Plonk Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 well things have certainly changed since burton left. Ive read (albeit on here) several times that DJ is rarely on the training ground. So its not unreasonable to draw conclusions if thats the case. Dont know a deal about Wilkinson but results and performances say hes not really doing a good job ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesteel Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Yes, that's pretty much exactly what I said isn't it? I've hardly amassed nearly 20,000 posts on a football forum without the occasional opinion on football matters have I? Pretty much every post you make is scoffing at the nature of football fans. I'm not really sure what point it is you're trying to make though other than that fans are reactionary but that will never change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJMortimer Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Pretty much every post you make is scoffing at the nature of football fans. I'm not really sure what point it is you're trying to make though other than that fans are reactionary but that will never change. Pretty much every one of 19,000+ !? No wonder some posters reckon I'm boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesteel Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 (edited) Youre just being picky to deflect the point. I meant in the last few weeks as the pressure has heated up on Jones and its true Managers will always be the experts, but its impossible for the fans not to form simplistic opinions on even the best of them. Edited December 13, 2012 by Bluesteel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJMortimer Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Pretty much every post you make is scoffing at the nature of football fans. I'm not really sure what point it is you're trying to make though other than that fans are reactionary but that will never change. Of course fans are reactionary - every last one of them to one degree or another. And you're right that it will never change. But there is a difference between a short-term response to something in the heat of the moment and maintaining that kind of outlook indefinitely. Someone cursing that the latest disappointment is the last straw and that they'll never go again is one thing but some of the fantasy, nonsense and abuse Jones has persistently been subjected to are quite another. Many of those preaching the virtues of the 4-4-2 formation or complaining that we have a right footed centre back on the left would be quickly reaching for cliches and accepted wisdom when asked to explain themselves in any greater depth. Most of us recognise our frustrated grumblings for what they really are (and I'm certainly not claiming I have any easy answers either) but others are entirely and aggressively earnest about them. Fans have demanded two up front, Johnson and Antonio on the wings, Llera in, Llera out, Mayor, Lee and Corry to be tried and the manager has responded. But then when this has done nothing to address the tide of negative results, it's the very fact that he's changing things at all that is highlighted. It's like trying to fence in a cloud sometimes. Many supporters prefer the illusion of football as a simple and predictable game rather than confront the elephant in the room that much of it is subject to the infinite vagaries of chance and circumstance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluesteel Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 (edited) That's fair enough DJ, I misunderstood and thought you were commenting on fans more generally and the validity of their comments and opinions vs experts and managers etc. I think that although its laughable at times and I have done if too, its part of the game in a way, sometimes for the worse but also for the better. I think what you're saying about some fans having made up their minds to hate the manager is true and the abuse is too much, i think its in a minority though. Given the extremity of the situation and how puzzling it is has a lot of people frustrated and saying all sorts and coming up with all kinds of suggestions. Funnily enough, as the expert Jones doesn't seem to know what to do either. I certainly don't condone the abuse and many factors seem to have conspired against us this season, but I think Jones PR skills have been shocking to say that he's made some odd decisions. When even the more patient and level headed supporters become sick of a manager and dislike what they have to say I think it's better just to put everyone out of their misery and make a change, to get the fans back on side if anything else. We will see I suppose! Edited December 13, 2012 by Bluesteel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJMortimer Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 That's fair enough DJ, I misunderstood and thought you were commenting on fans more generally and the validity of their comments and opinions vs experts and managers etc. I think that although its laughable at times and I have done if too, its part of the game in a way, sometimes for the worse but also for the better. I think what you're saying about some fans having made up their minds to hate the manager and abuse is too much, i think its in a minority though. Given the extremity of the situation and how puzzling it is has a lot of people frustrated and saying all sorts and coming up with all kinds of suggestions. Funnily enough, as the expert Jones doesn't seem to know what to do either. I certainly don't condone the abuse and many factors seem to have conspired against us this season, but I think Jones PR skills have been shocking to say that he's made some odd decisions. When even the more patient and level headed supporters become sick of a manager and dislike what they have to say I think it's better just to put everyone out of their misery and make a change, to get the fans back on side if anything else. We will see I suppose! No problem. We were broadly agreeing with each other anyway. And although I have been somewhat defensive of Jones against the deluge of hysteria against him for the sake of a little balance there can be no doubt that he has made a great many mistakes and is doing himself few favours in interviews. Let's just hope that the situation is recoverable, whether it's him in charge or someone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelowl Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Talksport.....that was the end of this thread for me. Any station that allows that plank Darren Gough to talk about football should have their licence revoked. Agree with that used to like DG until i heard him on TS brain dead is harsh but fair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronio Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 we talk about our coaching, what about our scouting! Are they good enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scram Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 Maybe so, but it 'appeared' that Burton was highly regarded amongst his peers and many others actively involved in the game. I'm talking from a position of complete ignorance of course, so it would be useful to get a clearer indication of just how good TB was/is....if anyone knows owt But as DJ says - everybody in the game is "highly regarded" by everyone else in the game - name me one person who isn't? Burton went to Arsenal because the previous reserve team coach got promoted to the first team - without googling have you any idea who that obviously "highly regarded" guy is? After googling are you any the wiser apart from the name? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
since59owe Posted December 14, 2012 Share Posted December 14, 2012 So Dave Jones is maybe not so good at coaching. On all the evidence he's not very good at player recruitment either. So cany anybody please explain just what he is good at? NO ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now