So whose fault is it really?

[Mr Farrell]

Personally I believe you should look no further than Cooke/Hulley/Grierson.

Too early to judge Lee and Nick - though Lee MUST stop blaming fans for our position. Too early to judge Alan Irvine - though he has to stop being so bloody negative ALL the time.

The state of our club right now can only be blamed on the 3 guys who have been directors for 20 years (Cooke less admittedly)

That sums it up nicely for me.

[M Royds]

Where has he blamed supporters for our position? It's a simple question.

Stating that there would be more money available with more fans in the ground isn't blaming anyone, is pointing out a well known fact.

I think Sonny's on the money here. Paranoia and delusion.

Do you not recall the infamous interview, following the 5-0 win against Sflaphorpe? The presenter asked whether it was a praise or grumble. LS replied it was a grumble at the Wednesday fans for not turning out in numbers.

[Guest ak15]

1. Dave Richards and those involved with us building up our massive debts in the 90s have ALOT to answer for

2. Laws should have gone after the WBA game - 3 matches too late

3. poo poo FA Cup Draw against Palace - who knows, had we got one of the better draws (Villa, Man U, Liverpool etc) it could have provided some much-needed revenue to invest in January or in the loan market. We have desperately lacked a goalscorer this season and the 4000 fans at the game was a bad showing all round

4. Nothing wrong with the current chairman making statements on message boards, facebook, radio sheffield etc encouraging fans to get to the matches (and some fans have completely overreacted to this in a negative sense). In future LS should simply take care with his wording and avoid undercurrents of blame that some have picked up on. Regardless, that subject has been overexausted IMO

[Glaser]

Finance----those responsible for the debt.....the named ones still hanging on at the club instead of accepting responsibility and relinquishing any control of shares.....everything else is effect. Until we get rid of the root cause we won't be going anywhere..

* Glaser doesn't need to add his post !

[Weshallovercome]

Who was it again that had the club underperforming revenue wise by the tune of up to £5m pa?.........increasing the debt making selling our best players the only way we could balance the books?

*I could go on, but I've lost DJMs list. *

anyway, he's to blame.

[Weshallovercome]

Personally I believe you should look no further than Cooke/Hulley/Grierson.

Too early to judge Lee and Nick - though Lee MUST stop blaming fans for our position. Too early to judge Alan Irvine - though he has to stop being so bloody negative ALL the time.

The state of our club right now can only be blamed on the 3 guys who have been directors for 20 years (Cooke less admittedly)

Just out of interest, did Cooke/Hulley/Grierson all convince Dave that it might be a good idea to buy the charterhouse shares?.......I'm presuming they knew him beforehand.

If so, then you're right.........although we could go back as far as Richards and the Wilson appointment as the start of our demise, I'm guessing they were all on the board too.

[chilvinho]

Very sadly, barring some sort of miracle, our club is heading towards the third tier of English football yet again.

Having lived though the 1970s I believed that we would never let it happen again. But it did, in the 2000s. After that great day at Cardiff, when most of us went to hell and back before the final score, I was convinced that the club would never let it happen a third time.

On this site, there have been posts pointing the finger at most people - the players, previous managers, the current manager, previous chairmen and previous boards. Our current Chairman seems to be immune from this criticism although, if I read his comments on this site correctly, it would appear that its all our fault.

As I see it, the current position is this:-

• A poor team with many players performing well below their capability, in many cases much worse than last year.
• Manager turnover stabilised - following the sacking of Paul Sturrock, we have had Brian Laws for over 3 years, some of them quite good, then Alan Irvine
• Style of play has become very much long ball, % football, limited passing
• Much hype about improvements off the pitch, but limited evidence. For most supporters, the experience is little changed from the 1970s in terms of entry, food, toilets etc.
• Dave Allen - much castigated for his treatment of fans even though he did put his own money in, stepped down as Chairman and director
• 12 months with no Chairman
• New Chairman for 15 months - making it 'our club', but without money of his own to invest and currently not even a shareholder.
• Efforts to get crowd average above 25,000 and season ticket holders towards 18,000, so far very limited success
• Proposal to bring ground to 44,000 capacity for world cup, making it a learning centre and reverse sponshorship of shirts by Children's hospital
• Much anticipated financial investment still not happened even after more than 2 years of speculation
• Relegation looms
  So I think it really is time that we pointed that finger where it is deserved - who do you think it most to blame?

Interesting stand point. As you are a shareholder, you are entitled to comment on performance. As a matter of interest can you comment honestly on three points:

1. When you looked at the squad at the start of this campaign would you have predicted such abysmal on field performances leading to a disasterous outcome?

2. Given the opportunity to run the club differently, what are the headline changes you would have made (obviously the achievable changes here)?

3. The tone of your summary indicates that you want Strafford out, am I correct in this assumption? if so who do you see replacing him (either a name or a summary of the type of person).

[RobHowe]

If so, then you're right.........although we could go back as far as Richards and the Wilson appointment as the start of our demise, I'm guessing they were all on the board too.

Richards should carry the majority of the blame in my opinion.

But surely the rot started to set in with Pleat.

[Weshallovercome]

Richards should carry the majority of the blame in my opinion.

But surely the rot started to set in with Pleat.

True......or Dolleys leg

sorry

[latemodelchild]

I am sorry but Lee said he would change the culture at the club and they have now gone from just off the play offs to being relegation contenders. I did offer my services to Lee to help him change the culture of the club, but he refused them, he said he had it all in hand.

Change the culture and all the right decisions will be made.

The culture of the club has changed. What did you offer to do to help and how would it have stopped us geting dragged into a relegation battle this season?

A change in culture doesnt mean we'll instantly improve on the field. We are skint. We cant go into further debt to fund loans.Again, what would you have done different? What are you going to say to him in your letter and to what end?

[edmontonowl]

When AI came in our points target should have been enough to get us into the top half of the table, not just enough (52) to keep us in the division.

This set a negative tone where the urgency to get points was completely removed.

[enigmamedusa]

When AI came in our points target should have been enough to get us into the top half of the table, not just enough (52) to keep us in the division.

This set a negative tone where the urgency to get points was completely removed.

Targets have to be achievable if they are not going to be a negative factor.

He set quite a low target, he had obviously seen us play

[Guest carlg]

Personally I believe you should look no further than Cooke/Hulley/Grierson.

Too early to judge Lee and Nick - though Lee MUST stop blaming fans for our position. Too early to judge Alan Irvine - though he has to stop being so bloody negative ALL the time.

The state of our club right now can only be blamed on the 3 guys who have been directors for 20 years (Cooke less admittedly)

[dorian gray]

Very sadly, barring some sort of miracle, our club is heading towards the third tier of English football yet again.

Having lived though the 1970s I believed that we would never let it happen again. But it did, in the 2000s. After that great day at Cardiff, when most of us went to hell and back before the final score, I was convinced that the club would never let it happen a third time.

On this site, there have been posts pointing the finger at most people - the players, previous managers, the current manager, previous chairmen and previous boards. Our current Chairman seems to be immune from this criticism although, if I read his comments on this site correctly, it would appear that its all our fault.

As I see it, the current position is this:-

• A poor team with many players performing well below their capability, in many cases much worse than last year.
• Manager turnover stabilised - following the sacking of Paul Sturrock, we have had Brian Laws for over 3 years, some of them quite good, then Alan Irvine
• Style of play has become very much long ball, % football, limited passing
• Much hype about improvements off the pitch, but limited evidence. For most supporters, the experience is little changed from the 1970s in terms of entry, food, toilets etc.
• Dave Allen - much castigated for his treatment of fans even though he did put his own money in, stepped down as Chairman and director
• 12 months with no Chairman
• New Chairman for 15 months - making it 'our club', but without money of his own to invest and currently not even a shareholder.
• Efforts to get crowd average above 25,000 and season ticket holders towards 18,000, so far very limited success
• Proposal to bring ground to 44,000 capacity for world cup, making it a learning centre and reverse sponshorship of shirts by Children's hospital
• Much anticipated financial investment still not happened even after more than 2 years of speculation
• Relegation looms
  So I think it really is time that we pointed that finger where it is deserved - who do you think it most to blame?

there is no use passing a football to someone who can't control it, and a serious number of our players cannot control one, in recent weeks we've seen the midfield / crossfield ball on a number of occasions, i don't think i've seen one that hasn't been cut out or the reciever put under immense pressure because he hasn't controlled it. Arsenal have a footballing side, and they can afford one, but, they've won nothing, and everyone who knows anything about football knows how to stop them. We need to get the basics right first, we need FIt players, we need PASSIONATE players, we need players who want TO WEAR OUR SHIRT, they need to be FAST and STRONG...and when we get them, then we can talk about passing...the only thing on our present players minds should be AVOIDING RELEGATION, not passing a football, we will not learn them to do in a couple of days what they've failed to learn in 20 years...to control, pass, and MOVE...

Edited April 22, 2010 by dnhc

[Guest anstonowls]

I don't think it has helped our case with the "Hilsborough disaster". I think all that negative pr directed our way in the past, has had to have had some effect on us, by association.

[RobHowe]

I don't think it has helped our case with the "Hilsborough disaster". I think all that negative pr directed our way in the past, has had to have had some effect on us, by association.

I'm not sure that it has had that much of an impact to be honest.

Don't forget we had our most successful period of the previous 40 odd years straight off the back of it.

[George]

It's Strafford's fault. He is responsible for appointing a poor manager. Folk around here can blame Brian Laws until they are blue in the face but it wont make them anymore correct. Irvine was a poor appointment then and it has been proven by results over the months since.

Strafford can blame the fans all he likes. He'll especially blame fans like me who dare to question his methods. Doubtless he will, but the truth is that it is him who is running the club and making the decisions and the ironic twist is that the better off fans would probably be putting more of their hard earned in if they didn't keep getting insulted by him, I know I would.

[Guest oliver666]

Going back to the 70's when we were relegated into the old 3rd division, our players were rubbish and the club was in the red. Up stepped Jack Charlton, who not only turn the fortunes around on the pitch , but also the clubs finances. He brought in players either on free or nominal fees who he knew would and could turn the club round. A mixture of young and experience. The rest is history. The problem these days is that players are signed on a whim, no knowledge really about themselves except what they have seen or heard from the club they are coming from. There is no thought behind the transfer process as to what players we really need and will do a job for us, whether it be a short or long term signing. There is far too much emphasis on agents being involved with no real loyalty. Since the 90's we have made horror signings, some exceptionally good players but a background of an injury plagued careers. This hasn't happened just once but on too many occasions. Since then, no thought process has been given but a string of panic buys, loans etc.

We might, given the chance be a big fish in a small pond if relegation occurs. Neither are certain, but we have got to go back to basics as did big Jack back in the 70's. Stablase the clubs finances and bring in players who can do a job. This takes a shrewd manager and chairman. Do we have either. Time will tell.

[markowl]

It's Strafford's fault. He is responsible for appointing a poor manager. Folk around here can blame Brian Laws until they are blue in the face but it wont make them anymore correct. Irvine was a poor appointment then and it has been proven by results over the months since.

Strafford can blame the fans all he likes. He'll especially blame fans like me who dare to question his methods. Doubtless he will, but the truth is that it is him who is running the club and making the decisions and the ironic twist is that the better off fans would probably be putting more of their hard earned in if they didn't keep getting insulted by him, I know I would.

Well reasoned and thought out response

/sarcasm.

Of course all our problems have happened over the last 16 months, AI is the first poor managerial appointment we've had in this time and we've never had a Chairman insulting fans before have we?

[Guest anstonowls]

I'm not sure that it has had that much of an impact to be honest.

Don't forget we had our most successful period of the previous 40 odd years straight off the back of it.

I agree that we got promoted and won the Rumbelows cup the next season. But the relentless flow of negative press ever since has had to have had some effect on the club. The other week against United 36K was the maximum they would let into Hilsborough, when the capacity is 40K. We had 50K against United in 1980/81, without all this stupid segragation and very few arrests. To me there is a very dark cloud hanging over Hilsborough and partly because of the disaster, the rest due to poor management decisions at every level.