with these '4 young strikers chomping at the bit'. And who said anything about getting in 'a depressed star...'. We do our best to get players who can shift us up a couple of gears now, and then we'll find out which of our existing players can cope at that new level of performance. As I said, if it works, we also get other benefits. If it doesn't, we've learnt a lot More about what we need to do, before next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Lambert/wood not been mentioned then? yeah they would be DELIGHTED to leave their current clubs to come here an play for us at the scrag end of this season im sure... reyt class dismissed for the day, im proper bored of explaining the obvious now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest totemowl Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Lambert/wood not been mentioned then? yeah they would be DELIGHTED to leave their current clubs to come here an play for us at the scrag end of this season im sure... reyt class dismissed for the day, im proper bored of explaining the obvious now. Aye. Pick your toys up before you go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GY-owl.4 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Aye. Pick your toys up before you go. am i the one crying for more more more players now now now? nah i dint think so, only need to read the thread to realise who's toys are out the pram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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