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I'm not sure about that really? I think that the FA and the other bodies and clubs are guessing at developing a footballer or nurturing talent! If there is/was a process then everyone would be doing the same method, but there not if you read what countries like Germany, Belgium and holland are doing in terms of technical development they are all different, because no one knows.

All that I understand is that the more you do something the better you get, its not by fluke that Beckham put his free kick in the top corner, or a golfer hits it straight down the middle of the fairway or a darts player averages over 90 its because they are dedicated people, who practice more than others and practice make permanent. how old was Messi when he started?, how old was Tiger Woods? There will always be late developers in any area that's just the way it is, but in my opinion starting young provides the best method.

just my opinion!

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Yes was this years U9s that beat them today who somebody said had lost best players to utd last year. /quote]

At under 7 and 8s I witnessed the endless attempts by our scouts to prize lads from utd. Wednesday supporters that preferred utds academy over there own. These boys are still at utd and after speaking to there dad's, their sons didn't play in this game. These lads are in utds Elite team. They Said that this game was a mixture of development and triallists. Hopefully your right and they are hiding for making a wrong decision last year. Either way, I'm glad that the positivety around middlwood rd has improved. We might actually create another full England international one day soon.

How embarrassed would you be really number one taking your lad to United when your a Wednesdayite and secondly taking your son to play for United against your team that your lad had the opportunity to play for and then watching him getting his arse slapped by the poor academy in your opinion? it must have been sickening for the poor man, I bet he's still blind drunk trying to console himself!!!

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Sure I heard that unless you have clocked up a certain amount of coached hours then the chances are you won't make the grade. Something like 40000 hrs that basically means if you aren't signed up and training 5 days a week before your ten, forget it.

I read that too I think its 10,000 hours there's a book that goes into the science of it, but the more I think about it its true its called competence training and experience in any walk of life!

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Guest s11 owl

I read that too I think its 10,000 hours there's a book that goes into the science of it, but the more I think about it its true its called competence training and experience in any walk of life!

that's the Neville level 

 

any natural football ability is coached out of you , also any enthusiaum in commentary, once retired is now dead

 

on the plus side a coaching job with the england set up is nailed on!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I read that too I think its 10,000 hours there's a book that goes into the science of it, but the more I think about it its true its called competence training and experience in any walk of life!

 

 

It's called The Talent Code

 

And it's wrong

 

I think the basic premise is that if anybody puts in 10,000 of hours of practice into any discipline then they will become experts

 

No academy player will clock up 10,000 hours of coaching - and then it depends hugely on the input - ie the quality of the coaching

 

The proof is that despite players joining clubs ever younger - and they have way, way more coaching than they ever did - we still don't produce better players than we did a generation ago

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Semedo's ferrett

I don't know who told you about this mystery elite squad for u9's but I guarentee you both clubs play there too guns in the derby games fact

I spoke to a senior member of the United staff and they were gutted how United 9's performed

The tide is slowly turning if only a little bit in our favour but we can't rest on our laurels

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The whole premise of academy football is to produce players for the 1st team - and/or good enough to sell for top money

 

Winning u9 matches by a cricket score is totally irrelevant

 

Although football is a team game - academy football is about rearing individuals

 

Very few players go the whole journey from u7/8/9/10 whatever, into the 1st team

 

So there is a vast amount of water to flow under the bridge before getting excited about the young players

 

And now with the EPPP the chances of hanging on to REAL talent is getting ever more remote

 

I just wish we *in England) could get our act together with academy football and make it work so we produce high quality players generally - so clubs wouldn't need to keep looking abroad for their players

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It's called The Talent Code

 

And it's wrong

 

I think the basic premise is that if anybody puts in 10,000 of hours of practice into any discipline then they will become experts

 

No academy player will clock up 10,000 hours of coaching - and then it depends hugely on the input - ie the quality of the coaching

 

The proof is that despite players joining clubs ever younger - and they have way, way more coaching than they ever did - we still don't produce better players than we did a generation ago

dint work on my golf game thats for sure .......
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maybe if clubs gave a little longer in trial times to young players it may produce the gems we all hope for ,mylad got 7 days at villa and received an offer with a proviso , at Hillsborough he got twenty five minuits and ws injured , after that nothing ,

now the foreigners at villa got a fortnight to prove their worth , if that's the norm then how are we supposed to find English gems and it makes it so much harder if the lad is a late starter

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Wednesdayite at work has let his 8 year old son sign for United

 

Apparantly the kid is knocking goals in left, right and centre

 

He says United's academy is still miles better than ours.

 

It's not something I could do, my grandfather would turn in his grave if I let my son turn out in a pig shirt

 

The boys name is Hague.

Just a bloke, who used up all his luck in one go when he met his wife.

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scram,

 

Whilst i agree with most of what your saying, i have a few questions/points.

 

1/ Winning matches at any age group IS important. The confidence gained from being part of a winning team is closely linked to improving a skill, if taught correctly.

 

2/ Your right, very few players go under XXX year group to the first team. However, a high percentage of players that play as adults start of as part of a under XXX age group.

 

3/ I disagree with EPPP completely, however hanging on to talent has always been a problem. Looking at Man U (the gigs, scholes, beckham age) and say Southampton now, a massive percentage of young players were picked up from other clubs. Do you think the players Southampton/man u poached would have made the impact they did had they stayed with the original clubs?

 

4/ With regards to 'getting our act together.' Is the problem more of a case of not having the right culture/coaches between the under XXX and the first team rather than completely the youth coaches fault?

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How many of these players will actually make it at any level? As a teacher I have seen countless young lads over the years who have signed for Professional Clubs. They all get massive egos and their parents are unbearable, often expecting you to build entire school teams around them, sunmitting to their every whim, and not realising that school football is about giving a positive experience to as many young lads and lasses as possible.

Yet for all the young signees I have seen, non of them have made it at any level. The best I've seen is one lad who made the Subs bench at Doncaster a couple of seasons back. Then he got released and went to Stocksbridge and he couldn't even make an impact there.

My point is, wouldn't clubs be better off concentrating on quality, not quantity. Instead of every club having a squad for every year group and having hundreds of players on their books, why not have just a handful of age groups that players from various ages can play for. If nothing else, it will stop so many young lads believing they are going to make it, giving up any anything else, and putting all their eggs in one basket when they are statistically very unlikely to succeed.

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^^^^ I agree with this it talks a lot of sense and Germany football has based it around playing their elite at differing ages groups (e.g if you have a good player at 7/8 push him into an age group or group that he can cope with and reverse that if they have a technical player that is 10/11 but not quite physically able play then in a group that will develop them).

Paul Scholes apparently played three age groups down because when younger he didn't have his biological stature for his age, but he had great technical ability. When he got to 14 he started to catch up and learnt the hustle and bustle part of the game (prob why he couldn't tackle).

I watch a lot of Sunday football and see some parents kicking every ball for their sons/daughters and the expectation levels are massive and ruins the talent more than any coach or academy can do!

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scram,

 

Whilst i agree with most of what your saying, i have a few questions/points.

 

1/ Winning matches at any age group IS important. The confidence gained from being part of a winning team is closely linked to improving a skill, if taught correctly.

 

2/ Your right, very few players go under XXX year group to the first team. However, a high percentage of players that play as adults start of as part of a under XXX age group.

 

3/ I disagree with EPPP completely, however hanging on to talent has always been a problem. Looking at Man U (the gigs, scholes, beckham age) and say Southampton now, a MASSIVE percentage of young players were picked up from other clubs. Do you think the players Southampton/man u poached would have made the impact they did had they stayed with the original clubs?

 

4/ With regards to 'getting our act together.' Is the problem more of a case of not having the right culture/coaches between the under XXX and the first team rather than completely the youth coaches fault?

 

 

1, Don't agree that winning matches at u11 (whatever) is important. It just isn't. It's not about the mythical "creating a winning mentality" - it's about creating a conducive learning environment for talent to flourish.

Lots of kids at those ages don't even remember the score - their emphasis is on enjoyment and that fosters the urge to keep training and playing.

Kids may be in winning teams but if they don't enjoy it they won't stick at it - simple as that.

Also the focus needed to be taken away from "winning is everything" because it is really very simple to win games of youth football - the big, strong kids win

Also winning doesn't enhance skill acquisition - correct and engaged practice does.

 

2, Of course most adults who play at any level get their lifelong love for the game by playing at an early age. But that doesn't need to be in an u7 team whose focus is on winning rather than development

 

3, Hanging onto talent was much less a problem when clubs were getting paid £10m for a promising 17 year old. Now all a club has to to is offer (for them) some spare change out of the petty cash and they can take any of our players if the player agrees to the move. We cannot set the fee and make it either prohibitive and/or a great windfall if he moves on. It is really very simple for clubs to prey on the gifted products of other acadamies

 

4, It's the whole coaching culture in this country, Our coach and player development is utterly embarrassing. It's jobs-for-the-boys and we end up with wholly unsuited coaches parachuted into positions they have doen nothing to deserve.

Anyone can do the basic coaching courses but it doesn't really help people become better at helping kids to become better - because the system is crap.

A really good grass roots coach should have their ambition as getting as many kids as they can into professional clubs.

instead they want to win leagues and plastic baubles to stick in their livivng room then brag about what a great coach they are by getting their team of 6ft 11 year olds winning 35-0 every week

 

We are hopeless at producing player and have been pretty much such the outrageously rubbish academy system was dreamt up

 

We must be the only country in the world who could possibly completely revamp facilities, resources and amount of players while hugely increasing spening - yet get bloody worse!

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Wednesdayite at work has let his 8 year old son sign for United

 

Apparantly the kid is knocking goals in left, right and centre

 

He says United's academy is still miles better than ours.

 

It's not something I could do, my grandfather would turn in his grave if I let my son turn out in a pig shirt

 

The boys name is Hague.

Something else a takeover needs to put right a better academy at least on a par with uniteds  there are some talented young lads out  there at the end of the day you want what is best for your son.

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A good acadamy re Southampton derby Middlesboro is worth it's weight in gold. Ours has been neglected or non existent for aslong as I can remember.

Over the last 2/3 years a lot of work and improvements are going on. We can quote all the stats and negativity we want but the only time we will really know is in 5/6 years time wether it produces the results we hope.

But definite positive things going on and to be honest most of the people being negative should go down and have a look before they make their judgements.

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A good acadamy re Southampton derby Middlesboro is worth it's weight in gold. Ours has been neglected or non existent for aslong as I can remember.

Over the last 2/3 years a lot of work and improvements are going on. We can quote all the stats and negativity we want but the only time we will really know is in 5/6 years time wether it produces the results we hope.

But definite positive things going on and to be honest most of the people being negative should go down and have a look before they make their judgements.

well put my friend
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Semedo's ferrett

I don't know who told you about this mystery elite squad for u9's but I guarentee you both clubs play there too guns in the derby games fact

I spoke to a senior member of the United staff and they were gutted how United 9's performed

He's baffled cos says that the only game they played v wednesday was a twelve lunch time ko last weds and they drew 2-2 then lost 7-1. His lad and few others didn't play cos they'd played 3 games in 3 days and we're mixing things up. Said he doesn't regret taking his lad to utd cos wednesdays u9's were very physical and very direct. Said they werent encouraged to play from the back. Might be sour grapes but he's not usually like that.
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